Confirmation of Bacon King as Justice (Debating)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Mr. Kingman,


On October 25th, you cast a vote in the Northeast Regional Election in favor of the region seceding. You also voted for a slate of candidates who likewise supported secession. Was this vote an "informed" decision on your part?

Assuming it is, why do you now seek to be a Justice who will fairly interpret the laws for all Atlasians, when less than two weeks ago you were voting to remove your region and by extension yourself from the union?

And remember, both myself, another Senator and the incoming President were present in the IRC chat room where you "discussed" your vote ahead of time and afterwards.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

First off, not one damn message has been sent by me or anyone else that I know of making mention of BK's personal life. Especially, after the dreadful treatment I received during the worst year of my life, by the some of the esteemed troll players in this thread, I would not ever go to that length.

Every matter that has been discussed has dealt with BK's competence to serve as an effective and independent Justice. I would invite those who insist on lying about this, to accept my invitation to (TOS Compliance Censor).

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

There's also the obvious fact that we're clearly going to do away with life terms in the ConCon so cool your jets, folks.

What more do you expect from these clowns???

 Since they have gotten their behinds handed to them on every issue of substance ever since they joined the game ten-odd years ago, they are now impugning the character of one of our most respected public servants. What a JOKE!!!

LOL!

I've heard some absurd claims over the course of the last four months, but this one takes the cake. You do realize that Cris has been playing this game for roughly two years and I only joined in January, whereas yourself and Oakvale have been playing for a combined 8 years?

Nobody here is "smearing" Bacon King's character, but I'm not sure why you'd care if they were: if your actions over the last four months are any indication, you like nothing better than to spread falsehoods and libelous rumors about the people you dislike.

It is especially galling considering the smeers and lies that were sent out by Oakfail's machine in his futile attempt to destroy me as a force in this game. Some people have been very naughty and they are lucky I am nice guy to not make that public. This socialist is going to nationalize his power, and shut it off.

There's also the obvious fact that we're clearly going to do away with life terms in the ConCon so cool your jets, folks.

What more do you expect from these clowns???

 Since they have gotten their behinds handed to them on every issue of substance ever since they joined the game ten-odd years ago, they are now impugning the character of one of our most respected public servants. What a JOKE!!!

How is that partisan Senate adminstration working for ya! Oh wait... Or that all At-Large Senate, the left and their troll player allies promised us back in 2009. Or the districts some of the same people said were needed  because At-Large now apparently sucks. And of course there is that little matter of secession, The many attempts to destroy and abolish regions, etc etc.

The courtyard is littered with my prostrate victims and you have the nerve to call me a loser. I have been kicking @%@ for a hell of a long time on a range of issues. What item of substance have you ever won on? You have three times been on the losing side of an issue I won on. You cannot say the same about me.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

The McCarthy trio in the Senate does nothing to surprise me anymore. This nominee is among the most qualified in history, and speaks to that experience rather eloquently. I have no questions and will vote for him as promptly as this witch hunt is called to a vote.

Just like Al.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

There's also the obvious fact that we're clearly going to do away with life terms in the ConCon so cool your jets, folks.

That would be a dreadful error on the part of the Con-Con.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Several people have come forward to inform me that you have been privately sharing an edited IRC transcript in an attempted character assassination, failing to provide any semblance of an accurate contact.

Everything I have discussed with my colleagues is stuff you have said, and if you lose confirmation, it will be your own words that hanged you, Mr. Kingman.

On October 25th, you cast a vote in the Northeast Regional Election in favor of the region seceding. You also voted for a slate of candidates who likewise supported secession. Was this vote an "informed" decision on your part?

No, to be perfectly honest with you it was not an informed decision in the slightest.

For several years now, whenever I am faced with a ballot where I have no strong opinion on how to vote (which, to be clear, is a rare occurrence), I'll log in to IRC and take the first good suggestion someone in the chat gives me - I did so for both the Federal and Regional elections in this most recent election. I believe Adam Griffin personally told me to vote for him, and I think it was Talleyrand who told me how to vote in the Northeast but I'm not entirely certain on that because several other were saying the same thing as Talleyrand at the same time.

I recall that you were in chat at the time, and I would have probably taken your suggestion if you spoke first, because I trust your judgement, and I recall at least two times in the past when I did vote by your suggestion when I asked in IRC.

Adam Griffin asked you to vote for Blair. I figured if anyone had a chance of swaying you it would be Griffin. Also, it seemed clear that you were only interested in one person's opinion, as you mentioned Talleyrand by name when asking how to vote and you ignored (in your own words), a long time political ally and fellow Georgian, and voted down the line for the pro-secession slate recommended.

Let me correct the record now - yes it's unorthodox but it's no different than the dozens of voters you and other candidates PM every election. If they trust your judgement, they listen to your electoral recommendations. The only difference with me is that I'm proactive enough to openly solicit requests for campaign materials, in an effort to make a semi-informed decision, even if it is just by proxy.

I found what I saw in #Atlasforum sickening. From people asking the notorious echo chamber how to vote, to outright lying about results to get someone to vote. 

If it were a vote on assembly and you didn't know the latest count, then I can understand asking a trusted ally how best to vote to achieve the desired results. But this is different, because NE Secession was perhaps the most important vote in Atlasian history, or at least in the last several years. And contrary to your dimissive reaction to the concerns, it was hardly an open and shut case and likely would have gone to the Supreme Court as to whether or not secession is legal, and hence why this matters.

Also ftr, I am notoriously lame with GOTV messaging, primarily because I don't feel comfortable telling people how to vote. They read more like campaign ads. And when I have convinced people in IRC, which is rare because I find it sickening most of the time, it is always conditional. "Well if you want this, then you probably want to vote for X". Naturally, I stood no chance of convincing you of the merits of opposing secession, when your radical friends were shouting out spoon fed votes left and right to anything with a pulse.

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Regarding "secession": you and I both know that even if that vote had passed, absolutely nothing would have come of it.

Actually, I didn't know that, because with one justice an avowed secessionist and another who is well notorious for doing some really crazy things at times, I couldn't be sure of anything.

One thing I do want to make clear, though, is that in all my years of assorted shenanigans I have not once ever done anything of the sort when I held office. When I swear an oath to the Atlasian people to faithfully execute the responsibilities of my office, to preserve and protect and defend the Constitution, I take that oath completely seriously. For example, when I was Pacific Justice I single-handedly saved the Pacific region from collapse via critical activity failures, when I could have easily done nothing and let it die (or, if I was the irresponsible troll you're clearly claiming I am, I could have passed a verdict that would have screwed everything up even worse). Instead of doing that, though, I took my sworn responsibility seriously, and I faithfully executed the powers of my office to protect and preserve Constitional law in the Pacific at a time when a single blow would have ended it.

Is it not true that why you authored the infamous Fourth and Final Constitutions of the Pacific (which were struck down by the Supreme Court unanimously)? Was that done in the same vein of "little Shenanigans"?

I apologize for such an extensive tangent into my personal life, but I feel it was necessary in order to put the "BACON KING IS INACTIVE" meme to rest once and for all. I know that objection has been raised elsewhere and I think it's appropriate to clarify why activity has been a problem in the past, and why it won't be one now. I'll be an active Justice, and I can say that with certainty.

I am glad you are doing better and as you will recall, I supported you 100% back in July and thought that although you made mistakes, the treatment you received was outrageous, especially initially. #FreetheDeleGAtion!!!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

So, Cris, if someone on IRC had told him to vote for you and he had, would you be striking the same tone? I am totally lost here. You are grasping at straws for any excuse to vote against Mr. Kingman and it's pathetic!!!

Also, apparently the latest argument from opponents of this nomination is that a Justice shouldn't know too much about the law, because then they will abuse it!!! What an IDIOTIC suggestion.

And yet BK has used his knowledge to abuse the law. 95% of the time, it has been a positive. However, he used his knowledge of the law to skirt expulsion once and a second time stated point blank that he could have done so again and how, but proceeded to resign as opposed to causing controversy.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I sent some messages last night but after a rough day of work, I decided to spend it decompressing and catching up on sleep than dealing with this bullcrap.

First Off: I am not the most aggressive opponent of this nomination. Others have pushed me to go farther and I have said no.

Second of all, I have never cited the fact that bore made the appointment as an issure in and off itself precisely because I am very mindful of the fact that Tmth made the two appointments. I remember it clearly, because it was suppose to be Junkie on the court.

My only concern throughout this has been the support for secession. I don't care that BK asked for advise on how to vote in an Assembly or frankly even a Governor's race and then come back and say, "I voted on no information at all". To take advise to vote for secession and then come back and say, "I voted on no information at all" was basically the deal breaker for me. The legality is at best an open question, and with all the crap that has happened in this game so far this year, to trust to chance that a vote will be meaningless, a vote that most regarded as one of the most important in years, seemed to me to be a case of bad judgement.

I want to save this game, I want this game to be reformed and survive. However, it was made point blank to us in the Summer that there is a significant group that wants this game to die. They can deny it and hide it now all the want with all the plagiarized lines Donald ever "Trumped out", but it doesn't change what is the truth. If there is no trust towards that group it is because, they have earned their distrust with a long string of lies and deceit. It is that group's reputation that cost you the nomination BK, regardless of it being the secession vote or the appointment timing issue as a point of concern, it comes back to that central point.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

What a truly ignominious spectacle this has been!

The Senate has seen fit to prevent one of the most qualified legal minds in the history of Atlasia from taking a seat on the Supreme Court at a time of record inactivity and inability to fill government positions.  Now, the President has stated that he is in no hurry to fill this seat, and so the Senate, by its actions here today, has neutered the highest court in the land and destroyed the career of one of our most respected statesmen.  

What action? The Senate did nothing here but press legitimate concerns, which is its damn job, Barnes and the nominee withdrew before a vote was held. Whenever the Senate has abdicated that responsibility, like with Al, like with Keystone Phil, both of them long time players with a lot of experience, as well as a long history of trolling the game, the end result was disaster.

You guys seem to want a popularity contest where you vote a guy in regardless of his answers to the questions, because he happens to be in the right clique. And Winfield bashes us for being a corrupt establishment, I will say he is pointing his finger in the wrong direction. I didn't run for the Senate to continue the corrupt and stupid practices that gave us AG Keystone Phil and Game Moderator Ebowed (who did nothing for like six months) and just six months ago gave us Attorney General Al. These confirmation hearings are not so that you can just rubber stamp your friends into office, they are here to hold the executive branch accountable.

Edit: And from reading the President, his slower pace in picking a replacement is motivated by a desire to way all the pros and cons of a potential Justice and try to navigate the bitter divide in this chamber right now between those who want a rubber stamp and those who want accountability.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

There were no legitimate concerns raised by this body, only McCarthy-ite questions of affiliation. This was a disgraceful showing from the Senate, while the greatest legal mind in our history is given this treatment, a literal criminal is being given the pass from much of the Senate for the biggest foreign policy role in the country.

I voted to impeach a real f@$king attorney from the Supreme Court for inactivity. I don't give two sh..ts about qualifications when you are voting to dismantle gov't in which you are seeking a post. It's called an overriding concern. Learn it, Maxy Baby!

The real joke caucus are the trolls who lied their way in on promises of radical change and impersonations of a real life blowhard merely so they can advance their extreme dissolutionist agenda and sabotage the saving of this game.

It is not Hamilton on steriods, it is Keystone Phil on steriods. "I have had my fill so I am just going to go stir sh..t up and screw anyone who might still be interested in playing".

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Your whole friends caucus vs. accountability caucus is cute and sounds nice, but it's total bullsh**t. You have not put the other nominees under similar scrutiny, even as their records of accomplishment are far more questionable. And both of the candidates, Classic Conservative, a criminal, and Rpryor, certainly fall more under "Friends of Thurmond" than not. You are being totally dishonest.

Not surprising considering you've been a part of this body for nearly a decade.

Are they not presently being questioned? They are!
Have these concerned not already been raised? They have!
Are these posts as critical as a Supreme Court Justice? No. GMs can be ignored, SoS can be fired.
Have I not asked important questions in both threads? I have!
Do I have them on record voting for secession, and then posting questionable comentaries on the matter? No
Do they have activity issues? Yes and that is being raised!
Have I repeatedly expressed my desire to vote for them before the questioning has even started, like some people love to do? No!

More lies and deceit from the usual sources. Not surprising from the guy who has been in a nasty divorce from the truth for two years.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

More lies and deceit from the usual sources. Not surprising from the guy who has been in a nasty divorce from the truth for two years.

This clown really needs to shut his trap!!! The poor man digs his own grave further whenever he opens his mouth and spouts out more incoherent garbage.

The truth will not be silenced!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

While I'm sure we all want to hear "the truth", I highly doubt any of it is going to manifest here. Cris ought to go ahead and lock this trainwreck and stop giving the trolls any more free air-time than they're going to get otherwise.

So this is the first act of the new President, to silence debate and discussion.

Well, I can see this is going to be a disaster of a Presidency.

Hear hear. It appears that Winfield is one of the few people in this country with his head screwed on straight. The right has taken sides with our greatest enemy and the only opposition are a bunch of populist nihilistic trolls. We need consistent opposition to Griffin (Public Enemy Number Two, Public Enemy Number One of course being TNF), populism, dissolutionism, and hyperlegalism.

Where is Foucaulf's radio station when you need it?

Foucaulf would be in with the trolls Simmy.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Many good people have become trollish. Sadly, many other good people-- including much of the great TPP-- have given the backing the enemy. We need a strong right-wing reformist alternate to not only oppose the regime, but to resist it, after my undemocratic removal in a coup d'etat blatantly carried out by the regime before it even entered office.

You hanged yourself Simfan. You were perfectly secure and all you had to do was open election booths on time and you would still be rulling the region with an iron fist. Instead, you choose to basically give your opponents a knife with which to thrust into you and basically handed your region over to the dissolutionists on a silver platter. You have no right to lecture me on consistent opposition to Labor, dissolutionists et al, anymore then your TPP friends had the right to claim I was socialist for opposing power monopolies.

Your hatred of Libertarians and their mutual hatred of you, handed a Senate seat back to Labor. That is your fault. I did everything I could to prevent Labor from holding that seat in March 2014, but you and Deus thwarted me. In February when I had just Lumine and August with Spiral, I managed to push both over the line and made sure in the latter that JCL's bid (Which I voted for), didn't inadvertently hand Labor a seat do to lack of second prefing. I was the only one consistently working to stop Labor, stop Griffin, and stop TNF for the last six months of 2013 and all of 2014. For this my reward was a stab in the back by hyprocrits inconsistent in their opposition, who had the audacity to claim I was too pro-Labor, many of which were/are your damn allies. Where the hell was your consistent opposition in 2014, Simfan?   

What you want is consistent opposition to anything and everything that is not 100% like you are, but you are probably the most unique snowflake in this game, which basically means you are asking for perpetual defeat and disappointment. Rather like a latter day RowanBrandon. Right now, the major divide is between those who want to reform the game and those who want to destroy it. Adam Griffin is a lot of things, but one thing I can guarrantee, he will save this game or die trying. So yes, I will work with Griffin on that front, just like I worked with Napoleon and Opebo to thwart the Rimjobbers and their allies in their quest to politicize the Supreme Court. You cannot win in this game by cornering yourself into your own little niche and nothing else.

Hear hear. It appears that Winfield is one of the few people in this country with his head screwed on straight. The right has taken sides with our greatest enemy and the only opposition are a bunch of populist nihilistic trolls. We need consistent opposition to Griffin (Public Enemy Number Two, Public Enemy Number One of course being TNF), populism, dissolutionism, and hyperlegalism.

You cite as public enemy number one a deregistered dissolutionist and number two a reformist President. This is why you have always ended up rendering yourself politically impotent and why you lost to Alfred Jones. TNF and Adam Griffin parted ways in June and Labor led the effort to recall him when he joined the dissolutionist cause. Your strategy here would very likely put a dissolutionist in the White House by way of destroying and undermining a reformist administration, and hyperlegalism is a IRC narrative started about 2013ish around trying to blame me for destroying the game. We just voted to do a legislative restart, legalism is a not concern for anyone but the trolls.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I handed a seat over to Labor by running in an election which I would have won had it not been stolen? Adam singlehandedly stole that election. I was right there alongside those who fought and sacrifice to bring DemPGH's disastrous tenure to an end. That's where I was.

It is not sufficient to support reform. It is necessary to oppose the left, or, more specifically, the most malevolent forces of the left. There are a few good people on the left (such as Bacon King). But there are many bad ones, they shall always remain the enemy, regardless of their position on "reform". This is not a "special snowflake" viewpoint.

Yes and he got away with it, because so many of your voters didn't second preference Deus. If they had, he never would have been able to throw so many Laborites to Deus in order to knock you out of the final round, without risking Deus winning. That was my point, you let him utilize your anti-libertarianism to retain a seat for his party, a seat we would have won otherwise.

I find the most malevolent force in the game right now is those who are trying to destroy it. primary battle right now is saving this game. I voted for Cris, I did everything I could to turn people out for him, but he lost. Right now, with the situation as it is and that election over with, I would rather have a pro-reform a-hole then a nice radical dissolutionist. I like BK a lot, I probably like him more then Griffin, but I am not going to be blinded by last years battle to detriment of the present fight. 

Again, you really need to prioritize better, Simfan.  

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

None of this would have happened had your people not betrayed Cris. Spineless chitterlings pretending to be on the "right" betrayed Cris and gave us this terrible regime which now so imperils us all.

My people?  You're insane! I voted for Cris and did GOTV for him. His own Party was less unified behind him then the Federalists. 95% of Federalists that voted, voted for Cris. We gave him a higher percentage than any other group, even outmatching his own 10 member Party by 25% damn percent.

ANUS: 100/0
CR: 29/71
D-R: 40/60
FED: 5/95
IND: 29/64
LAB: 100/0
NNP: 75/0
OTH: 64/14
TPP: 88/12

Some of those CR defectors were in your region:
SUPPORT BY REGION:

ME: 54/42
MW: 50/40
NE: 59/33
PA: 57/43
SO: 43/50

Lumine won 67% at the same time Griffin was winning 57% with the same voters. You tell me what happened, as the Conservative Governor of the Pacific. What kind of ship were you running?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

And you want to talk about defections from Cris. How about your homeboy Foucaulf voting for Bacon King over Cris, casting the deciding vote reducing the right down to three seats, after which Bacon King then proceeded to vote to overide Lumine's veto on TNF bills.

How did you vote in that election again? Did you even vote?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Deus was an unreliable supporter of our agenda. When he got into office he did little to stop the expansion of TNFism but much to further their agenda of social degeneracy. Neither you nor I could have trusted him to do the right thing. His candidacy would have not gotten anywhere, anyway, if not for Labor's election rigging.

That is not the point. The point is, Griffin boosted him to the second round because enough of your people failed to second preference him therefore he realized Alfred could beat him and not you. He thus sent a string of Laborites to Deus to screw you over, just enough to put him in the final but one shy of beating Alfred. Had you maintained aa higher level of second preference unity tp the tune of just a handful of votes, you would have remained ahead of Deus and Griffin couldn't have taken that move unless he was deciding to elect Deus over you. Either way, Labor would have suffered a net loss of a Senate seat and you likely would have come out on top.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

And you want to talk about defections from Cris. How about your homeboy Foucaulf voting for Bacon King over Cris, casting the deciding vote reducing the right down to three seats, after which Bacon King then proceeded to vote to overide Lumine's veto on TNF bills.

How did you vote in that election again? Did you even vote?

What election was this? December at-Large?

If we're talking elections let's talk about March Special. By allowing the perpetually unelectable JCL to run you divided the right, pushed out Foucaulf, and gave a seat to... Adam Griffin, since he faced JCL... who is, as I said, perpetually unelectable.

No, in November 2014 Lumine took office as President and his At-Large seat went to a special election. Bacon King beat Cris by 1 vote with Foucaulf and Riley the only Federalists to defect. Losing Lumine's seat reduced the right to just three Senate seats (Deus, JCL and myself) and the LAbor-TPP Senators voted together on overiding Lumine's vetos on bills like the one by TNF that reduced the work week to 32 hours.

Lets talk about March, another case study in pissing away a Senate seat with stupidity. Foucaulf had been attacking us for six months, launched a Supreme Court case to legalize abortion, and had reduced the right down to just three Senate seats, empowering TNF's socialism. Meanwhile TPP had handed the keys to the White House back to Labor (look how that turned out) and prioritized destroying us to destroying Griffin's machine. Consistent opposition? Right! And with the TPP's other Senators voting with Labor anyway, giving Labor an actual sixth seat made little difference to the balance of power in an 8-2 Liberal Senate. So we put on a display of unity behind one of our most controversial candidates to show we could pull that off still and began to plan for April and June.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I agree with Winfield. For the third time in six months, a member of this chamber has tried to carve out a group of non-something who the Senate can ignore. First it was non-members, now it is the deregistered.

I was elected to represent all the people of this nation and therefore I shall demand the preservation of the openness of this chamber and the ability of non-members to speak their piece.

Edit: Appears Winfield deleted his post.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

So Simfan is upset that he's finally facing the results of his actions? Only an extreme dissolutionist WOULDN'T bother to put that notorious criminal away.

I have known Simfan since his days in, that Party I am not suppose to mention but f... it, RPP, and I must say his worst enemy time and again has usually been himself.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Simfan called me out for betraying something and now refers to the administration I'm serving with as failed yet he isn't even a registered voter? What on earth did I do to him?

I guess it doesn't matter. It seems like the new norm is disliking people for no reason.

I guess that is the price we pay for not having a Hamilton/Napoleon around for everyone to focus their hate on so they can love everybody else.