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  Gubernatorial/State Elections (Moderators: Brittain33, Gass3268, Virginiá)
  Judge Rules Gregoire Won
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Author Topic: Judge Rules Gregoire Won  (Read 2601 times)
Alcon
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« on: June 06, 2005, 02:38:25 pm »

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Full link: http://www.komotv.com/stories/37241.htm
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The Duke
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« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2005, 02:41:33 pm »

This is the civically responsible decisions, but let's not pretend its based on the merits of the case.  The judge has declared Gregoire the winner because doing anything else (Like declaring her illegitimate or demanding a new election)would tragically damage the state government.
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J. J.
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« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2005, 02:43:34 pm »

That sounds vaguely familiar.

No, can Washington state initiate reforms to keep the kind of errors from happening again.
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Alcon
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« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2005, 03:13:17 pm »

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More: http://www.komotv.com/stories/37251.htm
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Jake
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« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2005, 05:17:43 pm »

Dino Rossi needs to take one for the team and shut the hell up. He already screwed himself for a future run, now he's acting like a total jackass and damaging the WA GOP.
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The Duke
JohnD.Ford
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« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2005, 05:24:37 pm »

Dino Rossi needs to take one for the team and shut the hell up. He already screwed himself for a future run, now he's acting like a total jackass and damaging the WA GOP.
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bgwah
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« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2005, 07:48:22 pm »

Rossi won't appeal.

It's over.
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Alcon
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« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2005, 09:29:28 pm »

Rossi, indeed, will not appeal:

http://www.komotv.com/stories/37241.htm
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CARLHAYDEN
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« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2005, 09:34:48 pm »

That sounds vaguely familiar.

No, can Washington state initiate reforms to keep the kind of errors from happening again.

NO!

Logan just got carte blanche to steal elections.
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J. J.
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« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2005, 10:18:56 pm »

That sounds vaguely familiar.

No, can Washington state initiate reforms to keep the kind of errors from happening again.

NO!

Logan just got carte blanche to steal elections.

I believe this speaks volumes:

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You have should that there are obvious problems with the vote tally; you have not shown that if this was done correctly, Rossi would have won.  You never have.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2005, 10:23:52 pm »


I think all states for all important elections should just have an automatic revote whenever the result is within, say, 0.1%. 

They could just revote a month later.  It's not like you really need two months to change governments....in most major countries, power changes hands the day after the election.  And that way you'd have some closure and not months of court battles.  It would have been a much better way to settle this dispute, as well as Florida in 2000.
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J. J.
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« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2005, 10:29:58 pm »


I think all states for all important elections should just have an automatic revote whenever the result is within, say, 0.1%. 

They could just revote a month later.  It's not like you really need two months to change governments....in most major countries, power changes hands the day after the election.  And that way you'd have some closure and not months of court battles.  It would have been a much better way to settle this dispute, as well as Florida in 2000.

While I'd favor an automatic recount in such cases, I would not favor a revote.  Some elections are just close and you could see the "re-vote" being just as close.
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CARLHAYDEN
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« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2005, 11:10:42 pm »

That sounds vaguely familiar.

No, can Washington state initiate reforms to keep the kind of errors from happening again.

NO!

Logan just got carte blanche to steal elections.

I believe this speaks volumes:

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You have should that there are obvious problems with the vote tally; you have not shown that if this was done correctly, Rossi would have won.  You never have.

Will any of the persons who voted illegally be prosecuted?

The mere fact that far more illegal votes, not to mention the numerous other problems (multiple voting, votes cast by the dead, more votes counted than voters in some precinct, multiple voting, failure to count legitimate votes, etc.) were far more than the margin of 'victory,' should be the basis for a new election.
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J. J.
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« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2005, 11:21:24 pm »



Will any of the persons who voted illegally be prosecuted?

Some of this is intent; I'm reasonably sure that in some cases the persons thought that they legally could vote.  We've discussed the "covicted felon issue."

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No, that "fact" has not been established.  As pointed out the deceased vote was small, and would not have, in itself, changed the result.  Last time I checked, three were found.  As for multiple votive, where is the evidence that enough people voted twice to affect the result?  It suure wasn't presented in court!  Likewise, while more ballots were found, what was the breakdown, were they all Rossi votes?

As I've said from the start present evidence and I'll change my opinion.
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CARLHAYDEN
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« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2005, 11:34:33 pm »



Will any of the persons who voted illegally be prosecuted?

Some of this is intent; I'm reasonably sure that in some cases the persons thought that they legally could vote.  We've discussed the "covicted felon issue."

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No, that "fact" has not been established.  As pointed out the deceased vote was small, and would not have, in itself, changed the result.  Last time I checked, three were found.  As for multiple votive, where is the evidence that enough people voted twice to affect the result?  It suure wasn't presented in court!  Likewise, while more ballots were found, what was the breakdown, were they all Rossi votes?

As I've said from the start present evidence and I'll change my opinion.

Let me cite another case with just about the same results:

As Robert Caro wonderfully recounts the story in Means of Ascent, in 1948, Johnson was trailing six days after the election, and seemed certain to lose, when a protégé of George Parr, the “Duke of Duval” and political boss of the heavily Hispanic counties in southern Texas, “discovered” 200 allegedly uncounted ballots in Box 13, Alice, Texas. These 200 “voters” cast their ballots 198 to 2 for Johnson, putting him over the top. The election, of course, was stolen: the added 200 names were written in a different colored ink, and Stevenson’s attorneys tracked down the final name on the original voter list, who affirmed that he had voted just as the polls were closing.

Johnson got a pet judge to order his nomination certified.

Decades latter, it was acknowledged that the election was stolen.

Perhaps in a few decades we will have a confession about this election being stolen.

But, NO amount of evidence would ever convince JJ.

Oh, and by the way, I notice you do NOT want persons who voted illegally to be prosecuted.  I do!
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December's tragic drive
BRTD
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« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2005, 11:48:46 pm »

Last time I checked, Democrats typically don't argue with Republicans insisting that a Democrat stole the election. If a person continues to believe that the Democrat stole the election and continues to rave about it 6 months after the election when no one cares anymore, and the main person arguing against him is a Republican, does that person sound like a typical Democrat?
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J. J.
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« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2005, 11:51:04 pm »

So, in other words, you have no evidence.  

Going to a 1948 election in Texas is really not related to an election in Washington in 2004, is it?
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J. J.
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« Reply #17 on: June 06, 2005, 11:56:03 pm »

Last time I checked, Democrats typically don't argue with Republicans insisting that a Democrat stole the election. If a person continues to believe that the Democrat stole the election and continues to rave about it 6 months after the election when no one cares anymore, and the main person arguing against him is a Republican, does that person sound like a typical Democrat?

A typical person, when asked for evidence of a 2004 election in Washington, doesn't cite a 1948 election in Texas either.

Look, I'd probably have voted for Rossi, if I was a voter in Washington, and if there was good evidence that he did win, I'd one of the people screaming about how "the Democrats stole the election."  I'm willing to look at the evidence, but none was presented.
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2005, 08:58:27 am »

And so the 'serial drama' of Vote 2004 finally comes to a close!

Dave

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