CNN national poll: Clinton 54% Trump 41%
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  CNN national poll: Clinton 54% Trump 41%
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Author Topic: CNN national poll: Clinton 54% Trump 41%  (Read 1981 times)
pbrower2a
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« Reply #25 on: May 05, 2016, 09:42:48 AM »

This could also mean that Florida, North Carolina, Virginia and Georgia are swinging Democratic heavily...those are the large population states in the South.
Except for Texas.  A 8 point margin in the South almost certainly means that something huge has happened in Texas.

This is a uniform 18 point swing from 2012:


Note that Virginia is over 60%, while Florida is very close to that point as well. This doesn't seem realistic.



Delaware, the District of Columbia, and Maryland are officially part of the Census South, but politically they are more like New England than like Dixie. Florida is distinct in the South, its closest analogue in political orientation being Ohio, definitely not a Southern state. Virginia is 'losing' its Southern characteristics. All that remains of its 'Southern' heritage is monuments to its time in the Confederacy.

I concur that 60-40 is practically impossible for either Virginia or Florida. 55-45, max, barring something like a Reagan 1980 win.

Even shifts just do not happen. The oddity of Obama winning with Reagan-like landslides in the Northeast and West Coast and marginally in a few states (enough to win) but getting crushed as if he were McGovern or Mondale elsewhere is unlikely to last. He may have been a very polarizing President in a polarized time. That is an unstable situation, and really bad for democracy in general.   

Even swings do not happen. Obviously, Hillary Clinton is not going to get 103% of the vote in DC. The most likely big gains from Obama to Clinton will be from states that Obama lost badly in 2012, which means all states in this group except Delaware, the District of Columbia, Florida, North Carolina, and Virginia. Hillary Clinton does not pose the visceral fear of a

BLACK MALE

leading them. Oh, the horror! Zombies! Werewolves! Frankenstein monsters! Cannibals! Goblins! Black people in roles of leadership! If that is the difference between 10% of the white vote going for Obama and 30% of the white vote going for Hillary Clinton, then that could be the difference between Obama losses and Clinton wins in Mississippi, Alabama, and Georgia... maybe Louisiana as well.

(Truth be told, Barack Obama is really an above-average President, probably close to Dwight Eisenhower in temperament, integrity and political skills. But the Mountain and Deep was the only one that voted against Eisenhower, which may say more about the political culture than anything else).

Texas? I do not trust any poll of Texas.  The only polls of Texas that I trust are the results of the most recent election. Texas Hispanics (largely Mexican-American) are arguably more conservative than any other Hispanics in America except for Cuban-Americans in Florida.  But move them toward the norm for Hispanics nationwide in 2016 because of the incendiary statements by Donald Trump, and the GOP could be in trouble in Texas.

South Carolina? I need to see another poll.

A recent poll suggests that West Virginia is swinging even more Republican -- probably because West Virginia has demographics more hostile to the Democratic Party than almost any other state.

But for all this analysis I recognize that I agree with you even if I find the conclusion counter-intuitive. On objective grounds I see Donald Trump as a very poor fit for most of America, a country becoming less white, less straight, less Christian, less Anglo, and more educated.
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Ben Kenobi
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« Reply #26 on: May 06, 2016, 10:40:10 AM »

That map, btw. perfectly matches my prediction map.
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Reginald
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« Reply #27 on: May 06, 2016, 04:55:49 PM »
« Edited: May 06, 2016, 05:35:05 PM by Reginald »

This isn't the first poll to show Clinton leading Trump in the South and doing better there than in the Midwest. There may be something going on but it's still a small sample size of polls that are doing these regional breakdowns, not to mention the many months people will have to warm up to Trump (or not?).

That being said, I had a look at a few GE polls from this time in 2012 and Romney was leading Obama among whites by about 11-18 points, typically closer to the higher end of that range. He won them 59-39 in Nov. To win, Trump has to surpass this, from a lower starting point (I've seen his lead regularly shown at ~6-10 points) and against a white Democrat.

EDIT: Okay so I had a look at the other poll I was thinking of with my first sentence, and it's more nuanced than I remember it being (which makes it that much less trustworthy!):

Census division:
...
S Atlantic (DE MD DC VA WV NC SC FL GA): Clinton +6
W S Central (TX OK AR LA): Clinton +6 (LOL)
...
E S Central (KY TN AL MS): Trump +8

For what it's worth.
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Virginiá
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« Reply #28 on: May 06, 2016, 06:01:27 PM »

...

That being said, I had a look at a few GE polls from this time in 2012 and Romney was leading Obama among whites by about 11-18 points, typically closer to the higher end of that range. He won them 59-39 in Nov. To win, Trump has to surpass this, from a lower starting point (I've seen his lead regularly shown at ~6-10 points) and against a white Democrat.

...

Not only does he have to surpass it, he basically has to do what only Reagan has done before, and get 64%+ of the white vote. Assuming he does as bad as Romney with minorities (which is very generous to Trump I think at this point), then he will need 64% give or take to just break even in the PV. The less of the non-white vote he gets, the more of the white vote he needs, and this problem is compounded should Hispanic turnout surge massively. Trump executed a brilliant, effective strategy to win the primary, which also had the side effect of being poison to his general election chances.

This demographic issue is something any Republican candidate will have to face from here on out.
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Ben Kenobi
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« Reply #29 on: May 07, 2016, 04:24:41 AM »

He's not gonna get 64+ percent of whites, not when he's losing women 75-25 and men 59-41.
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DS0816
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« Reply #30 on: May 10, 2016, 04:58:15 AM »

That 64 percent of whites, nationally, would assume the remaining 2012 exit-polled demographics stood still with Election Day 2016. That isn't likely. A Republican pickup of the presidency would get just about every demographic shifted in the party's direction. Info I've come across indicate Republican Donald Trump losing ground (underperforming a 2012 Mitt Romney). And if that happens, we're going to see an election map with considerably more blue.
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