S3: Southern Gender Identity Act (Failed)

[diptheriadan]

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Sponsor: diptheriadan

I now open this up to the floor for debate.

EDIT: Before he left for Fremont, 1184AZ wrote this bill. As he is no longer a member of the Chamber and cannot sponsor this bill, I have taken over as sponsor.

[Terry the Fat Shark]

I'm not entirely opposed to this, but before I sign it there are a couple of things I want to address.

In regards to section number one, while I respect the beliefs and the rights of any citizen to identify as whatever they want, the government generally cedes powers on matters like this until children reach the age of 18. I have nothing against people below the age of 18 identifying as such, but to be able to change their gender legally, they must have consent from a parent or guardian prior to the age of 18. Once anyone reaches 18, they should be able to do whatever they want in regards to this, legally.

In regards to section number two, one exactly is meant by "discrimination", I think that's a really broad term and I'm not sure I'm comfortable with signing a bill with that broad of a language, it's just asking for legal trouble.

[Santander]

Government ID documents display sex, not gender.

I oppose this bill.

[Wisconsin+17]

Oppose this bill. Government issued ID cares about the facts of the matter, not someone's personal preferences.

It's no different from altering medical records. That would pose a danger to the patient at hand.

[OneJ]

I would like to propose an amendment:

1.All Southern Citizens 18 years or older may change their gender on government ID.
2.No Bussiness in the South may discriminate on the basis of Gender Identity. 

13 is a bit too young in my opinion primarily due to possible concerned parents.

[diptheriadan]

I would like to propose an amendment:

1.All Southern Citizens 18 years or older may change their gender on government ID.
2.No Bussiness in the South may discriminate on the basis of Gender Identity. 

13 is a bit too young in my opinion primarily due to possible concerned parents.

Would you settle for 16 so long as they have their parents or guardians permission?

[OneJ]

I would like to propose an amendment:

1.All Southern Citizens 18 years or older may change their gender on government ID.
2.No Bussiness in the South may discriminate on the basis of Gender Identity. 

13 is a bit too young in my opinion primarily due to possible concerned parents.

Would you settle for 16 so long as they have their parents or guardians permission?

Sure.

[Terry the Fat Shark]

I think OneJ's amendments basically went along with my thoughts....18 is the legal age of changing your id without consent, I would prefer an amendment that says you may not change until 18, unless you have parent's consent prior to that.

[Wisconsin+17]

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How about this?

[diptheriadan]

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How about this?

I'm willing to vote for this. I'll see what others think before I call for a vote.

[Santander]

Nobody has addressed the fact that government IDs do not contain gender. The government does not even recognize any individual's gender for all practical purposes. There is nothing to change. I support 2 and 3 of Del. Ben Kenobi's amendment, though.

[diptheriadan]

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Are we all okay with this amendment? It's a combination of OneJ_'s and Ben's.

[OneJ]

Can you elaborate on what #3 (really #4) actually means because I actually misread it?

[diptheriadan]

Can you elaborate on what #3 (really #4) actually means because I actually misread it?

I think what Ben was going for, was to allow for businesses to not hire or serve people they don't want, so long as they offer an alternative.

[OneJ]

I thought so. That's why I'm kinda hesitant on supporting the bill.

[diptheriadan]

And one more thing.

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I would like there to be some discussion about this last amendment. I think you can get the gist of it, but the wording seems somewhat off.

[Wisconsin+17]

Hate crimes legislation failed a long time ago because people would rather see one law apply equally to everyone rather than having certain people with special privileges.

Really, if you kill someone, you go to jail for murder. If you harass someone, you're charged with harassment.

[diptheriadan]

I now open a 36-hour vote on Ben Kenobi's amendment.

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[diptheriadan]

Aye

[Wisconsin+17]

AYE

[Santander]

Nobody has addressed the fact that government IDs do not contain gender.

[Terry the Fat Shark]

Nobody has addressed the fact that government IDs do not contain gender.

http://nysdmv.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/405/~/change-of-sex-or-gender-on-a-dmv-driver-license,-permit-or-non-driver-id-card In most governmental instances, if you are "Transgender" you are allowed to change the sex on your ID card, that is what is happening here. I suppose if you are so upset about it, you should offer an amendment changing the Gender to Sex.

[Terry the Fat Shark]

By the way y'all, for future reference, if an amendment is friendly, you do not have to vote on an amendment unless someone makes an objection, if the sponsor himself (or herself) offers an amendment to their own bill, it does not have to be voted on even if there is an objection

[OneJ]

Abstain

[diptheriadan]

With 2 AYE votes, no NAY votes, 2 delegates not voting, and 1 delegate abstaining, the AYEs have it and Ben Kenobi's amendment passes.

I now open a 36-hour vote on the final bill.

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