Rank the Russian Governments in the past 300 years
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  Rank the Russian Governments in the past 300 years
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Author Topic: Rank the Russian Governments in the past 300 years  (Read 4323 times)
Kingpoleon
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« Reply #50 on: January 28, 2018, 05:07:07 PM »

1. Russian Republic
2. Gorbachev/Yeltsin Transitional Period

3. Tsarist Russia
4. Khrushchev’s Soviet Union
5. Post-Yeltsin Russian Federation

6. Brezhnev’s Soviet Union
7. Lenin’s Soviet Union

8. Stalin’s Soviet Union
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kelestian
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« Reply #51 on: January 31, 2018, 06:24:29 AM »

1. Republic of Russia

2.  Late Soviet Union






3. Russian Federation
4. Russian Empire
5. Early Soviet Union

Lol, no. Changing my votes:

1. Gorbachev's USSR

2. Russian Federation
3. Russian Republic

4.  Late USSR




5. Russian Empire
6. Early Soviet Union

I mean, the Republic was utterly incompetent. But all are horrid, anyway.

I mean, Russian Republic isn't a thing, just interim short period between USSR and Empire.

Could they be considered interim, though? It's not like they intended Russia to fall for the Marxists. Originally, afaik, they were a coalition of centrists and moderate socialists, aiming to be a democracy, but they were su incompetent the Bolsheviks inevitably rose.

talking about 1917 Russia, what exactly government should we judge? There were two independent co-governments (Dual power period):  Petrograd Soviet, which later became one of communists official institutions, and Russian Provisional Government, both with small legitimacy. The first legitimate government of Russian Republic would had been Russian Constituent Assembly, which was established after October revolution and dispersed by Bolsheviks some times later.

Also it's mistake to consider Kerensky as democratic hero: he wasn't democratic elected prime-minister, and he personally had authocratic and populists tendencies (not as much as Lenin, but...). In my opinion, Savinkov or Kornilov would be better as  interim Russia leaders.
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Statilius the Epicurean
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« Reply #52 on: February 01, 2018, 02:14:57 PM »

1. Russian Federation
2. USSR
3. Russian Empire
4. Russian Republic

Lol at people rating a government run by unelected morons with no power (as smolchatov correctly notes) trying to prosecute a bloody war as the country's economy collapsed and mass starvation and social unrest was rampant first
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Karpatsky
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« Reply #53 on: February 05, 2018, 09:06:39 PM »

1. Russian Federation
2. USSR
3. Russian Empire
4. Russian Republic

Lol at people rating a government run by unelected morons with no power (as smolchatov correctly notes) trying to prosecute a bloody war as the country's economy collapsed and mass starvation and social unrest was rampant first

Re: the three choices you put above it, unelected morons with no power beat unelected morons with life-or death power.

And anyways, neither of the parts of the Republic were unelected; the Provisional Government was primarily composed of Duma members, while the Soviets were largely directly elected. They deserve the first slot because at least they were trying to work for the good of the country, unlike any of the autocratic and brutal regimes you seem to prefer.

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thumb21
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« Reply #54 on: February 06, 2018, 01:46:46 PM »

1. Russian Federation
2. Provisional Government
3. USSR
4. Tsars
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MATTROSE94
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« Reply #55 on: March 17, 2018, 07:29:52 PM »

1. Russian Federation (1991-1999)
2. USSR (1985-1991)
3. Russian Empire
4. USSR (1917-1922)
5. USSR (1953-1985)
6. USSR (1922-1953)




7. Russian Federation (1999-Present) (One of the worst governments in human history. The US and NATO should use all of the power at their disposal to violently remove the Putin Regime from power and bring a democratic leader such as Garry Kasparov or Alexei Navalny into power).

Much like kelestian, I did not include the Russian Republic due to its short-lived nature.
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smoltchanov
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« Reply #56 on: March 18, 2018, 01:10:43 AM »
« Edited: March 18, 2018, 02:49:44 AM by smoltchanov »

^ You can't remove Putin's regime (which now has stable support of 60-70% of Russian population (much more - in rural areas), if only because it's complete dominance of mass-media) by any means short of full-scale nuclear war. And West will not do it, by obvious reason. So - it's a "theory" at best... Wait until he dies, or - 6 years (whatever will come sooner). You must understand that generally Russian mentality is very conservative: typical Russian values stability much more, then liberty (if he knows what it is at all, as there were very few periods in Russian history, when this notion had any practical sense for "normal" citizens). 1990th were the period with very high level of liberty, and, at the same time - with lot of economical problems, chaos, disorganisation and hardships. So, in minds of majority the very notion "liberty" is associated with all that, not something positive. And thus - a majority tries to avoid it at any cost. The shelves of the supermarkets are full (unlike most of 1980th and at least part of 1990th), the income - low, but stable, the rent, while higher then it was, is acceptable, and that's all a majority of population wants. Stagnation, but - relatively comfortable one. Add to this social conservatism of most population (and leading church, which plays an important role in it), strong populist (but - conservative populist, like it was in American South half century ago) inclinations, and you more or less get the picture of why a "democracy" is a "dirty word" (on par with n-word in US) in Russia now.
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MATTROSE94
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« Reply #57 on: March 18, 2018, 04:41:53 PM »

^ You can't remove Putin's regime (which now has stable support of 60-70% of Russian population (much more - in rural areas), if only because it's complete dominance of mass-media) by any means short of full-scale nuclear war. And West will not do it, by obvious reason. So - it's a "theory" at best... Wait until he dies, or - 6 years (whatever will come sooner). You must understand that generally Russian mentality is very conservative: typical Russian values stability much more, then liberty (if he knows what it is at all, as there were very few periods in Russian history, when this notion had any practical sense for "normal" citizens). 1990th were the period with very high level of liberty, and, at the same time - with lot of economical problems, chaos, disorganisation and hardships. So, in minds of majority the very notion "liberty" is associated with all that, not something positive. And thus - a majority tries to avoid it at any cost. The shelves of the supermarkets are full (unlike most of 1980th and at least part of 1990th), the income - low, but stable, the rent, while higher then it was, is acceptable, and that's all a majority of population wants. Stagnation, but - relatively comfortable one. Add to this social conservatism of most population (and leading church, which plays an important role in it), strong populist (but - conservative populist, like it was in American South half century ago) inclinations, and you more or less get the picture of why a "democracy" is a "dirty word" (on par with n-word in US) in Russia now.

I used to have a positive opinion of Putin (I still agree with his policy towards Iran and Syria overall) until the beginning of this year. The main things that caused me to change my views were the revelations of the fact that he worked to rig the 2016 Presidential election to put President Donald Trump (who I consider a fascist, racist, neo-conservative populist, and a two-faced man) into power, and ordered the deploying of a neurotoxin on the soil of another nation (the UK) to poison a dissident. I consider these incidents to be act of wars and feel that it would be appropriate for NATO to invoke Article V and launch an assault  against Russia to remove the Putin Regime from power.

I know that many claim that Putin would use nuclear weapons if NATO attack Russia, but my gut feeling is that he would not. The reason I feel that way is because during WWII, both sides could have used chemical weapons, but the overwhelming destructive nature of such weapons discouraged their use. I also feel that NATO would defeat Russia in a conventional war due to their strong technological advantage and much larger overall GDP than Russia (Russia only has a GDP of around $2 trillion, whereas all the NATO members have a combined GDP of around $37 trillion).
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Kingpoleon
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« Reply #58 on: March 19, 2018, 10:31:18 AM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)
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CrabCake
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« Reply #59 on: March 20, 2018, 06:38:53 AM »

There's a decent argument to be made than New Economic Policy was - if not great, the best economic policies Russia tried out, especially coming after the insanity of War Communism.
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Zuza
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« Reply #60 on: March 20, 2018, 11:32:41 AM »


Why did you select 1718 as the beginning of absolute monarchy? What did happen in this year?
Also, the constitution was adopted in 1906.
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GMantis
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« Reply #61 on: March 20, 2018, 05:33:02 PM »


I know that many claim that Putin would use nuclear weapons if NATO attack Russia, but my gut feeling is that he would not. The reason I feel that way is because during WWII, both sides could have used chemical weapons, but the overwhelming destructive nature of such weapons discouraged their use. I also feel that NATO would defeat Russia in a conventional war due to their strong technological advantage and much larger overall GDP than Russia (Russia only has a GDP of around $2 trillion, whereas all the NATO members have a combined GDP of around $37 trillion).
Lucky that delusional people like you are far away from any position of power (this includes the ignorant comparison between chemical and nuclear weapons). If NATO is aiming to conquer Russia, nuclear weapons will be used, though at first only against NATO forces. It's not a war that can be won.
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Kingpoleon
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« Reply #62 on: March 21, 2018, 06:40:32 PM »


Why did you select 1718 as the beginning of absolute monarchy? What did happen in this year?
Also, the constitution was adopted in 1906.
2018-300=1718
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Computer89
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« Reply #63 on: March 21, 2018, 06:57:18 PM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)


Khrushchev Period was worse than the Republic and Putin Periods and the constitutional monarchy period as well .


Brezhnev was also worse than the Tsars as well
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MATTROSE94
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« Reply #64 on: March 22, 2018, 07:41:01 AM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)


Khrushchev Period was worse than the Republic and Putin Periods and the constitutional monarchy period as well .


Brezhnev was also worse than the Tsars as well
Kruschev and Stalin were horrific leaders, but they at least never rigged a US Presidential Election to allow a fascist to come into power, never deployed a neurotoxin on foreign soil, or turned their country into a right-wing Christian theocracy. Also, it is likely that Putin set up a system of death camps similar to the ones that existed during Stalin’s time in power.
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Kingpoleon
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« Reply #65 on: March 22, 2018, 01:23:40 PM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)


Khrushchev Period was worse than the Republic and Putin Periods and the constitutional monarchy period as well .


Brezhnev was also worse than the Tsars as well
Kruschev and Stalin were horrific leaders, but they at least never rigged a US Presidential Election to allow a fascist to come into power, never deployed a neurotoxin on foreign soil, or turned their country into a right-wing Christian theocracy. Also, it is likely that Putin set up a system of death camps similar to the ones that existed during Stalin’s time in power.
Trump is not a fascist, they would have rigged an election if they had the capability, and Stalin is far worse than Khrushchev. Example:

“I'm old and tired. Let them cope by themselves. I've done the main thing. Could anyone have dreamed of telling Stalin that he didn't suit us anymore and suggesting he retire? Not even a wet spot would have remained where we had been standing. Now everything is different. The fear is gone, and we can talk as equals. That's my contribution. I won't put up a fight.” - Nikita Khrushchev
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CrabCake
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« Reply #66 on: March 22, 2018, 01:45:13 PM »

I mean, the Soviet Union did objectively jab and poke at America's political machinery from the scenery. Mccarthyism was a completely overblown set of conspiracies (indeed, the unions and democrats had largely already purged their Communists already) but there was a grain of truth.

It also seems absurdly parochial to complain that Putin has pushed a distasteful leader in America, when the likes of Stalin, Khrushchev and Brezhnev pushed exceedingly nasty regimes on Hungary, Poland, Afghanistan, Czechoslovakia, North Korea, Ethiopia etc. (And hypocritical given the US also interfered with domestic politics in Japan, South Africa, Taiwan, South Korea, Italy etc)
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Computer89
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« Reply #67 on: March 22, 2018, 02:11:09 PM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)


Khrushchev Period was worse than the Republic and Putin Periods and the constitutional monarchy period as well .


Brezhnev was also worse than the Tsars as well
Kruschev and Stalin were horrific leaders, but they at least never rigged a US Presidential Election to allow a fascist to come into power, never deployed a neurotoxin on foreign soil, or turned their country into a right-wing Christian theocracy. Also, it is likely that Putin set up a system of death camps similar to the ones that existed during Stalin’s time in power.


1. There is no evidence they hacked into the voting machines and changed the results

2. Instead, they invaded more countries than Putin has and had the goal of turning the world communist

3. Putin never put nuclear weapons in Cuba

4. Their system Government, Communism was literally the 2nd most evil ideology in modern history (Nazism is only ideology more evil) and their system of Government was the 2nd most evil type of government in world history(Only the Nazis were worse).



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Karpatsky
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« Reply #68 on: March 22, 2018, 03:55:43 PM »

Gorbachev Period(1985-1991)
Yeltsin Period(1991-2000)
Khrushchev Era(1953-1964)
Republic Era(1917)
Putin Period(2000-)

Constitutional Monarchy(1907-1917)
Chernenko/Androprov Period(1982-1985)
Brezhnev Period(1964-1982)

Absolute Monarchy(1718-1907)
Lenin Era(1917-1924)
Stalin Era(1924-1953)


Khrushchev Period was worse than the Republic and Putin Periods and the constitutional monarchy period as well .


Brezhnev was also worse than the Tsars as well
Kruschev and Stalin were horrific leaders, but they at least never rigged a US Presidential Election to allow a fascist to come into power, never deployed a neurotoxin on foreign soil, or turned their country into a right-wing Christian theocracy. Also, it is likely that Putin set up a system of death camps similar to the ones that existed during Stalin’s time in power.


1. There is no evidence they hacked into the voting machines and changed the results

2. Instead, they invaded more countries than Putin has and had the goal of turning the world communist

3. Putin never put nuclear weapons in Cuba

4. Their system Government, Communism was literally the 2nd most evil ideology in modern history (Nazism is only ideology more evil) and their system of Government was the 2nd most evil type of government in world history(Only the Nazis were worse).


The ideology of Soviet communism was at least idealistic in principle, and was in no sense worse than official nationality.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #69 on: March 22, 2018, 04:40:39 PM »

what scale is "objective evil" measured in, anyway?
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All Along The Watchtower
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« Reply #70 on: March 26, 2018, 03:55:49 PM »

what scale is "objective evil" measured in, anyway?

Let's ask Nate @538!
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Computer89
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« Reply #71 on: July 21, 2018, 01:41:36 PM »

The day this happened was one of the greatest days in all of Human History: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=028gd8Sn3m0&t=70s
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Karpatsky
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« Reply #72 on: July 21, 2018, 08:29:27 PM »

The day this happened was one of the greatest days in all of Human History: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=028gd8Sn3m0&t=70s

This sort of arrogant and ignorant attitude is why so many in the former Soviet Union feel like the West looks down on them, and contributes to Putin's popularity. You know, most people (outside of the Baltic states, probably) who live through the Soviet period regret the collapse? It robbed them of a sense of purpose and unity. The Berlin Wall coming down was a great day - the collapse of the Soviet Union was just sad, and a huge missed opportunity. With the right reforms, the USSR today likely would have been a better place to live than most post-Soviet countries are now./
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Intell
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« Reply #73 on: July 21, 2018, 10:55:43 PM »
« Edited: July 21, 2018, 11:13:54 PM by Intell »

1. USSR pre-stalin
2. Russian Republic
3. USSR Post-Stalin
4. Russian Federation
5. USSR with Stalin
6. Russian Empire

Changing some of these

1. USSR Post-Stalin
2. Russian Republic
3. USSR Pre-Stalin
4. Russian Federation
5. USSR with Stalin
6. Russian Empire


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CrabCake
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« Reply #74 on: July 22, 2018, 06:21:26 AM »

Tbh Russia under NEP wasn't terrible (relatively anyway), but the Lenin rule also includes the insanity of War Communism.
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