Puerto Rico status referendum - June 11
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  Puerto Rico status referendum - June 11
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Author Topic: Puerto Rico status referendum - June 11  (Read 25681 times)
Barnes
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« Reply #175 on: May 24, 2017, 02:48:00 PM »
« edited: May 24, 2017, 02:50:32 PM by Barnes »

As far as DC statehood goes, it is constitutionally mandated that there must be a federal district for the federal government, which of course could be reduced in size as proposed here.

However, this rump district of a few buildings would still be entitled to three electoral votes per the 23rd Amendment which would be a rather ludicrous situation.
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Gass3268
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« Reply #176 on: May 24, 2017, 02:59:35 PM »

As far as DC statehood goes, it is constitutionally mandated that there must be a federal district for the federal government, which of course could be reduced in size as proposed here.

However, this rump district of a few buildings would still be entitled to three electoral votes per the 23rd Amendment which would be a rather ludicrous situation.

It would be easier to repeal that Amendment after the fact.
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Figueira
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« Reply #177 on: May 24, 2017, 03:16:57 PM »

As far as DC statehood goes, it is constitutionally mandated that there must be a federal district for the federal government, which of course could be reduced in size as proposed here.

However, this rump district of a few buildings would still be entitled to three electoral votes per the 23rd Amendment which would be a rather ludicrous situation.

That has already heen mentioned in this thread twice.

While you would need a constitutional amendment to get rid of those votes entirely, I think you could simply make legislation to decide what actually happens to them.
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Barnes
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« Reply #178 on: May 24, 2017, 04:24:03 PM »

Congress could, theoretically, allow for an alternative method to select electors, just as each state can choose their electors as they please, but short of repealing the amendment there is no way of getting around the fact that the District would continue to have them.
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Figueira
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« Reply #179 on: May 24, 2017, 05:56:45 PM »

Congress could, theoretically, allow for an alternative method to select electors, just as each state can choose their electors as they please, but short of repealing the amendment there is no way of getting around the fact that the District would continue to have them.

That's literally what I just said.
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Barnes
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« Reply #180 on: May 24, 2017, 06:30:50 PM »

Congress could, theoretically, allow for an alternative method to select electors, just as each state can choose their electors as they please, but short of repealing the amendment there is no way of getting around the fact that the District would continue to have them.

That's literally what I just said.

My, my, quite fiesty I see.
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Zioneer
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« Reply #181 on: June 09, 2017, 11:00:17 PM »

So this is on Sunday, yeah? What are the current predictions on the results?
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Heisenberg
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« Reply #182 on: June 09, 2017, 11:02:06 PM »

So this is on Sunday, yeah? What are the current predictions on the results?
Should be a statehood landslide, but don't read too much into the results, the anti-statehood people are expected to largely boycott the referendum.
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○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└
jfern
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« Reply #183 on: June 09, 2017, 11:07:10 PM »
« Edited: June 09, 2017, 11:09:20 PM by ○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└ »

There was a poll. Statehood has 66% of those intending on voting. It had 52% of all voters with abstain getting 7%.

http://prdecide.elnuevodia.com/detalle/reportaje/311_plebiscite-boycott-fails-to-seduce-the-masses/

If the results are like this, it's a mandate to be the 51st state. Of course DC deserves to be admitted too.
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Dr. Arch
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« Reply #184 on: June 10, 2017, 12:08:19 AM »

There was a poll. Statehood has 66% of those intending on voting. It had 52% of all voters with abstain getting 7%.

http://prdecide.elnuevodia.com/detalle/reportaje/311_plebiscite-boycott-fails-to-seduce-the-masses/

If the results are like this, it's a mandate to be the 51st state. Of course DC deserves to be admitted too.

Polls from ENDI or any other newspaper are absolute Gravis-level trash. Don't even read into this. With things as they are, it's completely up in the air, but it's not going to be a landslide either way.
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Zioneer
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« Reply #185 on: June 10, 2017, 12:27:46 AM »

So this is on Sunday, yeah? What are the current predictions on the results?
Should be a statehood landslide, but don't read too much into the results, the anti-statehood people are expected to largely boycott the referendum.

Ah, I see. I still think it's valid if a majority of voters vote for statehood. And I think that if statehood wins, Puerto Rico should start elections for Congress and Senate immediately. Send elected representatives to DC and dare them to block said elected officials from being seated. I think at least one other state in US history has done that, but I can't remember which one.
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Heisenberg
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« Reply #186 on: June 10, 2017, 12:43:49 AM »

So this is on Sunday, yeah? What are the current predictions on the results?
Should be a statehood landslide, but don't read too much into the results, the anti-statehood people are expected to largely boycott the referendum.

Ah, I see. I still think it's valid if a majority of voters vote for statehood. And I think that if statehood wins, Puerto Rico should start elections for Congress and Senate immediately. Send elected representatives to DC and dare them to block said elected officials from being seated. I think at least one other state in US history has done that, but I can't remember which one.
That state is Tennessee.
Anyway, opponents argue that the referendum loses legitimacy of turnout is too low.
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Angel of Death
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« Reply #187 on: June 10, 2017, 07:11:35 AM »

Again with the referendum with more than two options! If you're not going to allow a ranked choice here (which given the various issues is at least understandable), it should be a binary choice, with one option being the status quo. If one option (statehood most likely) wins without a majority, we have the exact same mess as last time!
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SoLongAtlas
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« Reply #188 on: June 10, 2017, 07:32:22 AM »

Again with the referendum with more than two options! If you're not going to allow a ranked choice here (which given the various issues is at least understandable), it should be a binary choice, with one option being the status quo. If one option (statehood most likely) wins without a majority, we have the exact same mess as last time!

They originally had it as statehood or status quo but Bureagard and Trump made them change it back.
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Angel of Death
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« Reply #189 on: June 10, 2017, 07:50:31 AM »

Again with the referendum with more than two options! If you're not going to allow a ranked choice here (which given the various issues is at least understandable), it should be a binary choice, with one option being the status quo. If one option (statehood most likely) wins without a majority, we have the exact same mess as last time!

They originally had it as statehood or status quo but Bureagard and Trump made them change it back.

That is not correct. It was the "status quo" option which was omitted and pushed back in by the Justice Department.
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SoLongAtlas
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« Reply #190 on: June 10, 2017, 08:27:34 AM »

Again with the referendum with more than two options! If you're not going to allow a ranked choice here (which given the various issues is at least understandable), it should be a binary choice, with one option being the status quo. If one option (statehood most likely) wins without a majority, we have the exact same mess as last time!

They originally had it as statehood or status quo but Bureagard and Trump made them change it back.

That is not correct. It was the "status quo" option which was omitted and pushed back in by the Justice Department.

Yeah you're right still early. It is Statehood/independence, free association/Commonwealth again. Trump's admin didn't want like 90% statehood which is what it would be under the two option scenario.
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zorkpolitics
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« Reply #191 on: June 10, 2017, 12:08:35 PM »

As far as DC statehood goes, it is constitutionally mandated that there must be a federal district for the federal government, which of course could be reduced in size as proposed here.

However, this rump district of a few buildings would still be entitled to three electoral votes per the 23rd Amendment which would be a rather ludicrous situation.

Why should a city be a state?  Why not just return the residential parts of D.C. To MD?  In the 1840's the VA part of D.C. (Arlington and Alexandria counties) was returned to VA.  Follow the same process for what remains of D.C., except for a small federal district.  MD would get one more congressman and one more EV, then the 3 EVs for D.C. can be repealed.
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heatcharger
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« Reply #192 on: June 10, 2017, 01:54:07 PM »
« Edited: June 10, 2017, 01:56:38 PM by heatcharger »

This should be interesting, but Republicans like Rubio won't vote for statehood and diluting their stranglehold over the electoral college and the federal government. It might be a while.

As far as DC statehood goes, it is constitutionally mandated that there must be a federal district for the federal government, which of course could be reduced in size as proposed here.

However, this rump district of a few buildings would still be entitled to three electoral votes per the 23rd Amendment which would be a rather ludicrous situation.

Why should a city be a state?
 Why not just return the residential parts of D.C. To MD?  In the 1840's the VA part of D.C. (Arlington and Alexandria counties) was returned to VA.  Follow the same process for what remains of D.C., except for a small federal district.  MD would get one more congressman and one more EV, then the 3 EVs for D.C. can be repealed.

Where in the Constitution is there any provision that bars a city from being a state? Population density should not and has not ever determined whether an area can achieve statehood.
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zorkpolitics
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« Reply #193 on: June 10, 2017, 02:26:21 PM »

Nothing bars a city from becoming a state, but all other states must reconcile urban and rural interest a city state would lack "diversity".  Again why create a new path when there is a clear historical precedence for D.C.
This would seem to be the best compromise the two parties could come up with. The D.C. Residents get full Congressional representation, a longtime goal of the Democrats, and the Democrats get an additional Democratic Congressman.  The GOP doesn't have to accept 2 additional Democratic Senators and gets a net 2 reduction in guaranteed Democratic EVs. 
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TheSaint250
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« Reply #194 on: June 11, 2017, 07:09:02 AM »

Today's the day.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #195 on: June 11, 2017, 07:14:48 AM »

Yeah, but this will go NOWHERE, right ?

Cannot imagine the Republicans accepting statehood for PR - even if it votes 90% for statehood with 80% turnout ...
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windjammer
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« Reply #196 on: June 11, 2017, 07:27:33 AM »

Yeah, but this will go NOWHERE, right ?

Cannot imagine the Republicans accepting statehood for PR - even if it votes 90% for statehood with 80% turnout ...
One day democrats will regain trifecta , so a question of time
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Terry the Fat Shark
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« Reply #197 on: June 11, 2017, 07:41:45 AM »

Didn't Marco Rubio run on letting Puerto Rico in??
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Shameless Lefty Hack
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« Reply #198 on: June 11, 2017, 08:01:51 AM »

Didn't Marco Rubio run on letting Puerto Rico in??

Marco Rubio lost.

But more particularly, the 'open to Latinos' vision of the party lost.
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MasterJedi
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« Reply #199 on: June 11, 2017, 09:43:13 AM »

So when does voting end/when should results start coming in?
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