Belgian Politics & Elections: Federal, regional & EP elections on June 9, 2024

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Would there be any interest if i stream coverage of Belgian elections. I might also do Dutch elections? But if i only have like 1-2 viewers its maybe pointless but given I understand dutch language, i might be able to cover it in english in a stream. I just don't have much experience streaming (and am a bit uncomfortable with RL cam though i guess. But for a Belgian election, i think it might be interesting. Dutch as well since usually counting starts in the evening. And for Belgium, it's in the weekend with counting usually starting at 4PM on sunday starting which would be 10AM standard american time (though with climax much later usually). The earliest results are 10-11am for detroit time, but it would be mostly a sunday afternoon. There are 2 belgian ones next year (basically all possible belgian elections on 2 different dates both in 2024), the most important ones are scheduled to be held on 9 june.

just dk if people would really 'care' about something so minor from a US point of view
but given the amount of ppl that followed the Polish election, belgian elections tend to be interesting to follow since there aren't really exit polls (i can't recall any ever), so it's uncertain for a while which direction it goes to for quite some time.
and counting is slow but also not the slowness of the polish ones, it's fast enough for a stream to make sense, but slow enough that a stream also would make sense (not immediately all the "tension" gone).

[Zinneke]

https://www.lalibre.be/belgique/politique-belge/2023/10/27/comment-le-mr-pourrait-seduire-la-communaute-turque-avec-laide-dun-faiseur-dopinion-au-passe-sulfureux-MCVL3FAR4JG2JM7PHDGKH6LJ3E/

MR targeting to Turkish diaspora in Brussels by trying to get ex-PS Saint-Jossd Mayor Emir Kir's number 2 into their ranks. You know, the guys who denied the Armenian genocide, pose with Grey Wolves and intimidate voters at the ballot boxes with some mysterious spooks.

[DavidB.]

Thierry Baudet has announced that Forum for Democracy will take part in the European Parliament election not only in the Netherlands, but also in Belgium. With a 5% threshold in Belgium they won't win a seat, but they could cost VB their fourth one. FVD claim they differentiate themselves from VB by focusing on abolishment (not reform) of the EU, on COVID restrictions (not sure which ones...), on Central Bank Digital Currency, on opposing NATO and "American imperialism", and on building a network within society. They compare VB to the Dutch PVV. And they announced they will organize rallies in Antwerp, Brussels, Leuven and Luik.

I wonder whether Dries Van Langenhove could be FVD's leading candidate in Flanders.

https://twitter.com/PALNWS/status/1717879639731765507?s=20

[PSOL]

Thierry Baudet has announced that Forum for Democracy will take part in the European Parliament election not only in the Netherlands, but also in Belgium. With a 5% threshold in Belgium they won't win a seat, but they could cost VB their fourth one. FVD claim they differentiate themselves from VB by focusing on abolishment (not reform) of the EU, on COVID restrictions, on Central Bank Digital Currency, on opposing NATO and "American imperialism", and on building a network within society. They compare VB to the Dutch PVV. And they announced they will organize rallies in Antwerp, Brussels, Leuven and Luik.

I wonder whether Dries Van Langenhove could be FVD's leading candidate in Flanders.

https://twitter.com/PALNWS/status/1717879639731765507?s=20

Amazing it took this long for there to be parties running in both major Dutch regions

[windjammer]

Honestly if this country ever desintegrates for good. If I were a flemish I would rather remain independent than joining the netherlands.

They are too different and alone Flanders have more potential to become some huge booming regions.

[Zinneke]

Thierry Baudet has announced that Forum for Democracy will take part in the European Parliament election not only in the Netherlands, but also in Belgium. With a 5% threshold in Belgium they won't win a seat, but they could cost VB their fourth one. FVD claim they differentiate themselves from VB by focusing on abolishment (not reform) of the EU, on COVID restrictions, on Central Bank Digital Currency, on opposing NATO and "American imperialism", and on building a network within society. They compare VB to the Dutch PVV. And they announced they will organize rallies in Antwerp, Brussels, Leuven and Luik.

I wonder whether Dries Van Langenhove could be FVD's leading candidate in Flanders.

https://twitter.com/PALNWS/status/1717879639731765507?s=20

Amazing it took this long for there to be parties running in both major Dutch regions

Not really, there are a whole range of issues even right wing populist parties would diverge on, and it isn't as simple as one being more right-wing than the other. Only weird néo-nazi orgs like Voorpost and more intellectual types like De Wever ever tout it.

(And I say this as someone who would very much like a Benelux federation of some sort once confederalism eventually happens).

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Thierry Baudet has announced that Forum for Democracy will take part in the European Parliament election not only in the Netherlands, but also in Belgium. With a 5% threshold in Belgium they won't win a seat, but they could cost VB their fourth one. FVD claim they differentiate themselves from VB by focusing on abolishment (not reform) of the EU, on COVID restrictions (not sure which ones...), on Central Bank Digital Currency, on opposing NATO and "American imperialism", and on building a network within society. They compare VB to the Dutch PVV. And they announced they will organize rallies in Antwerp, Brussels, Leuven and Luik.

I wonder whether Dries Van Langenhove could be FVD's leading candidate in Flanders.

https://twitter.com/PALNWS/status/1717879639731765507?s=20

The fact that he calls us southern Netherlands tells you enough you need to know.

I'd rather join USA, UK, France, Germany, Luxembourg, Denmark, Italy, Spain, Austria, Portugal, Switzerland, Ireland or Iceland before i consider joining Netherlands.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Honestly if this country ever desintegrates for good. If I were a flemish I would rather remain independent than joining the netherlands.

They are too different and alone Flanders have more potential to become some huge booming regions.

Agreed, but Belgium works and i want to remain within Belgium.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Honestly if this country ever desintegrates for good. If I were a flemish I would rather remain independent than joining the netherlands.

They are too different and alone Flanders have more potential to become some huge booming regions.

You know, in terms of national identity, i think i mostly consider myself "Burgundian". That's basically the era that defined and shaped Flanders and also held Wallonia at the same time. I think the Belgian identity is basically much closer to Burgundian than to French or Dutch.

[PSOL]

Belgium being no more would be the worst idea of the 21st century. A split into two ostensibly poorer states having to deal with border conflicts and partitioning Brussels would be a disaster. Such a split would divide communities, families, and persons into designated categories with no basis to exist.

Only fools would allow such a travesty to happen.

[Zinneke]

Meh, I honestly the median Belgian is such a docile feckless epicurian type with their 4 sided villa and 2 company cars in the drive way you could probably dissolve Belgium tomorrow under an EU umbrella in an orderly manner. It is a de facto split country/failed state at the institutional level, but the entire opposite on an socio-economic level resulting in the current impasse (and also the high political class cannot agree on how to split it). And my city being the absolute ultimate actor screwed over in this is also worth highlighting: I think those Swedes shot up would have survived if Wallonia and Flanders didn't underfund the city constantly and draw its borders in such an absurd way that ghettoisation was inevitable.

[DavidB.]

I think those Swedes shot up would have survived if Wallonia and Flanders didn't underfund the city constantly and draw its borders in such an absurd way that ghettoisation was inevitable.

What borders do you think were drawn absurdly? The ones of the Capital Region or the arbitrary ones of the municipalities within it? I'd think it'd be mostly the latter, and I don't think that's on Wallonia and Flanders, but perhaps I'm missing something.

[Zinneke]

I think those Swedes shot up would have survived if Wallonia and Flanders didn't underfund the city constantly and draw its borders in such an absurd way that ghettoisation was inevitable.

What borders do you think were drawn absurdly? The ones of the Capital Region or the arbitrary ones of the municipalities within it? I'd think it'd be mostly the latter, and I don't think that's on Wallonia and Flanders, but perhaps I'm missing something.

Both. The region's borders were roughly designed to be the francophone majority communes in Brussel-Halle-Vilvoorde, but outside of the linguistic debate the city was also partitioned in a way that it would always be a cramped, overpopulated mess come what may, surrounded by paranoid villa-dwelling NIMBY cultists. Even Flemish intellectuals have rightfully pointed out that if the 2 Brabants and Brussels were formed into one region of their own (more historically accurate than modern "Flanders" and "Wallonia") then a 3 way partition/federalisation of the country would be sustainable. Right now Walloon PS régionalistes like Pierre-Yves Dermagne are conspiring with Flemish nationalists for the next state reform to essentially hang Brussels out to dry and have a purely region-based set up. Goodbye social security, child benefit, etc. The only way Brussels would benefit is by not having a pension time bomb, but otherwise it would be one of the poorest regions in Western Europe by far by virtue of being a Bantustan for rich white Belgians to blame their issues on (while sending their kids there to open their negative 2 million turnover microbrewery in Saint-Gilles), despite the fact that if people were taxed where they work rather than where they lived, or if Brussels were allowed to have a congestion charge, it would be sustainable and we'd be able to fund our justice system here properly.

And also, the communes are as such purely for linguistic tug of war reasons (as well as pure greed from the Brussels political class, but then that extends to Flanders and Wallonia). Without the fanning if the flames from foreign adventurers (mostly from Flanders), the issue of suppressing the communes would be marginal : they only exist because Francophones see them as the last line of institutional defence if the Flemish parties block the region.

But yes, it's time many Brussels politicians look at themselves too.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Two people died because of the storm, both in Ghent and they were absolutely evitable.

A German couple on vacation was in a park (the park was still open), but also... why enter a park if there's a major storm ongoing. The dad died, the daughter broke their leg.

In a child daycare, a Ukrainian refugee of 5 years old died because they were playing outside and a tree fell on the children. The 5 year old died while her sister and many other children saw everything. This is absolutely not understandable. One of the children came home say their parents and he only can say three things: blood, police, child.

You have to be INCREDIBLY INCOMPETENT and an absolute moron to let people play outside in that weather...

Our national weather service also changed colour code to orange way too late for that province, only 8AM. We know the storm was incoming far before that, and they've slept on it. Overall they did a good job. But communicate earlier! We knew this was happening before the morning, it's way too late to only change a warning in the morning when the storm was ongoing. The city services also communicated the change in colour code way too late.

Pure incompetence from many people across the board. Some Ukrainian parents lost their child while fleeing from the war.

Tragic.

All responses you hear: "was this it?". I found the storm to be pretty severe, i don't know why people are like this, but minimizing a storm of this extent should not be done. It's what led to this kind of neglect.

Someone on a british forum called netweather said: "how did the human race survived up to now without warnings". I responded this. A bit of an ignorant and stupid comment from his part...



Justice services are starting a case for child neglect now and manslaughter, while the city council starts an internal audit on what went wrong.

[MaxQue]

Two people died because of the storm, both in Ghent and they were absolutely evitable.

A German couple on vacation was in a park (the park was still open), but also... why enter a park if there's a major storm ongoing. The dad died, the daughter broke their leg.

In a child daycare, a Ukrainian refugee of 5 years old died because they were playing outside and a tree fell on the children. The 5 year old died while her sister and many other children saw everything. This is absolutely not understandable. One of the children came home say their parents and he only can say three things: blood, police, child.

You have to be INCREDIBLY INCOMPETENT and an absolute moron to let people play outside in that weather...

Our national weather service also changed colour code to orange way too late for that province, only 8AM. We know the storm was incoming far before that, and they've slept on it. Overall they did a good job. But communicate earlier! We knew this was happening before the morning, it's way too late to only change a warning in the morning when the storm was ongoing. The city services also communicated the change in colour code way too late.

Pure incompetence from many people across the board. Some Ukrainian parents lost their child while fleeing from the war.

Tragic.

All responses you hear: "was this it?". I found the storm to be pretty severe, i don't know why people are like this, but minimizing a storm of this extent should not be done. It's what led to this kind of neglect.

Someone on a british forum called netweather said: "how did the human race survived up to now without warnings". I responded this. A bit of an ignorant and stupid comment from his part...



Justice services are starting a case for child neglect now and manslaughter, while the city council starts an internal audit on what went wrong.

Why an audit? Just fire the employee who sent the kids play outside or, if she was forced to do so because of a policy, fire every manager who was involved in the development of this policy.

[Zinneke]

Gwendoline Rutten demonstrates the sheer brazenness of the greed of a median Belgian politician : she first announces she is quitting politics because she was snubbed for replacing Van Quickenborn (remember, due to two people being killed because of a typically Belgian scew up. And now today she returns to take up a ministry in the Flemish government, following Bart Somers’ resignation.

Open VLD continue their march towards irrelevance

[DavidB.]

Rutten: "I can imagine there are many people who don't understand why I was first disappointed and didn't want to do national politics any longer, but that I'm now sitting here anyway. I can only say: that's life." LMFAO!

In every country politicians are happy to put aside their supposed convictions for a new job, but Belgian ones are uniquely shameless, transparent, and in-your-face about it.

https://twitter.com/SamvanRooy1/status/1721995403632189457?s=20

[Zinneke]

https://twitter.com/LesNews24/status/1721983358446567440

Van Cauwenbwrgh, the final boss of the corrupt Belgian politician, with a fitting quote.

"I've always thought that it's not going to be half an oyster that will be enough to buy me, you need a whole tub at the very least"

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Well 2024 will have the worst result for every iteration of Open VLD/Belgian liberals since the origin of the country. And it might not even be close. They might outrun 1946. Ironically, 1946 was also the year the Belgian communists did the best in and we're polling the best since than, actually even outrunning 1946 at this point.



They got 23 seats out of 212 at the time, while today, they're predicted to be around 20 out of 150. So communists might do better than their all-time best which is 1946, and liberals worse than their all-time worst which is also 1946.

To be fair though, i'm talking about Flemish liberals, Walloon liberals will do a bit better, so as a whole, it would be around 1946 due to MR. But that's because there's basically no competition on the right for MR in Wallonia.

[Zinneke]

A new low for the PTB after failing to condemn the Hamas terrorist attack : Hedebouw, not content with that cynical attempt to attract Default PS voters in the neo-ghettos of Brussels, has now come out and said girls as young as 8 should be allowed to wear the hijab at school. The PTB in Brussels are chomping at the bit at the idea of Israel-Palestine becoming a key electoral issue, alongside a bizarre obsession with criticising GoodMove and a proposed congestion tax (maybe because many of their activists aren't even from Brussels). They are already helping MR reclaim the capital in the process.

[Zinneke]

There's incidentally a developing scandal in Wallonia where senior government ministers knew about contaminated water being distributed to unknowing citizens of the Ath region. Céline Tellier, the ECOLO Minister in charge of water management, is under pressure to resign after it emerged her Flemish counterpart Zuhal Demir sent a letter to her office warning her.

Could potentially be a huge blow to ECOLO because in Wallonia especially these types of issues (natural preservation, campaigns against industrial pollution) are their bread and butter more than the overall progressive package.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/en/2023/11/16/flemish-socialist-leader-instructed-to-follow-therapy-following/



And this is why i vote communist and not socialist

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/en/2023/11/13/far-right-argues-for-limits-to-newcomers-access-to-social-securi/





Far rights platform in Flanders

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Groen sees coalition partner Vooruit moving further and further to the right. Naji: "It's not just these statements. The fact that Vooruit wants to take child support from parents who don't speak enough Dutch. That they want to determine which woman can or cannot have children. Rousseau also attacks stay-at-home mothers because they want to care for their children. There is a line and that is very difficult."

Does Groen still want to collaborate with Vooruit? "I can hardly find any common ground with Conner Rousseau anymore. We have lost an ally. An ally on the left that we need to fight against racism and discrimination. I hope that there are still enough allies within Vooruit to fight against the far-right."

Response from the Flemish greens

Rousseau is not only criticized from the left. Even Vlaams Belang rebukes the socialist. "I am in favor of freedom of speech, but advocating violence based on skin color is more than a bridge too far," says Vlaams Belang chairman Tom Van Grieken. In his own words, he would sanction a member of parliament who makes such statements.

Van Grieken does not believe that Rousseau should undergo therapy for his statements. "I would rather die than have to go to therapy for an opinion. That is as if we are in communist Russia. In therapy for an incorrect opinion, that does not belong in a democracy."

When even the far right leader owns you on a issue like this.

And people within Labor just say it's a mistake from the chairman and that everyone can say this... They just all defend him.

It's so disgusting. It's so disgusting. You just gave the far right a win.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

A new low for the PTB after failing to condemn the Hamas terrorist attack : Hedebouw, not content with that cynical attempt to attract Default PS voters in the neo-ghettos of Brussels, has now come out and said girls as young as 8 should be allowed to wear the hijab at school. The PTB in Brussels are chomping at the bit at the idea of Israel-Palestine becoming a key electoral issue, alongside a bizarre obsession with criticising GoodMove and a proposed congestion tax (maybe because many of their activists aren't even from Brussels). They are already helping MR reclaim the capital in the process.

I haven't seen them vocal on the issue at all tbh.

But their position on the conflict is basically exactly mine.

Besides, it's not just PVDA-PTB, there are more people on the good side here

https://twitter.com/sahouraxo/status/1722319686329573884

I have more of an issue who fail to acknowledge Israels atrocities (indiscriminate killings against clearly civilians).

This is not an issue where they'll lose voters on (the ones who take issue at this, were never gonna vote for them in the first place). And this basically ensures that Arab Belgians (and all muslim Belgians) vote for you.

Aside of that, it's also morally the best position. And failure to condemn Hamas attacks, this is probably framed (1) and at this point irrelevant (2).

Hamas would've never even been relevant if Palestine had their own state that was recognised by the European Union and the USA. Advocate for peace, diplomacy, push for it, (demand and sanction Israel + Hamas if they don't negotiate) and there won't even be a reason for Hamas to fight or for Gazans to vote Hamas.