Alabama Megathread: Bombshell allegations

[Maxwell]

Jones is a remarkably honest person, and I'm going to guess a lot of Alabamians feel the same.

Though I think this sentiment should be much more aimed at a message that is like "Make Alabama Great Again" or something. A message that rolls like this - lets face it, the leaders in this state have failed you with endless corruption, grift, demagoguery, and Roy Moore is the face of it. I want to be the person that is a crusader against this political culture and Make Alabama Great Again.

[IceSpear]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

[Holy Unifying Centrist]

That was a presidential election though, not a statewide election.

[Hindsight was 2020]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

This

[BuckeyeNut]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

[IceSpear]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

Tomblin and Manchin were re-elected in 2012, at the same time Obama was re-elected. Obama's re-election was the last straw for Racist WV Hicks, who will now never vote for any member of the anti-white hate group (i.e. Democratic Party) again unless they're a Republican mole like Jim Justice.

Manchin is going to get Blanched/Thompsoned/Manchined (will be a new term in a year.) His chances of winning are about as high as Ted Strickland sweeping the WV-esque parts of Ohio were.

[BuckeyeNut]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

Tomblin and Manchin were re-elected in 2012, at the same time Obama was re-elected. Obama's re-election was the last straw for Racist WV Hicks, who will now never vote for any member of the anti-white hate group (i.e. Democratic Party) again unless they're a Republican mole like Jim Justice.

Manchin is going to get Blanched/Thompsoned/Manchined (will be a new term in a year.) His chances of winning are about as high as Ted Strickland sweeping the WV-esque parts of Ohio were.

I will concede it is possible Manchin loses, but if he does, it will be far from a blow out.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

Tomblin and Manchin were re-elected in 2012, at the same time Obama was re-elected. Obama's re-election was the last straw for Racist WV Hicks, who will now never vote for any member of the anti-white hate group (i.e. Democratic Party) again unless they're a Republican mole like Jim Justice.

Manchin is going to get Blanched/Thompsoned/Manchined (will be a new term in a year.) His chances of winning are about as high as Ted Strickland sweeping the WV-esque parts of Ohio were.

I will concede it is possible Manchin loses, but if he does, it will be far from a blow out.

TFW when IceSpear comes back as the mirror image of JFern but about WV.

[Blackacre]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

Tomblin and Manchin were re-elected in 2012, at the same time Obama was re-elected. Obama's re-election was the last straw for Racist WV Hicks, who will now never vote for any member of the anti-white hate group (i.e. Democratic Party) again unless they're a Republican mole like Jim Justice.

Manchin is going to get Blanched/Thompsoned/Manchined (will be a new term in a year.) His chances of winning are about as high as Ted Strickland sweeping the WV-esque parts of Ohio were.

I will concede it is possible Manchin loses, but if he does, it will be far from a blow out.

TFW when IceSpear comes back as the mirror image of TNVol but about WV.

FTFY

[MT Treasurer]

Democrats don't lose in WV because of one poster on a bizarre political forum who expresses his unfavorable opinion of the state. IceSpear "bashing" WV has about the same impact on the outcome of that Senate race as Wulfric's endorsements.

Anyway, not sure if I can buy the "Jones can't win because AL is just too inelastic" argument. Was MA considered elastic at the federal level before Scott Brown won in 2010? Yeah, I don't think so. This is a race that will come down to turnout/enthusiasm and whether more "moderate" (I hate to use that term) Republican-leaning voters in the urban and suburban areas will consider voting for Jones. If Republicans take this race for granted there's a good chance they'll regret it. Sure, it's a likely R Hold, but this could be the 51st D seat (assuming they win AZ+NV and lose one of their seats, maybe MO or so, next year). I really don't think they'll win that Senate race in Tennessee even if Bredesen runs, but MS, AL and mayyybeee UT could get really interesting.

[BuckeyeNut]

Democrats don't lose in WV because of one poster on a bizarre political forum who expresses his unfavorable opinion of the state. IceSpear "bashing" WV has about the same impact on the outcome of that Senate race as Wulfric's endorsements.

If that's what you got out of the exchange with IceSpear, you should work on your reading comprehension. The point has nothing to do with IceSpear as an individual, but people like him being bad for Democrats.

AKA: Condescending, often classist, often coastal, liberal elitists.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Democrats don't lose in WV because of one poster on a bizarre political forum who expresses his unfavorable opinion of the state. IceSpear "bashing" WV has about the same impact on the outcome of that Senate race as Wulfric's endorsements.

If that's what you got out of the exchange with IceSpear, you should work on your reading comprehension. The point has nothing to do with IceSpear as an individual, but people like him being bad for Democrats.

AKA: Condescending, often classist, often coastal, liberal elitists.

And obviously it has more effect when someone more notable says something terrible like when Kos of DailyKos said "Be happy for coal miners losing their health insurance".

[Cactus Jack]

This thread has very nicely proven why I will never register as a Democrat again.

[IceSpear]

That could easily hurt Jones. People tend to take pride in the state they live in.

Jones has such little room to mess up.

I think the only people likely to care very much about this are already planning to vote for Moore.

I hate the double standard where republicans can get away with saying their country/state is terrible and we can do better. But if a democrat does it its automatically a travesty.

Heck Trump said the people of Iowa were stupid because cruz won and they voted for him by a sizable margin in the general election.

People say Democrats get slaughtered in West Virginia because of me or "elitist liberals like me" who look down on the state. Last time I checked, Republicans bash Massachusetts, Vermont, etc. far more than Democrats bash West Virginia, but it hasn't stopped them from winning there.

Like a staple of Bush's 2004 campaign was about how horrible Massachusetts is lol. Have Democrats ever done a similar strategy with West Virginia, or ANY state for that matter?

At the federal level, they do get slaughtered because of people like you.

Tomblin wasn't a fake Democrat and was a relatively popular two term governor. And the number of Democrats in the WV legislature is comparable to the number of Republicans in the Massachussets state legislature. Hell, 21% of lower house members are Republican in MA, while 36% of lower house members are Democrats in WV.

And contrary to what you may think, Manchin will win re-election.

Tomblin and Manchin were re-elected in 2012, at the same time Obama was re-elected. Obama's re-election was the last straw for Racist WV Hicks, who will now never vote for any member of the anti-white hate group (i.e. Democratic Party) again unless they're a Republican mole like Jim Justice.

Manchin is going to get Blanched/Thompsoned/Manchined (will be a new term in a year.) His chances of winning are about as high as Ted Strickland sweeping the WV-esque parts of Ohio were.

I will concede it is possible Manchin loses, but if he does, it will be far from a blow out.

TFW when IceSpear comes back as the mirror image of JFern but about WV.

What do you mean? I've always disliked WV, but I ramped bashing it into overdrive in early 2016 when I saw how badly some people were triggered (and still are, apparently) over a single insulting comment directed toward it. Made even funnier by the fact that literally nobody cares if you bash any other state like Florida, New Jersey, Alabama, Oklahoma, etc. Only West Virginia is a precious little special snowflake that needs a safe space, LOL the irony.

Hell, I've bashed Alabama almost as much as West Virginia since returning due to the Roy Moore stuff, and haven't heard a peep from anyone about it (some people even joined in bashing it!)

this is the guy that prosecuted the Klan. The actual Klan.

In other words, he's doomed in Alabama.

If I made this comment about West Virginia, at least 5 posters would have berated me for it, lol. Even though they literally had a KKK Senator, though I digress.

[PragmaticPopulist]

Only on atlas does the AL senate thread devolve into a discussion about WV.

My general rule of thumb is that I don't bash any state/district/county etc, because either way, it's unproductive. Now before anyone calls me an "MD coastal elitist", Trump won my precinct by double-digits, so I'm not exactly a "coastal elitist".

The main attraction in bashing constituencies that are considered the "other" is that it riles up the core base. The GOP (and to a lesser extent, Democrats) have learned that stoking cultural divisions is good for short-term political gain, but no one thinks in the long term these days, so it's unwise as a Democrat to bash states like AL and WV, and vice versa.

Getting back to the original point, I'll agree that what Jones said was a bit of a gaffe, but in a low-turnout special election, who knows if it'll matter. Either way, it would've been better if he hadn't said that.

Of course, maybe this was actually calculated, and what Jones said is what a lot of Alabamans are thinking.

[PoliticalShelter]

Part of the reason the GOP strategy of demonising the cities works is because cities are so disadvantaged under the American electrol system and suburbs/rural areas are over represented. A similar star gets by democrats to demonise rural areas likely wouldn't work out so well.

[Yank2133]

Only on atlas does the AL senate thread devolve into a discussion about WV.

My general rule of thumb is that I don't bash any state/district/county etc, because either way, it's unproductive. Now before anyone calls me an "MD coastal elitist", Trump won my precinct by double-digits, so I'm not exactly a "coastal elitist".

The main attraction in bashing constituencies that are considered the "other" is that it riles up the core base. The GOP (and to a lesser extent, Democrats) have learned that stoking cultural divisions is good for short-term political gain, but no one thinks in the long term these days, so it's unwise as a Democrat to bash states like AL and WV, and vice versa.

Getting back to the original point, I'll agree that what Jones said was a bit of a gaffe, but in a low-turnout special election, who knows if it'll matter. Either way, it would've been better if he hadn't said that.

Of course, maybe this was actually calculated, and what Jones said is what a lot of Alabamans are thinking.

Turning a state/city into a bogeyman is definitely strategic long-term. Why do you think Republicans do so well when they run against city and coastal elites? Democrats would be wise to make a bogeyman of a state where they're never going to win like Alabama, just like Republicans do to Massachusetts and California. It's not like Doug Jones has a serious shot at becoming a long-term senator. Democrats would be well-advised to brand their opponents as "no different than an Alabama Republican" in suburban districts. I guarantee you the median voter in one of those Romney-Clinton seats would have a negative view of the stereotypical Alabama Republican.

I don't think this would work.

Republicans can get away with this sort of thing because they are punching up (cities=elites). If Democrats do that with rural areas, it is them punching down. It just looks mean-spitted (even though a lot of them are just awful people).

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Jones is sending this image to his supporters

https://ci4.googleusercontent.com/proxy/oDzA734_vqedYYapLt51P0pz7Dl5NJlLBvte9fS85YEiNOV7nbdSgQxyl3h9YabZQA4-zuFeG5ePU4H5ZmFCU6aNGvxZ8rnQnslzJYnxMNxvlCZwXF0VLWYAana-dzteTeUFxnGj8MxcTd9HBSeverkLzv-z-4oJqw_NxCE=s0-d-e1-ft#https://s.bsd.net/dougjones/main/page/-/Jones_Roy-Moore-Outraises-Doug-Bar-Graph_20171024%20%281%29.gif

[IceSpear]

Only on atlas does the AL senate thread devolve into a discussion about WV.

My general rule of thumb is that I don't bash any state/district/county etc, because either way, it's unproductive. Now before anyone calls me an "MD coastal elitist", Trump won my precinct by double-digits, so I'm not exactly a "coastal elitist".

The main attraction in bashing constituencies that are considered the "other" is that it riles up the core base. The GOP (and to a lesser extent, Democrats) have learned that stoking cultural divisions is good for short-term political gain, but no one thinks in the long term these days, so it's unwise as a Democrat to bash states like AL and WV, and vice versa.

Getting back to the original point, I'll agree that what Jones said was a bit of a gaffe, but in a low-turnout special election, who knows if it'll matter. Either way, it would've been better if he hadn't said that.

Of course, maybe this was actually calculated, and what Jones said is what a lot of Alabamans are thinking.

Turning a state/city into a bogeyman is definitely strategic long-term. Why do you think Republicans do so well when they run against city and coastal elites? Democrats would be wise to make a bogeyman of a state where they're never going to win like Alabama, just like Republicans do to Massachusetts and California. It's not like Doug Jones has a serious shot at becoming a long-term senator. Democrats would be well-advised to brand their opponents as "no different than an Alabama Republican" in suburban districts. I guarantee you the median voter in one of those Romney-Clinton seats would have a negative view of the stereotypical Alabama Republican.

I don't think this would work.

Republicans can get away with this sort of thing because they are punching up (cities=elites). If Democrats do that with rural areas, it is them punching down. It just looks mean-spitted (even though a lot of them are just awful people).

Cities are also poor minorities, so how is that not punching down? Of course, that just makes it a great twofer for Republicans. I do think the hicks need be taken down a peg though. They never stop bashing Americans who live in urban areas, but the second you target them they have a spastic snowflake safe space SJW triggered meltdown.

[Yank2133]

Only on atlas does the AL senate thread devolve into a discussion about WV.

My general rule of thumb is that I don't bash any state/district/county etc, because either way, it's unproductive. Now before anyone calls me an "MD coastal elitist", Trump won my precinct by double-digits, so I'm not exactly a "coastal elitist".

The main attraction in bashing constituencies that are considered the "other" is that it riles up the core base. The GOP (and to a lesser extent, Democrats) have learned that stoking cultural divisions is good for short-term political gain, but no one thinks in the long term these days, so it's unwise as a Democrat to bash states like AL and WV, and vice versa.

Getting back to the original point, I'll agree that what Jones said was a bit of a gaffe, but in a low-turnout special election, who knows if it'll matter. Either way, it would've been better if he hadn't said that.

Of course, maybe this was actually calculated, and what Jones said is what a lot of Alabamans are thinking.

Turning a state/city into a bogeyman is definitely strategic long-term. Why do you think Republicans do so well when they run against city and coastal elites? Democrats would be wise to make a bogeyman of a state where they're never going to win like Alabama, just like Republicans do to Massachusetts and California. It's not like Doug Jones has a serious shot at becoming a long-term senator. Democrats would be well-advised to brand their opponents as "no different than an Alabama Republican" in suburban districts. I guarantee you the median voter in one of those Romney-Clinton seats would have a negative view of the stereotypical Alabama Republican.

I don't think this would work.

Republicans can get away with this sort of thing because they are punching up (cities=elites). If Democrats do that with rural areas, it is them punching down. It just looks mean-spitted (even though a lot of them are just awful people).

Cities are also poor minorities, so how is that not punching down? Of course, that just makes it a great twofer for Republicans. I do think the hicks need be taken down a peg though. They never stop bashing Americans who live in urban areas, but the second you target them they have a spastic snowflake safe space SJW triggered meltdown.

It is.

But Republicans get away with it because the beltway press doesn't give a **** about poor minorities.

But go after poor hicks in rural areas and the media loses their collective minds. It is a double standard that Democrats will never win.

[Fudotei]

The Media Corporation doesn't exist. Differences in coverage are due to the anchors, the partisan lean of the news org itself, and the corporate nature of the news companies. If we're going to say Fox never insults poor whites in the South, well, yeah

[IceSpear]

Only on atlas does the AL senate thread devolve into a discussion about WV.

My general rule of thumb is that I don't bash any state/district/county etc, because either way, it's unproductive. Now before anyone calls me an "MD coastal elitist", Trump won my precinct by double-digits, so I'm not exactly a "coastal elitist".

The main attraction in bashing constituencies that are considered the "other" is that it riles up the core base. The GOP (and to a lesser extent, Democrats) have learned that stoking cultural divisions is good for short-term political gain, but no one thinks in the long term these days, so it's unwise as a Democrat to bash states like AL and WV, and vice versa.

Getting back to the original point, I'll agree that what Jones said was a bit of a gaffe, but in a low-turnout special election, who knows if it'll matter. Either way, it would've been better if he hadn't said that.

Of course, maybe this was actually calculated, and what Jones said is what a lot of Alabamans are thinking.

Turning a state/city into a bogeyman is definitely strategic long-term. Why do you think Republicans do so well when they run against city and coastal elites? Democrats would be wise to make a bogeyman of a state where they're never going to win like Alabama, just like Republicans do to Massachusetts and California. It's not like Doug Jones has a serious shot at becoming a long-term senator. Democrats would be well-advised to brand their opponents as "no different than an Alabama Republican" in suburban districts. I guarantee you the median voter in one of those Romney-Clinton seats would have a negative view of the stereotypical Alabama Republican.

I don't think this would work.

Republicans can get away with this sort of thing because they are punching up (cities=elites). If Democrats do that with rural areas, it is them punching down. It just looks mean-spitted (even though a lot of them are just awful people).

Cities are also poor minorities, so how is that not punching down? Of course, that just makes it a great twofer for Republicans. I do think the hicks need be taken down a peg though. They never stop bashing Americans who live in urban areas, but the second you target them they have a spastic snowflake safe space SJW triggered meltdown.

It is.

But Republicans get away with it because the beltway press doesn't give a **** about poor minorities.

But go after poor hicks in rural areas and the media loses their collective minds. It is a double standard that Democrats will never win.

Yeah, you're probably right. Dems will never overcome the double standards and false equivalencies unless they call them out though. If anything they'll only get worse. Just look at how the media struggled mightily to justify why Hillary's deplorables comment made her "just as bad as Trump."

[NewYorkExpress]

http://www.metroweekly.com/2017/10/roy-moore-supreme-courts-gay-marriage-ruling-worse-pro-slavery-decision-1857/

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Does this hurt Moore in the general in anyway, or given Alabama's right wing viewpoint, will it help him?

[Rookie Yinzer]

I'm sure there are a substantial number of Alabama voters that believe black and white people shouldn't even be married, so this is a non-starter.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

That won't hurt Moore, sorry. While no one polls individual states on Gay Marriage anymore because it's settled law, I'd expect such a poll to still find a majority of Alabamans opposed to Gay Marriage.