Opinion of Open Borders

[Santander]

HP (not an Anarcho-Primitivist).

[White Trash]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

[heatcharger]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern. Immigrants in general boost the economy by buying stuff.

[Intell]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern. Immigrants in general boost the economy by buying stuff.

This is a stupid argument, nonetheless, and doesn't help the working class whatsoever, espeically with negatives of such open borders, under capitalist frameworks.

[heatcharger]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern. Immigrants in general boost the economy by buying stuff.

This is a stupid argument, nonetheless, and doesn't help the working class whatsoever, espeically with negatives of such open borders, under capitalist frameworks.

Um, care to elaborate? It's no doubt true that white Baby Boomers retiring in droves is going to put increased stress on the welfare state without structural changes.

[Devout Centrist]

Either you can have a welfare state and restricted borders or no welfare state and open borders, as for me I'll choose the former.

How do you explain Europe? For all of the Schengen zone's flaws, all of its members have a welfare state.

[White Trash]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern. Immigrants in general boost the economy by buying stuff.

Assuming that this would work, why does it require completely open borders as opposed to a simply easier system of immigration?

[heatcharger]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern. Immigrants in general boost the economy by buying stuff.

Assuming that this would work, why does it require completely open borders as opposed to a simply easier system of immigration?

I thought open borders was being used as a pejorative for a simpler immigration system, but nevertheless, like Devout said, even in an EU-style open border system, every country has its own, mostly functioning welfare state. However, this comes with a slew of logistical problems, so I'm not advocating for this to be implemented in the United States.

[Mopsus]

How would the American working class benefit from this policy?

Because the American population is getting older on aggregate which threatens the future of welfare programs that many in the working class rely on, so an influx of younger immigrants would help combat that concern.

This argument is fundamentally flawed, as it assumes that poor countries will always have an excess of young people - something that demographic trends have been working against for decades.

[America Needs R'hllor]

I mean, define "open borders," please.  If it is the expression given to an increasingly globalized world where it's easier to immigrate, then FP.  If it literally means borders that allow people to go from country to country unchecked, then it's a ridiculous and asinine HP.

[nicholas.slaydon]

Either you can have a welfare state and restricted borders or no welfare state and open borders, as for me I'll choose the former.

How do you explain Europe? For all of the Schengen zone's flaws, all of its members have a welfare state.

I was speaking specifically about the United States in that post.
If the US were to open its borders to the world we would likely see a flood of low skilled immigrants. However the counties in the european single market have relatively equal economic opportunity, so you don't see floods of people immigrating from one single market county to another.

[TheSaint250]

I mean, define "open borders," please.  If it is the expression given to an increasingly globalized world where it's easier to immigrate, then FP.  If it literally means borders that allow people to go from country to country unchecked, then it's a ridiculous and asinine HP.

[The_Doctor]

I mean, define "open borders," please.  If it is the expression given to an increasingly globalized world where it's easier to immigrate, then FP.  If it literally means borders that allow people to go from country to country unchecked, then it's a ridiculous and asinine HP.

[IceAgeComing]

I believe it is ultimately inevitable, but if done in a way that promotes gigantic sudden movements and permanent underclasses then will lead to reactionary politics and conflict.

[Lechasseur]

HP (not an Anarcho-Primitivist).

[Goldwater]

I mean, define "open borders," please.  If it is the expression given to an increasingly globalized world where it's easier to immigrate, then FP.  If it literally means borders that allow people to go from country to country unchecked, then it's a ridiculous and asinine HP.

[AN63093]

HP.

Immigration and the Courts are my most two conservative issues.  If I were hypothetically in Congress, I'd be willing to strike a deal on damn near anything else... medicare, taxes, defense spending, health care, foreign policy.. you name the issue and I could find a way to compromise on it.

Except on the Supreme Court and immigration.  I'd vote for nationalizing health care, a universal basic income, practically anything before open borders.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

HP (not an Anarcho-Primitivist).

[SNJ1985]

Borders may be imaginary lines on a map, as leftists are so fond of pointing out; but the cultural differences between the peoples they separate are very real.

[Goldwater]

Borders may be imaginary lines on a map, as leftists are so fond of pointing out; but the cultural differences between the peoples they separate are very real.

I don't know, the cultural difference between different areas of the US can sometimes be greater than, say, the difference between the US and Canada.

[Frozen Sky Ever Why]

HP.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Borders may be imaginary lines on a map, as leftists are so fond of pointing out; but the cultural differences between the peoples they separate are very real.

I don't know, the cultural difference between different areas of the US can sometimes be greater than, say, the difference between the US and Canada.

Yes that's the thing: there was nothing more destructive in terms of cultural diversity than the invention of nation-states. Suddenly everybody, including people who were quite happy to identify as inhabitants of some village or small province was required to adopt the habits, culture and symbolisms of  a distant capital. That is the poison of nationalism: in its very arbitrary splits between people, it bulldozes diversity of thought, and forces ordinary people to align with forces by nature opposed to their interests (I.e. The national elite).

[Deblano]

I believe that immigration should be made easier, not harder, but open borders isn't the way to go right now.

[Statilius the Epicurean]

Literal open borders are a horrible policy which only a deranged libertarian ideologue would advocate.

[Statilius the Epicurean]

Borders may be imaginary lines on a map, as leftists are so fond of pointing out; but the cultural differences between the peoples they separate are very real.

I don't know, the cultural difference between different areas of the US can sometimes be greater than, say, the difference between the US and Canada.

Yes that's the thing: there was nothing more destructive in terms of cultural diversity than the invention of nation-states. Suddenly everybody, including people who were quite happy to identify as inhabitants of some village or small province was required to adopt the habits, culture and symbolisms of  a distant capital. That is the poison of nationalism: in its very arbitrary splits between people, it bulldozes diversity of thought, and forces ordinary people to align with forces by nature opposed to their interests (I.e. The national elite).

That was progressive though; it's not like peasant culture was anything other than parochial and bigoted. Do you think a national health service could have been established if society considered everyone outside one's own parish a foreigner?