Please avoid making threats or wishing for violent crimes against any individual

[Torie]

We know that most posters are well aware of this forum policy, but a few have crossed the line on this matter, with regard to President Trump in particular. We understand that for many of you, the level of frustration, anxiety and even fear regarding Trump is high, but please respect this rule. Thank you.

The moderation team for the U.S. General Discussion board

[pbrower2a]

Does that include Divine Retribution? There were some domestic terrorists busted for an anti-Muslim plot, and I suggested that it would be fitting if they found that Muhammad would be judging them.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Does that include Divine Retribution? There were some domestic terrorists busted for an anti-Muslim plot, and I suggested that it would be fitting if they found that Muhammad would be judging them.

     This is a point that we discussed. We agreed that wishing for acts of God to befall people we don't like is somewhat distasteful and should be kept to a minimum, but not actionable in the same sense that wishing for violence is.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Out of academic interest, where does repeating the words of the current President of the United States fall on this scale? For example:

[publicunofficial]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

But it's ok to cheer to high heaven when someone dies......lol.

[pbrower2a]

Out of academic interest, where does repeating the words of the current President of the United States fall on this scale? For example:

It's ironic. The Mossad, which can go practically anywhere and destroy any enemy of Israel, scrupulously avoids doing harm to women and children. So why doesn't the Mossad do such overkill? Probably because it doesn't need to. One act of revenge is enough; there is no need for a blood feud. Do evil to Israel and die. But be a widow or orphan of someone who did such, and that is the end of the enmity.   

[Tintrlvr]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

I had a post deleted that contained a general wish for a politician to die that expressly disavowed ill will against that politician themselves. I think such a post would have to be against the rules to be consistent.

[Torie]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

[publicunofficial]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

"We pray for X's soul to make its way to Heaven."

"Soon."

[Torie]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

You're off my Christmas card list.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

I'm hoping the Secret Service give you a call. You sound deranged.

[The_Doctor]

Is this applicable to non-American leaders that are our enemies? I still can call for horrible things to happen to ISIS or the Kremlin right? What's the standard on that?

E.g I hope the Russian hackers who hacked our elections are taken out by covert operations that assassinate them? Or that Daesh is blown up?

I'm not interested in saying the same about our fellow Americans. Impeachment and prosecution for crimes is enough and the rule of law should apply as well as respect for it. To be clear, I do not wish ill on President Trump or his political aides physically; they are American citizens and they should be treated legally in commensurate proportion to their crimes, if any are found.

Mainly, I want to say bad things about the Russians and ISIS, but it's a politically tricky line, so I'm seeking guidance here.

[Torie]

Is this applicable to non-American leaders that are our enemies? I still can call for horrible things to happen to ISIS or the Kremlin right? What's the standard on that?

E.g I hope the Russian hackers who hacked our elections are taken out by covert operations that assassinate them? Or that Daesh is blown up?

I'm not interested in saying the same about our fellow Americans. Impeachment is enough and the rule of law should apply as well as respect for it.

Here's the thing. Sure, posting that you wish that someone would off some genocidal maniac with power is not out of line. But then the mods need to subjectively evaluate whether the person involved really deserves summary killing without trial and jury under some moral standard. And that can be tricky. We discussed this aspect too in the Cave.

In the end I think, the best we can do is say that if you post that someone deserves killing, you do so at your own risk, and when in doubt, just don't do it. Close cases will be resolved against you. Typically saying that about someone residing in a nation that has the rule of law and is a civil society would almost always be out of line I would think. In places that have brutal authoritarian folks in power, perhaps sometimes it would not be so out of line.

That's how I see it anyway. My fellow Mods may handle it a bit differently. There is no easy answer here. It really is all about good judgment and common sense. And just how necessary is it for one to post that someone needs killing? It typically would be more of an exercise in venting than anything else I would think.

Just my two cents.

[The_Doctor]

Are there legal issues, at work here? E.g, if I explicitly call for death of Russian hackers, who would be suing us? Russia? Ditto Daesh. Ditto calling for Putin's overthrow.

To be clear, I don't want to call for the death of the British Premier (I happen to like her). There should be an understanding Americans and our allies are off limits. Allies defined by the intelligence agencies, State Department, and other appropriate government agencies.  

Why not set the standard that any American citizen or American ally (throughout Bush, Obama, and Trump) cannot have death or harm called on them (unless they clearly and explicitly join ISIS, which in my mind constitutes renouncing American loyalty and citizenship). I've had liberals say some very extreme things about Trump, and that's equally disturbing to me (that's a little unhinged, personally).

I just feel we should have a pro-American/Western civilization/anti-Daesh viewpoint on these boards. This is an American political board and that should reflect our loyalty to the country.

[Torie]

The standard is as set forth above, and goes beyond what would raise legal liability. Calling for Putin's overthrow is fair comment. I would stay away from calling for his assassination however. And no, the Mods are not going to go through the exercise of just who, is whose ally, either. I think enough has been posted, so posters get the idea.

[Santander]

So basically, have some common sense and courtesy.

No problem, except on Atlas.

[I Won - Get Over It]

LOL, is it like.. kindergarten? Isn't it like.. obvious?


Whatever. Let crying babies show what they are made of.

[Kingpoleon]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

You're off my Christmas card list.

I never have been on your list. You're off mine, now.

LOL, is it like.. kindergarten? Isn't it like.. obvious?


Whatever. Let crying babies show what they are made of.

What kindergarten did you go to?!?! "Missy teacher, I HOPE YOU DIE A PAINFUL, LENGTHY DEATH SOON!"

[Badger]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

You're off my Christmas card list.

I never have been on your list. You're off mine, now.

LOL, is it like.. kindergarten? Isn't it like.. obvious?


Whatever. Let crying babies show what they are made of.

What kindergarten did you go to?!?! "Missy teacher, I HOPE YOU DIE A PAINFUL, LENGTHY DEATH SOON!"

LOL! That genuinely may be the funniest post you've ever made, man (at least intentionally)

I have this image of an absolutely adorable cherub like little girl talking any sweet lisping tiny Voice who suddenly goes like a cross between a female Stewie Griffin and the voice of Beelzebub

[publicunofficial]

Can I openly wish for Trump to die of bowel cancer? That doesn't seem violent or a threat.

See Pit's post above.

Ah. I intend to test the limits of the Mods' patience with this rule.

You're off my Christmas card list.

I never have been on your list. You're off mine, now.

LOL, is it like.. kindergarten? Isn't it like.. obvious?


Whatever. Let crying babies show what they are made of.

What kindergarten did you go to?!?! "Missy teacher, I HOPE YOU DIE A PAINFUL, LENGTHY DEATH SOON!"

Are there legal issues, at work here? E.g, if I explicitly call for death of Russian hackers, who would be suing us? Russia? Ditto Daesh. Ditto calling for Putin's overthrow.

To be clear, I don't want to call for the death of the British Premier (I happen to like her). There should be an understanding Americans and our allies are off limits. Allies defined by the intelligence agencies, State Department, and other appropriate government agencies. 

Why not set the standard that any American citizen or American ally (throughout Bush, Obama, and Trump) cannot have death or harm called on them (unless they clearly and explicitly join ISIS, which in my mind constitutes renouncing American loyalty and citizenship). I've had liberals say some very extreme things about Trump, and that's equally disturbing to me (that's a little unhinged, personally).

I just feel we should have a pro-American/Western civilization/anti-Daesh viewpoint on these boards. This is an American political board and that should reflect our loyalty to the country.

Completely opposed to this proposal. The idea that calling for the death of an American is morally worse than calling for the death of a foreigner is very debatable, and shouldn't be the official forum policy.

And for the US allies thing; So I would be banned if I say "I hope the people of Saudi Arabia pull a Nicholas II on the al-Saud family" but not be banned if I said the same about the Ayatollah?

[I Won - Get Over It]

LOL, I hope you somehow got my point

What kindergarten did you go to?!?! "Missy teacher, I HOPE YOU DIE A PAINFUL, LENGTHY DEATH SOON!"

I just said to them that I am not feminist but equalist and then I heard that

[DrScholl]

Are people seriously debating about who it is okay to wish death upon? You really shouldn't be doing that at all, because it's just wrong. Just don't make those sort of comments, period.

[SATW]

It is sad that this is even necessary. People who are calling for violence against democratically elected officials are not only a public threat to other people/themselves but also to our country's electoral system and democratic values.

Good people don't wish death on public officials they have never met.
Good people don't make death threats against elected officials.