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| | |-+  UK General Discussion: 2017 and onwards, Mayhem
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Author Topic: UK General Discussion: 2017 and onwards, Mayhem  (Read 129792 times)
Hnv1
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« on: June 09, 2017, 07:02:46 am »

Minority government with outside support of the DUP.

Let's see how the budget vote goes
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Snek!
Angry_Weasel
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« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2017, 07:22:34 am »

Think I'll be able to get a good deal if I go there?  I am thinking of doing something in February. I did Puerto Rico and Barbados this year and am going to see the eclipse and go home for the rest. Really think this could be a great bargain!
/exploiting a bad crisis
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2017, 09:17:04 am »

"May I increase my majority?"

"You May not."
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IceAgeComing
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« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2017, 09:26:49 am »

the title of the old thread actually would work for this one
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Silent Hunter
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« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2017, 09:44:28 am »

"May I order an Orange Order?"
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Angry_Weasel
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« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2017, 10:14:51 am »

How will relying on a 2 seat majority based on working with The Orange Order/DUP  affect policy?
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Silent Hunter
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« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2017, 10:15:48 am »

How will relying on a 2 seat majority based on working with The Orange Order/DUP  affect policy?

328 isn't a 2 seat majority, it's a 6 seat one. It'll probably make Brexit a bit softer.
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Angry_Weasel
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« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2017, 10:18:34 am »

How will relying on a 2 seat majority based on working with The Orange Order/DUP  affect policy?

328 isn't a 2 seat majority, it's a 6 seat one. It'll probably make Brexit a bit softer.

As in take longer? Will Brussels stand for it? I am guessing that means they still have to let EU citizens to work there and avoid tariffs? ...but still be able to opt out of regulations and civil rights?
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2017, 10:26:04 am »

I'd love to have Priti as the next Tory leader, but for very diffrent reasons than her right-wing fans.
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IceAgeComing
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« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2017, 10:43:55 am »

The thing is that if they negotiate for a softer Brexit (will they'll surely have to on the base of this result - doesn't mean that they'd get one naturally) it'd probably lead to an election right after since the DUP are unlikely to vote for Single Market access so they'd be reliant on the other opposition votes to get that.
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parochial boy
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« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2017, 10:48:15 am »

I'd love to have Priti as the next Tory leader, but for very diffrent reasons than her right-wing fans.

Because having a thick Thatcherite in charge would basically hand the next election to Labour on a plate?
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parochial boy
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« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2017, 02:51:50 pm »

Ok, another thought, is no-one faintly horrified by the prospect of the UK government relying on the support of the DUP in the midst of an ongoing constitutional crisis? The potential implications of this are huge.
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2017, 02:56:51 pm »

Ok, another thought, is no-one faintly horrified by the prospect of the UK government relying on the support of the DUP in the midst of an ongoing constitutional crisis? The potential implications of this are huge.

Here goes Farron chance to become Clegg 2.0. Btw, DUP sounds hilariously in Polish (dupa is Polish for an ass).

But yeah, I'm very concerned.
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krazen1211
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« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2017, 04:11:26 pm »

Really dumb move to hold an election on this malapportioned map that favors the Labour party.
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jfern
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« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2017, 11:30:53 pm »

Really dumb move to hold an election on this malapportioned map that favors the Labour party.

No, the map does not favor the Labour party.
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Shadows
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« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2017, 01:27:02 am »

May in a coalition of chaos with Christian Taliban !
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exnaderite
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« Reply #16 on: June 10, 2017, 11:56:30 am »

Am I the only one who watches Theresa May's interviews and patiently waits for the laugh track?
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krazen1211
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« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2017, 02:35:29 pm »

Really dumb move to hold an election on this malapportioned map that favors the Labour party.

No, the map does not favor the Labour party.

Sure it does. Labour seats in Wales and elsewhere are underpopulated.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #18 on: June 10, 2017, 04:11:16 pm »

All constituencies in Wales (whether Labour held or not) are smaller than average. This is a boost of a handful of seats at most. In England and Scotland (hey we can type that again) there's no particular correlation between the size of constituency and who typically wins it. Actually some of the largest constituencies in the country - typically inner urban areas with young populations or university towns - are Labour.
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ObserverIE
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« Reply #19 on: June 10, 2017, 04:12:32 pm »

Really dumb move to hold an election on this malapportioned map that favors the Labour party.

No, the map does not favor the Labour party.

Sure it does. Labour seats in Wales and elsewhere are underpopulated.

Labour seats in city centres are massively overpopulated.
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Green Line
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« Reply #20 on: June 10, 2017, 04:21:29 pm »

A truly fair map would be one that favors Conservatives.
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IceAgeComing
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« Reply #21 on: June 10, 2017, 05:45:52 pm »

A truly fair map would be one that favors Conservatives.

well the current map massively favours the Tories, so thanks for supporting changes to the boundary rules to ensure equality.
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JerryArkansas
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« Reply #22 on: June 10, 2017, 05:46:35 pm »

Can we please all American's from posting in British election threads forever.  I'll gladly not be able to post in these if we can get the hot takes from all these "intellectuals" above me taken out of these threads.
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Boston Bread
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« Reply #23 on: June 10, 2017, 09:54:24 pm »

Who were the voters who didn't support Labour in 2015 but did this time?
I'd categorized Labour's new voters into 4 groups:
1) New voters, especially the young, who had much higher turnout.
2) Voters that voted UKIP in 2015 but voted Labour before that, especially in Northern England and Wales.
3) Hardcore Tory remainers who didn't just vote remain but were committed to the EU and internationalism.
4) Strategic voters whose first preference is Liberal Democrat or Green but voted Labour to stop the Tories.
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IceAgeComing
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« Reply #24 on: June 10, 2017, 11:05:53 pm »

Going back the boundary things very quickly - yes, Wales has more seats that its entitled to.  That was an intentional malapportionment created when Wales did not have the Assembly in order to give it a bigger say in UK politics - Scotland had the same thing until 2005.  It was something created a long time ago - before Labour existed, I'm pretty sure.  When the Assembly gained primary legislative powers the plan has been to move towards equality for everywhere in the UK: had the Tories not made the decision to tamper with the rules that the boundary commission use in order to gain a political advantage (and mean that the boundaries drawn are actually worse; since the commission don't have the leeway that they need to produce good seats in a lot of places) then we'd have had a review by now and that discrepency would be fixed.  As it is, the 2012 review was killed by the Liberals because of the Tories deciding not to do Lords reform, and the current review will most likely be killed by the DUP since the Northern Ireland draft seats are TERRIBLE not just for them, but for Unionists more widely.

The sensible thing to do would be to move towards a compromise set of rules (650 seats, 10% threshold would work; the latter is basically as many seats as we have now, the latter is a threshold between the old one and the new one) and let a review go through - the involvement of all parties in the creation of new rules would give the commission's next review a mandate that the Zombie review and the current one did not have.
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