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| | |-+  Germany Legalizes Gay Marriage (June 30, 2017)
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Author Topic: Germany Legalizes Gay Marriage (June 30, 2017)  (Read 3966 times)
Ἅιδης
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« Reply #50 on: June 30, 2017, 08:42:13 am »
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Marriage equality is popular in Germany and Merkel still opposes it. Does anyone have an opinion poll on how CSU voters feel about gay marriage? All the polls I saw only show CDU or CDU/CSU.

I found this 4-year-old survey:

spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/mehrheit-der-csu-anhaenger-sagt-ja-zur-gleichstellung-der-homo-ehe-a-887559.html

According to the article, 52% of the CSU voters were in favor of same-sex marriage (as opposed to 40%). Two thirds of all Germans supported it at that time.

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Tender Branson
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« Reply #51 on: June 30, 2017, 08:44:56 am »
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^^^

That's the same poll I posted 10 minutes ago ... Tongue
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« Reply #52 on: June 30, 2017, 08:47:01 am »
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BTW:

Does anyone have an age-breakdown of MPs from the CDU/CSU that voted in favour and against ? I would assume that the ones who voted YES tend to be younger than the ones voting against.

It's seems you're correct with your assumption with regards to the CDU, but not the CSU.



CDU MPs under 50
Yes 31 (40%)
No 45  (58%)
Abstain 0
Not present 1

CSU MPs under 50
Yes 3 (11%)
No 24  (86%)
Abstain 1
Not present 0


CDU MPs over 50
Yes 36 (21%)
No 133 (76%)
Abstain 3
Not present 2

CSU MPs over 50
Yes 4 (14%)
No 22 (79%)
Abstain 0
Not present 2


http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/bundestagsradar-das-sind-ihre-abgeordneten-a-928365.html#abstimmung=21
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« Reply #53 on: June 30, 2017, 08:49:06 am »
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Thanks for posting.

While the under-50 CDU numbers are bad, the under-50 CSU numbers are disturbing.
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« Reply #54 on: June 30, 2017, 08:54:48 am »
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Another interesting fact:

All Muslim MPs voted in favour of gay marriage today, while many Christian MPs didn't.
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Fmr. Acting Southern Del. The Saint
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« Reply #55 on: June 30, 2017, 08:56:54 am »
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Will this have any effect on the election?
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« Reply #56 on: June 30, 2017, 08:57:15 am »
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To narrow the age brackets down even further...


CDU MPs under 40
Yes 12 (50%)
No 12 (50%)
Abstain 0
Not present 0

CSU MPs under 40
Yes 2 (22%)
No 7 (78%)
Abstain 0
Not present 0


CDU MPs over 60
Yes 8 (11%)
No 65 (87%)
Abstain 1
Not present 1

CSU MPs over 60
Yes 2 (11%)
No 14 (78%)
Abstain 0
Not present 2
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« Reply #57 on: June 30, 2017, 09:03:10 am »
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Will this have any effect on the election?

Nope, because the good economic situation will eventually outweigh the gay marriage issue.
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« Reply #58 on: June 30, 2017, 09:04:33 am »
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Gender breakdown


Male CDU MPs
Yes 46 (25%)
No 137 (73%)
Abstain 1
Not present 3

Male CSU MPs
Yes 4 (10%)
No 36 (88%)
Abstain 0
Not present 1


Female CDU MPs
Yes 21 (33%)
No 41 (64%)
Abstain 2
Not present 0

Female CSU MPs
Yes 3 (20%)
No 10 (67%)
Abstain 1
Not present 1
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« Reply #59 on: June 30, 2017, 09:23:14 am »
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How did the 35-or-so MPs with a migrant background vote ?

I guess overwhelmingly YES (like the Muslim MPs), because they are mostly from the center-left parties ?
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« Reply #60 on: June 30, 2017, 09:24:24 am »

Papier is Polish for "paper".
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« Reply #61 on: June 30, 2017, 09:28:06 am »
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Papier is Polish for "paper".
Damn Frenchies...
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« Reply #62 on: June 30, 2017, 10:06:18 am »
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Papier is Polish for "paper".

It's also Dutch for paper
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« Reply #63 on: June 30, 2017, 10:12:27 am »
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Papier is Polish for "paper".

It's also Dutch for paper

It's also German for paper. (though emphasized on the first syllable)
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« Reply #64 on: June 30, 2017, 10:14:15 am »
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Sad fact: They youngest member of parliament, Ronja Kemmer (28), voted against the bill.
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« Reply #65 on: June 30, 2017, 10:24:11 am »
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Sad fact: They youngest member of parliament, Ronja Kemmer (28), voted against the bill.

In complete defiance of her age and gender group. Someone wanted to be different. Tongue
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« Reply #66 on: June 30, 2017, 10:33:31 am »

Sad fact: They youngest member of parliament, Ronja Kemmer (28), voted against the bill.

In complete defiance of her age and gender group. Someone wanted to be different. Tongue

Atlas-style contrarianism.
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« Reply #67 on: June 30, 2017, 10:56:30 am »
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How did the 35-or-so MPs with a migrant background vote ?

I guess overwhelmingly YES (like the Muslim MPs), because they are mostly from the center-left parties ?

Well, obviously immigrant MPs from SPD, Greens, and Left all voted Yes.


Kai Whittaker (CDU, half-British, age 32): Yes.
Martin Pätzold (CDU, half-Armenian, age 32): Yes.
Cemile Giousouf (CDU, Turkish parents, age 39): Yes.

Alexander Radwan (CSU, half-Egyptian Coptic, age 52): No.
Michaela Noll (CDU, half-Iranian, age 57): No.
Charles M. Huber (CDU, half-Senegalese, age 60): No.
Heinrich Zertik (CDU, born as a member of the German minority in Kazakhstan, age 60): No.
Kees de Vries (CDU, Dutch-born, age 61): No.


I'd say an immigrantion background doesn't really play a role. Age does.
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« Reply #68 on: June 30, 2017, 10:59:20 am »
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How did the 35-or-so MPs with a migrant background vote ?

I guess overwhelmingly YES (like the Muslim MPs), because they are mostly from the center-left parties ?

Well, obviously immigrant MPs from SPD, Greens, and Left all voted Yes.


Kai Whittaker (CDU, half-British, age 32): Yes.
Martin Pätzold (CDU, half-Armenian, age 32): Yes.
Cemile Giousouf (CDU, Turkish parents, age 39): Yes.

Alexander Radwan (CSU, half-Egyptian Coptic, age 52): No.
Michaela Noll (CDU, half-Iranian, age 57): No.
Charles M. Huber (CDU, half-Senegalese, age 60): No.
Heinrich Zertik (CDU, born as a member of the German minority in Kazakhstan, age 60): No.
Kees de Vries (CDU, Dutch-born, age 61): No.


I'd say an immigrantion background doesn't really play a role. Age does.

Dutch people who oppose gay marriage exist outside of CU/SGP Shocked?
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« Reply #69 on: June 30, 2017, 11:02:40 am »
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And now the all-important question:

How did the gay and lesbian MPs vote ?

Tongue

I'm asking because Alice Weidel, the lesbian frontrunner for the AfD, is personally opposed to the introduction of gay marriage - because ... the constitution apparently says so.
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« Reply #70 on: June 30, 2017, 11:09:30 am »
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And now the all-important question:

How did the gay and lesbian MPs vote ?

Peter Altmaier (CDU): Yes.
Stefan Kaufmann (CDU): Yes.
Jens Spahn (CDU): Yes.

As I mentioned before, the sexual orientation is unconfirmed in Altmaier's case, since he maintains a "don't ask, don't tell" policy for himself.



Personally, I'd suspect that Alice Weidel doesn't actually believe that gay marriage is unconstitutional, considering that she gives a sh**t about her party's platform in her private life.  She just needs a reason to oppose it as AfD lead candidate, despite being lesbian herself.
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« Reply #71 on: June 30, 2017, 11:18:47 am »
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Oh, it seems I overlooked one.


Bernd Fabritius, the sole openly homosexual MP from the CSU voted... Yes.
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« Reply #72 on: June 30, 2017, 11:31:13 am »
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So, the seven MPs from the CSU who voted in favour of legalizing gay marriage can be broken down as follows:

Three women, four men... leaving women a bit overrepresented considering they make up only a quarter of their party's delegation in Bundestag.

One of the men is gay himself, two others are younger than 40.

The one who really stands out is Hans Michelbach, aged 68. I'm not really sure what his story is... maybe a close relative in the family who's gay? Tongue
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« Reply #73 on: June 30, 2017, 11:32:44 am »
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Only 5 of the ÖVP's 51 MPs are aged 40 or younger. Of which 4 are men (1 of Moroccan origin) and just 1 woman.

More than 90% of the ÖVP's representatives are old, Catholic Austrian men or women without migration background and mostly from rural areas.

The more I think about it, the more I believe their voting pattern would mirror the CSU.
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« Reply #74 on: June 30, 2017, 11:33:20 am »
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Is there any noticeable difference between how constituency and list MPs voted(even in general)? I imagine constituency MPs might need to be a bit closer to their constituents' views, seeing as they have a more direct link?
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