North Korea Mega Thread

[darklordoftech]

Learn from Iraq and don't listen to Graham. Get the international community to threaten China with multilateral sanctions unless they discipline North Korea.

[KingSweden]

Learn from Iraq and don't listen to Graham. Get the international community to threaten China with multilateral sanctions unless they discipline North Korea.

OBOR makes that (by design) profoundly unlikely

[KingSweden]

There's a good possibility that even if regime change happens the North Korean citizens won't go quietly. Many hate the regime but many are also brainwashed into loving it. Worst I can see is Vietcong-level resistance to a democratic North Korea or unified Korea.

Imagine the trouble West Germany had integrating the east, times about a 1000

[Senator-elect Spark]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Would you rather a pre-emptive nuclear strike to happen unexpectedly on Seoul or a major US city? I highly doubt it, we cannot jeopardize security. Swift action needs to be taken and implemented. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

[Senator-elect Spark]

There's a good possibility that even if regime change happens the North Korean citizens won't go quietly. Many hate the regime but many are also brainwashed into loving it. Worst I can see is Vietcong-level resistance to a democratic North Korea or unified Korea.

Imagine the trouble West Germany had integrating the east, times about a 1000

The cultures are radically different and as a result of the separation for a long length of time that have changed drastically. I have spoken with someone from South Korea and they say that they don't talk to the North and just disregard them.

[Confused Democrat]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

You're not making any sense.

Are you suggesting a nuclear strike on North Korea?

[Coraxion]

I think we should remove their incentive by withdrawing from the peninsula. It's not like the South has a terrible military; they have a formidable one.

[Devout Centrist]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Would you rather a pre-emptive nuclear strike to happen unexpectedly on Seoul or a major US city? I highly doubt it, we cannot jeopardize security. Swift action needs to be taken and implemented. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

Why would a pariah nation that exists solely to maintain a single family in power piss away all their deterrence in a pre-emptive strike

[Senator-elect Spark]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Would you rather a pre-emptive nuclear strike to happen unexpectedly on Seoul or a major US city? I highly doubt it, we cannot jeopardize security. Swift action needs to be taken and implemented. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

Why would a pariah nation that exists solely to maintain a single family in power piss away all their deterrence in a pre-emptive strike

Because they are radical and a dire threat to international stability.

[Frodo]

East Asia is indeed the Balkans of our time.  A spark there could ignite a world war like it did in August 1914. 

[Devout Centrist]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?

It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Would you rather a pre-emptive nuclear strike to happen unexpectedly on Seoul or a major US city? I highly doubt it, we cannot jeopardize security. Swift action needs to be taken and implemented. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

Why would a pariah nation that exists solely to maintain a single family in power piss away all their deterrence in a pre-emptive strike

Because they are radical and a dire threat to international stability.

That doesn't answer my question. Let me ask you this, why do you think North Korea developed nuclear weapons?

[ProudModerate2]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?
It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

You're not making any sense.
Are you suggesting a nuclear strike on North Korea?

No, I'm suggesting swift actions and destruction of their nuclear facilities. I'd rather South Korea and the US to act and conduct pre-emptive strikes. This would provide them with an advantage if North Korea is about to follow through on its threats. We are now aware of their capabilities. Trump already has many of these options in the playbook.

Let's get one thing straight .... trump has nothing "in the playbook."'
He has zero military background, and probably knows nothing about strategy and tactics.
He brags about "knowing more than ALL the generals," but in reality, he is big idiot when it comes to war.
So let's not inflate his narcissistic ego more than it already is.

[Virginiá]

All I know for sure is that I really don't want Trump calling the shots if we are going to approach the North Korea problem with military action. In fact, to be honest, I don't want a Republican at all after Bush, but if it has to be one, at least let it be someone who is stable and has some sort of connection to reality.

[ProudModerate2]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?
It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

You're not making any sense.
Are you suggesting a nuclear strike on North Korea?

No, I'm suggesting swift actions and destruction of their nuclear facilities. I'd rather South Korea and the US to act and conduct pre-emptive strikes. This would provide them with an advantage if North Korea is about to follow through on its threats. We are now aware of their capabilities. Trump already has many of these options in the playbook.

Let's get one thing straight .... trump has nothing "in the playbook."'
He has zero military background, and probably knows nothing about strategy and tactics.
He brags about "knowing more than ALL the generals," but in reality, he is big idiot when it comes to war.
So let's not inflate his narcissistic ego more than it already is.

But he does. He listens to his generals.

Why would he "listen to his generals," if he says he knows more than them ?
Some people hate when I compare our New Fuhrer to Hitler, but here is a perfect example where this correlation fits.
Hitler was known to belittle his generals, and when they presented strategy for large battles to him, he would argue with them, call them names and present his own plan that they had to follow.
Hitler would insist that his plans were best and that he "knew more than them" (sound familiar ?)
The generals (field marshals) would leave the meetings in anger and disgust, many times knowing that their orders would only get many of their own killed, and decrease the chance that their objective would succeed.
Narcissism .... it's the narcissism !

[Mike Thick]

Spark, North Korea has their defense system set up specifically to deter surgical strikes -- if we go, we have to go all the way. And that will be an extremely gruesome battle.

[pbrower2a]

There's a good possibility that even if regime change happens the North Korean citizens won't go quietly. Many hate the regime but many are also brainwashed into loving it. Worst I can see is Vietcong-level resistance to a democratic North Korea or unified Korea.

As things were understood about Nazi Germany on the brink of defeat around the time of the failure of the German offensive known as the Battle of the Bulge:

There's a good possibility that even if regime change happens the German citizens won't go quietly. Many hate the regime but many are also brainwashed into loving it. Worst I can see is Werewolf resistance to an occupied Germany.

.............

The brainwashing dies quickly. China will be supplying inexpensive radios that can be tuned as needed based upon demographic groups at the least (there will be differences between agricultural and industrial workers alone. North Korean youth will get access to pop culture of South Korea, which will destroy any cultural loyalty. There will be old American, British, and Japanese TV series dubbed into Korean. Don't fool yourself: China will have no use for the rabid nationalism of the North Korean regime that can be turned on a dime from anti-Americanism to anti-Chinese hatred.  China is no model of democracy, but even it has a difference from North Korea: what isn't specifically prohibited will be tolerated, in contrast to the practice in North Korea in which practically everything offered is an object of mandatory belief.

The Korean Workers' Party will be outlawed as were the Nazi Party in Germany, the Imperial Rule Assistance Association in Japan, and the Fascist Party in Italy in 1945,; the Communist Party of Romania in 1989; and the Ba'ath Party of Iraq in 2003. Its political outlets will be throttled. People culpable in the worst deeds will be prosecuted and possibly executed.

And what would cause the Chinese to overthrow North Korea? Firing missiles through Chinese airspace even if the ultimate destination is the USA. So if the missile is directed at Cleveland and follows a Great Circle Route, then the missile launch is an act of aggression against China, Russia, and Canada as well as the USA.       

[Inmate Trump]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Strike first and risk the lives of hundreds of thousands of South Koreans?
It's easy to say that when you're sitting behind your computer in the US. I bet you'd be singing a different tune if you were living in Seoul.

We cannot risk their safety and our safety, North Korea must be taken seriously and eradicated before they are able to launch that nuclear weapon. Eventually, war cannot be avoided. South Korea & Japan should have nothing to fear because the US is behind them.

You're not making any sense.
Are you suggesting a nuclear strike on North Korea?

No, I'm suggesting swift actions and destruction of their nuclear facilities. I'd rather South Korea and the US to act and conduct pre-emptive strikes. This would provide them with an advantage if North Korea is about to follow through on its threats. We are now aware of their capabilities. Trump already has many of these options in the playbook.

Let's get one thing straight .... trump has nothing "in the playbook."'
He has zero military background, and probably knows nothing about strategy and tactics.
He brags about "knowing more than ALL the generals," but in reality, he is big idiot when it comes to war.
So let's not inflate his narcissistic ego more than it already is.

But he does. He listens to his generals.

Why would he "listen to his generals," if he says he knows more than them ?
Some people hate when I compare our New Fuhrer to Hitler, but here is a perfect example where this correlation fits.
Hitler was known to belittle his generals, and when they presented strategy for large battles to him, he would argue with them, call them names and present his own plan that they had to follow.
Hitler would insist that his plans were best and that he "knew more than them" (sound familiar ?)
The generals (field marshals) would leave the meetings in anger and disgust, many times knowing that their orders would only get many of their own killed, and decrease the chance that their objective would succeed.
Narcissism .... it's the narcissism !

Yes, yes, yes to this entire post.

People always think there's only one thing in which to compare someone with Hitler.  Sure, Trump isn't ordering a mass extinction of a race, but there are sooo many more commonalities he shares with Adolf.

[pbrower2a]

It's inevitable and I truly hope he is the one to take action, he's proven that. We have to strike first.

Few criteria exist for preemptive strikes that are not also war crimes.

[Rookie Yinzer]

I would expect China to intervene if Kim Jong Un were legitimately thinking of striking USA first. They do not want all those refugees flooding into their country.

[OkThen]

Can anyone weigh in on if this is normal or ominous? Seems ominous to me...

https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/892863090349531136

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Can anyone weigh in on if this is normal or ominous? Seems ominous to me...

https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/892863090349531136

Seems more likely related to this:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/21/world/asia/north-korea-american-tourists.html

If they're banning Americans from visiting, wanting all Americans out by (nearly) the same date to fit with that without being a telltale for war. Which isn't to say Trump wouldn't start a war over Labor Day weekend.

[GeorgiaModerate]

The US has drafted a resolution in the UN Security Council that would impose severe economic penalties on North Korea, amounting to a one-third cut in its export revenue.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

The resolution will be voted on tomorrow afternoon and requires at least 9 yes votes from the 15-member council for approval, along with no vetoes from any of the five veto powers (US, UK, France, Russia, and China).

[Higgins]

If this passes I can't see Kim reacting well.

[GeorgiaModerate]

The Security Council has approved the US-proposed sanctions by unanimous vote.

[Badger]

The Security Council has approved the US-proposed sanctions by unanimous vote.

Cool.