Pros and Cons of Tammy Baldwin in 2020

[Fuzzy Bear]

LGBT isn't a complete deal-breaker nowadays.  Part of the problem with Baldwin is she's LGBT AND a bit of a lightweight.  What has SHE done to be considered the best and the brightest?

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

[Figueira]

I think we'll have a much better idea of whether this is a good idea in November 2018.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I think we'll have a much better idea of whether this is a good idea in November 2018.

Maybe, but I think Baldwin is likely to be re-elected in 2018 regardless.

[Beet]

LGBT isn't a complete deal-breaker nowadays.  Part of the problem with Baldwin is she's LGBT AND a bit of a lightweight.  What has SHE done to be considered the best and the brightest?

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

You're a Trump supporter, and you're talking about "the best and the brightest"? I get that he built a huge business and all, and maybe that was reason to think he might be smart at first, but after the past year, surely you can't still think he's all that bright.

[Figueira]

I think we'll have a much better idea of whether this is a good idea in November 2018.

Maybe, but I think Baldwin is likely to be re-elected in 2018 regardless.

I agree that she's favored, but I was also talking about her margin of victory and also the context--narrowly scraping by against a Some Dude while it's a Democratic tsunami nationwide and Walker is losing would not be a good look for her, whereas winning by seven points as the only winning statewide Democrat in Wisconsin on an overall disappointing night for Democrats would make me seriously want to support her in 2020.

[mcmikk]

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

[Fuzzy Bear]

LGBT isn't a complete deal-breaker nowadays.  Part of the problem with Baldwin is she's LGBT AND a bit of a lightweight.  What has SHE done to be considered the best and the brightest?

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

You're a Trump supporter, and you're talking about "the best and the brightest"? I get that he built a huge business and all, and maybe that was reason to think he might be smart at first, but after the past year, surely you can't still think he's all that bright.

Folks thought he was when he was running.  That's because in Donald Trump, folks saw a man who had achieved big and tangible things.  Things they could wrap their arms around as well as their minds around.

Folks still think this today.  Trump won.  And he won when everyone said he couldn't, didn't deserve to, was a scumbag, etc.  And he sits in the White House today, blatantly tweeting the ways in which he doesn't give a crap about the Beets, Hagrids of the Deep, or Coraxions of the world.  (That's not an attack; Trump really does take not giving a crap of what the critics say to new levels.)  He doesn't care; he won and he challenges the losers to get over it.  Period.  It's not St. Francis of Assisi, but that's not what Americans wanted in their President in 2016.  Research Assistants create public policy.  Trump built buildings.  Which is more lasting.  Which created jobs for real people? 

Combative, Trump may be, and to a fault, no less.  Narcissistic, Trump may be; it's a necessity for success in politics.  (Name 10 pols that aren't narcissists.)  But you can't call Trump stupid.  He took an inheritance and multiplied it a thousandfold.  He won the nomination of a major party when folks said it couldn't be done.  He won a General Election NO ONE said he would win.  No one "fixed" it for him, and if others have been lucky at that level,  I don't know about it.  Trump won because he knew more about people and more about politics than Hillary Clinton, period. 

And America hasn't come to a screeching halt now that Trump is in office.  The stock market is up, up, up.  North Korea, the can that both parties kicked for decades, may have an H-bomb, but the situation is hardly out of control.  The crises are ones whipped up by the anti-Trump media.  Confederate statues.  Counterdemonstrators starting unnecessary crap at rallies organized by alt-right morons.  Even there, Trump got it right; the main priority was not to coddle demonstrators or counterdemonstrators; it was to restore law and order so that ordinary citizens who wish only to live their lives in peace would be free of the pestilence of demonstrators protesting over something that, in the arc of history, is flat-out trivial and has nothing to do with the well-being of anyone.   Trump gets it in ways the rest of the political junkie world doesn't. 

This is what the average person sees.  And, frankly, this is much of what I see.  Trump gets what is and isn't important far more than a gaggle of folks who pride themselves on being "serious".

[libertpaulian]

A guy whose middle name is "Hussein" got elected, sexual orientation is not going to be a problem. A lot of white Republicans have no problem with gays and lesbians these days, and even when homosexuality was more controversial, gays were controversial than lesbians.

While that is true, lesbians tend to be more brash and come off as angry and bitter.

We'll have a gay man President before we have a lesbian one.  I mean, we couldn't even elect a straight woman as President last year, let alone a gay one!

[TJ in Oregon]

Baldwin is a relatively anonymous figure in Wisconsin right now, let alone nationally. She'd need something to give her limelight before a run would become plausible.

[Kamala]

Con: gay

Pro: gay

[America Needs R'hllor]

Con: gay

Pro: gay

She's probably my favourite for 2020, now that Franken's true colours were revealed. And this, to me, is one of her greatest pros.

[NewYorkExpress]

She has the advantage being right next door to Iowa, so she should do well in the Iowa caucuses.

However, her best chance of winning the nomination is if Warren doesn't run, as she's essentially a lesbian Elizabeth Warren on policy stances.

Given Democrats desire for a female nominee, she can beat Sanders head-to-head...if she wins Iowa, and holds on across the Midwest and Plains as her base. She'll probably need to quickly knock Klobuchar out, as she'll be Baldwin's biggest rival in Iowa, and beyond that I don't what she wins outside of the plains and Midwest at this time (except maybe New York and California...and even then only if Gillibrand and Harris are not still in the race)

She certainly can beat Trump, but it will be difficult, and she would have to pick a very moderate/conservative running mate to broaden her appeal, like Warner, Bill Nelson or John Bel Edwards.

All this is moot if she doesn't win in 2018 of course.

[Dr. MB]

Pros
-she's a lesbian
-she's a woman
-she's a midwesterner

Cons
-she's a lesbian
-she's a woman

The same things that will help her among some voters will hurt her among others.

[Beet]

A guy whose middle name is "Hussein" got elected, sexual orientation is not going to be a problem. A lot of white Republicans have no problem with gays and lesbians these days, and even when homosexuality was more controversial, gays were controversial than lesbians.

While that is true, lesbians tend to be more brash and come off as angry and bitter.

We'll have a gay man President before we have a lesbian one.  I mean, we couldn't even elect a straight woman as President last year, let alone a gay one!

If this is true, you also have to admit Hillary lost due to sexism in Middle America.

[Beet]

LGBT isn't a complete deal-breaker nowadays.  Part of the problem with Baldwin is she's LGBT AND a bit of a lightweight.  What has SHE done to be considered the best and the brightest?

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

You're a Trump supporter, and you're talking about "the best and the brightest"? I get that he built a huge business and all, and maybe that was reason to think he might be smart at first, but after the past year, surely you can't still think he's all that bright.

Folks thought he was when he was running.  That's because in Donald Trump, folks saw a man who had achieved big and tangible things.  Things they could wrap their arms around as well as their minds around.

Folks still think this today.  Trump won.  And he won when everyone said he couldn't, didn't deserve to, was a scumbag, etc.  And he sits in the White House today, blatantly tweeting the ways in which he doesn't give a crap about the Beets, Hagrids of the Deep, or Coraxions of the world.  (That's not an attack; Trump really does take not giving a crap of what the critics say to new levels.)  He doesn't care; he won and he challenges the losers to get over it.  Period.  It's not St. Francis of Assisi, but that's not what Americans wanted in their President in 2016.  Research Assistants create public policy.  Trump built buildings.  Which is more lasting.  Which created jobs for real people?  

Combative, Trump may be, and to a fault, no less.  Narcissistic, Trump may be; it's a necessity for success in politics.  (Name 10 pols that aren't narcissists.)  But you can't call Trump stupid.  He took an inheritance and multiplied it a thousandfold.  He won the nomination of a major party when folks said it couldn't be done.  He won a General Election NO ONE said he would win.  No one "fixed" it for him, and if others have been lucky at that level,  I don't know about it.  Trump won because he knew more about people and more about politics than Hillary Clinton, period.  

And America hasn't come to a screeching halt now that Trump is in office.  The stock market is up, up, up.  North Korea, the can that both parties kicked for decades, may have an H-bomb, but the situation is hardly out of control.  The crises are ones whipped up by the anti-Trump media.  Confederate statues.  Counterdemonstrators starting unnecessary crap at rallies organized by alt-right morons.  Even there, Trump got it right; the main priority was not to coddle demonstrators or counterdemonstrators; it was to restore law and order so that ordinary citizens who wish only to live their lives in peace would be free of the pestilence of demonstrators protesting over something that, in the arc of history, is flat-out trivial and has nothing to do with the well-being of anyone.   Trump gets it in ways the rest of the political junkie world doesn't.  

This is what the average person sees.  And, frankly, this is much of what I see.  Trump gets what is and isn't important far more than a gaggle of folks who pride themselves on being "serious".

Trump's success is due to his hereditary privilege and Middle America's misogyny against Hillary Clinton, so what it proves is the power these forces. As far as his personal accolades, he does have some genuine self-promotion skills that is true, but it wouldn't have been enough to get him to the presidency without those other two forces I mentioned. The mere fact that Hillary was born not only a woman in 1947 but middle class, makes her mere appearance in the same election as our president two orders of magnitude more impressive.

[Pennsylvania Deplorable]

Folks thought he was when he was running.  That's because in Donald Trump, folks saw a man who had achieved big and tangible things.  Things they could wrap their arms around as well as their minds around.

Folks still think this today.  Trump won.  And he won when everyone said he couldn't, didn't deserve to, was a scumbag, etc.  And he sits in the White House today, blatantly tweeting the ways in which he doesn't give a crap about the Beets, Hagrids of the Deep, or Coraxions of the world.  (That's not an attack; Trump really does take not giving a crap of what the critics say to new levels.)  He doesn't care; he won and he challenges the losers to get over it.  Period.  It's not St. Francis of Assisi, but that's not what Americans wanted in their President in 2016.  Research Assistants create public policy.  Trump built buildings.  Which is more lasting.  Which created jobs for real people?  

Combative, Trump may be, and to a fault, no less.  Narcissistic, Trump may be; it's a necessity for success in politics.  (Name 10 pols that aren't narcissists.)  But you can't call Trump stupid.  He took an inheritance and multiplied it a thousandfold.  He won the nomination of a major party when folks said it couldn't be done.  He won a General Election NO ONE said he would win.  No one "fixed" it for him, and if others have been lucky at that level,  I don't know about it.  Trump won because he knew more about people and more about politics than Hillary Clinton, period.  

And America hasn't come to a screeching halt now that Trump is in office.  The stock market is up, up, up.  North Korea, the can that both parties kicked for decades, may have an H-bomb, but the situation is hardly out of control.  The crises are ones whipped up by the anti-Trump media.  Confederate statues.  Counterdemonstrators starting unnecessary crap at rallies organized by alt-right morons.  Even there, Trump got it right; the main priority was not to coddle demonstrators or counterdemonstrators; it was to restore law and order so that ordinary citizens who wish only to live their lives in peace would be free of the pestilence of demonstrators protesting over something that, in the arc of history, is flat-out trivial and has nothing to do with the well-being of anyone.   Trump gets it in ways the rest of the political junkie world doesn't.  

This is what the average person sees.  And, frankly, this is much of what I see.  Trump gets what is and isn't important far more than a gaggle of folks who pride themselves on being "serious".

Trump's success is due to his hereditary privilege and Middle America's misogyny against Hillary Clinton, so what it proves is the power these forces. As far as his personal accolades, he does have some genuine self-promotion skills that is true, but it wouldn't have been enough to get him to the presidency without those other two forces I mentioned. The mere fact that Hillary was born not only a woman in 1947 but middle class, makes her mere appearance in the same election as our president two orders of magnitude more impressive.

Can't you just admit that Hillary was an awful candidate and that Trump understood Middle America better than her? Literally every single piece of data shows that people did not vote against Hillary because she's a woman. Some of the states where Trump had the biggest swings in his favor included Iowa, North Dakota, and Michigan. All of them have a female senator. It's the same stupidity seen in the argument that the Obama-Trump voters suddenly became white supremacists between 2012 and 2016.

Trump was born into wealth. So were thousands of other people who never amounted to anything. How many spoiled children of celebrities and other millionaires end up as drug addicts or blow their fortunes (like most lottery winners do)? Trump inherited money but then went on to do even more with it. He's successful. Period.

[Coolface Sock #42069]

Pro: from Wisconsin
Con: literally almost everything else

[Shadows]

A lesbian is not winning the Electoral college.

Sad but true, this country isn't there yet.

And yet the person in your signature will easily win working class whites, right.

A Black man with "Hussein" as his middle name who was called an Arab, Muslim Socialist & a Communist won the Presidency. A

How can White Lesbian woman from the Rust Belt not win? Someone with Hussein as his Middle name, whose surname rhymes with Osama, whose father is born in Kenya won. How many swing states do Conservative Southern Black people decide?

In the end, Democrats are all Socialists, Affirmative action, LGBTQ loving folks in the minds of most conservative voters. They won't vote for them anyways. The so-called Southern African Americans don't have any say in the EC outcome. MS, Alabama all are deep red states. Baldwin doesn't need NC to win the EC.

[Shadows]

LGBT isn't a complete deal-breaker nowadays.  Part of the problem with Baldwin is she's LGBT AND a bit of a lightweight.  What has SHE done to be considered the best and the brightest?

That's the real problem with Baldwin; she's not particularly special.

You're a Trump supporter, and you're talking about "the best and the brightest"? I get that he built a huge business and all, and maybe that was reason to think he might be smart at first, but after the past year, surely you can't still think he's all that bright.

Folks thought he was when he was running.  That's because in Donald Trump, folks saw a man who had achieved big and tangible things.  Things they could wrap their arms around as well as their minds around.

Folks still think this today.  Trump won.  And he won when everyone said he couldn't, didn't deserve to, was a scumbag, etc.  And he sits in the White House today, blatantly tweeting the ways in which he doesn't give a crap about the Beets, Hagrids of the Deep, or Coraxions of the world.  (That's not an attack; Trump really does take not giving a crap of what the critics say to new levels.)  He doesn't care; he won and he challenges the losers to get over it.  Period.  It's not St. Francis of Assisi, but that's not what Americans wanted in their President in 2016.  Research Assistants create public policy.  Trump built buildings.  Which is more lasting.  Which created jobs for real people? 

Combative, Trump may be, and to a fault, no less.  Narcissistic, Trump may be; it's a necessity for success in politics.  (Name 10 pols that aren't narcissists.)  But you can't call Trump stupid.  He took an inheritance and multiplied it a thousandfold.  He won the nomination of a major party when folks said it couldn't be done.  He won a General Election NO ONE said he would win.  No one "fixed" it for him, and if others have been lucky at that level,  I don't know about it.  Trump won because he knew more about people and more about politics than Hillary Clinton, period. 

And America hasn't come to a screeching halt now that Trump is in office.  The stock market is up, up, up.  North Korea, the can that both parties kicked for decades, may have an H-bomb, but the situation is hardly out of control.  The crises are ones whipped up by the anti-Trump media.  Confederate statues.  Counterdemonstrators starting unnecessary crap at rallies organized by alt-right morons.  Even there, Trump got it right; the main priority was not to coddle demonstrators or counterdemonstrators; it was to restore law and order so that ordinary citizens who wish only to live their lives in peace would be free of the pestilence of demonstrators protesting over something that, in the arc of history, is flat-out trivial and has nothing to do with the well-being of anyone.   Trump gets it in ways the rest of the political junkie world doesn't. 

This is what the average person sees.  And, frankly, this is much of what I see.  Trump gets what is and isn't important far more than a gaggle of folks who pride themselves on being "serious".

Trump has done nothing to the economy. Stock market was booming for the last many years & Stock market has gone up under all Presidencies (Check the data of early stock market numbers). Besides they mean nothing for the ordinary people.

Let us talk about what Trump has done -

1 - Approved Keystone XL which has already leaked. Left Paris Deal (Only country), allowed coal companies to dump waste in the water & so on. He is threatening the planet your grandchildren will inherit.

2 - He is cutting taxes on gigantic corporations while barely giving anything to the middle class (with tax increases from many). He is repealing the Estate Tax, AMT which is for rich folks.

3 - He is taking healthcare away from 20-25M people through the ACA repeal which will bankrupt people & will cause 50K estimated deaths as per studies

4 - The Trump Budget proposed a 1.5 T $ cut to Medicare, Medicaid & a big cut to SS as well. You can add Meals on Wheels, LIHEAP & so on. All cuts to balance tax cuts for the wealthy

5 - He has encouraged division & hatred in a way like never seen before. He has continued to scapegoat minorities, dissenters & has attacked them.

What good has he done? Apart from hurting working class, middle class, giving tax cuts to rich people, severely damaging global climate change efforts, cutting healthcare.

You are concerned about Foreign policy right? Those endless wars? Trump has ensured a massacre of the Middle East. 1000s of innocent civilians are getting starved, killed by Saudis as US continues to fill their planes & sell them weapons. Trump has no major allies. The EU hates him. He is a failure in International diplomacy.

What has done for people like you that you so like? Is is the repeal of the Estate tax? Or the 20% Corporate Tax?