$1.5 Trillion GOP Tax Cut Thread

[pbrower2a]

I suppose you don't want to talk about how the economy was doing when the Bush tax cuts fully took effect circa 2008-2010.

This is at least the second time in the last couple weeks you have tried to connect the Bush tax cuts to the Financial Crisis. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about because those are totally unrelated to each other. Stop.

The Bush Tax cuts were sold as an economic stimulus, which was obviously an epic fail.

It was sold as an economic stimulus to the early 2000s recession , which indeed it was . The 2008 crash still would have happened without the tax cuts , so no the tax cuts and the crash are not related.

Big infusions of capital into the hands of economic elites tend to go into destructive bubbles. Yes, it is the bubble that does the harm, first by drawing assets away from other activities and committing the political order to servicing that bubble; the inevitable panic comes when people come to realize that the assets in which they invested are worthless.    

The Trump tax cuts may be shaped not so much as stimulus as they are giving economic elites rewards for being rich and powerful.

Count on another 2008-style crash leading to a 1929-style crash.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Heller proposes an amendment, #1146 (tax credits for families with children). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 98-0:

Not Voting - 2
Blunt (R-MO)
Menendez (D-NJ)

(I am editing posts to add in the NAY and Not Voting lists as they become available)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Sanders proposes an amendment, #1120 (prohibiting the consideration of tax cuts to the top 1% under reconciliation). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 46-52.

NAYs ---52
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heitkamp (D-ND)(!)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 2
Blunt (R-MO)
Menendez (D-NJ)

[Virginiá]

Republicans say they can’t figure out how to not cut taxes for the rich

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/18/16496190/mnuchin-rule

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He really needs to stop saying things.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Ms. Collins proposes an amendment, #1151 (To provide tax relief to small businesses and to include provisions to prevent upper-income taxpayers from sheltering income from taxation at the appropriate rate). The amendment is agreed to by voice vote.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Do people not get that small business tax rate also will go dramatically done as well .

[AtorBoltox]

Mr. Sanders proposes an amendment, #1120 (prohibiting the consideration of tax cuts to the top 1% under reconciliation). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 46-52.

NAYs ---52
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heitkamp (D-ND)(!)

Muh populism

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Wyden proposes an amendment, #1302 (To strike the reconciliation instructions relating to tax reform). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 47-52.

NAYs ---52
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 1
Menendez (D-NJ)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Ms. Capito proposes an amendment, #1393(To help provide tax relief to middle-class Americans by reducing deductibility for Federal tax purposes, of federal deductions, such as the state and local tax deduction which disproportionally favors high-income individuals). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 52-47.

NAYs ---47
Baldwin (D-WI)
Bennet (D-CO)
Blumenthal (D-CT)
Booker (D-NJ)
Brown (D-OH)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Cardin (D-MD)
Carper (D-DE)
Casey (D-PA)
Coons (D-DE)
Cortez Masto (D-NV)
Donnelly (D-IN)
Duckworth (D-IL)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Franken (D-MN)
Gillibrand (D-NY)
Harris (D-CA)
Hassan (D-NH)
Heinrich (D-NM)
Heitkamp (D-ND)
Hirono (D-HI)
Kaine (D-VA)
King (I-ME)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Leahy (D-VT)
Markey (D-MA)
McCaskill (D-MO)
Merkley (D-OR)
Murphy (D-CT)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Paul (R-KY)(!)
Peters (D-MI)
Reed (D-RI)
Sanders (I-VT)
Schatz (D-HI)
Schumer (D-NY)
Shaheen (D-NH)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Tester (D-MT)
Udall (D-NM)
Van Hollen (D-MD)
Warner (D-VA)
Warren (D-MA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wyden (D-OR)

Not Voting - 1
Menendez (D-NJ)

[riceowl]

Ms. Capito proposes an amendment, #1393(To help provide tax relief to middle-class Americans by reducing deductibility for Federal tax purposes, of federal deductions, such as the state and local tax deduction which disproportionally favors high-income individuals). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 52-47.

Oh no.

[boske94]

Almost all proposed amendments are approved or being rejected with 52-47 (Menendez not voting) etc along party lines except some where Manchin or Heitkamp vote with Rs.

[mvd10]

Ms. Capito proposes an amendment, #1393(To help provide tax relief to middle-class Americans by reducing deductibility for Federal tax purposes, of federal deductions, such as the state and local tax deduction which disproportionally favors high-income individuals). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 52-47.

Oh no.

The senate always was going to vote for repealing the State and Local deduction anyway, there aren't much blue state (or high-tax state ) Republicans in the senate. But states like California, NY and NJ have a lot of suburban wealthy Republican districts, and they are the ones that probably will sink tax reform.

Anyway, personally I support repealing the state and local tax deduction if it's necessary for tax reform, but I understand why people in a blue states are pissed off by this, especially since there is a net money flow from blue states to red states (though that doesn't mean there is a money flow from Democrats to Republicans as wealthy people in rural areas/red states are extremely Republican while poor people in these rural areas aren't that Republican. Meanwhile in wealthy blue states there isn't really a correlation between income and voting habits).

[boske94]

Maybe people in blue costal states should press state or local governments to reduce tax burden so they don't need deductions.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Ms. Cantwell proposes an amendment, #1141 (To prevent legislation that would raise taxes on middle class families by double-taxing income already taxed at the state or local level from being considered under reconciliation). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 47-52.

NAYs ---52
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 1
Menendez (D-NJ)

[riceowl]

Maybe people in blue costal states should press state or local governments to reduce tax burden so they don't need deductions.

I'm from Texas y'all. Cruz and Cornyn should be all too aware of how high our property taxes are due to no state income tax. And yet here we are...

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Warner proposes an Amendment, #1138 (To prevent PAYGO exception from being considered under reconciliation). The Amendment FAILS by a vote of 47-51.

NAYs ---51
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

[Kingpoleon]

Won’t be on for long, but I thought I should note that if a 5% VAT would raise $1.8 trillion(which I saw in one source), a 17.5% VAT would raise $6.2 trillion, and even a 10% VAT would raise $3.6 trillion. At that rate, surely some way could be found to balance the budget.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Won’t be on for long, but I thought I should note that if a 5% VAT would raise $1.8 trillion(which I saw in one source), a 17.5% VAT would raise $6.2 trillion, and even a 10% VAT would raise $3.6 trillion. At that rate, surely some way could be found to balance the budget.

I think cutting military spending , and taxing overseas havens would be better.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Flake proposes an amendment, #1178 (To make the American tax system simpler and fairer). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 98-0.

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Ms. Baldwin proposes an amendment, #1139 (To prohibit reconciliation legislation that would increase the deficit or reduce a surplus). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 47-51.

NAYs ---51
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

[GeorgiaModerate]

Mr. Flake proposes an amendment, #1178 (To make the American tax system simpler and fairer). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 98-0.

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

Maybe they should also add one to ensure that everyone has decent and affordable health care, or some other platitude with zero details.  Good grief.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Flake proposes an amendment, #1178 (To make the American tax system simpler and fairer). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 98-0.

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

Maybe they should also add one to ensure that everyone has decent and affordable health care, or some other platitude with zero details.  Good grief.

You do realize that most amendment proposals are for purpose of messaging rather than policy, right?

[GeorgiaModerate]

Mr. Flake proposes an amendment, #1178 (To make the American tax system simpler and fairer). The amendment is adopted by a vote of 98-0.

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

Maybe they should also add one to ensure that everyone has decent and affordable health care, or some other platitude with zero details.  Good grief.

You do realize that most amendment proposals are for purpose of messaging rather than policy, right?

Yes, but this one just struck me as a ridiculous example.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Ms. Heitkamp proposes an amendment, #1228 (To Prevent tax increases on those earning $250k or less from being considered under reconciliation). The amendment FAILS by a vote of 47-51.

NAYs ---51
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Burr (R-NC)
Capito (R-WV)
Cassidy (R-LA)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Cotton (R-AR)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Daines (R-MT)
Enzi (R-WY)
Ernst (R-IA)
Fischer (R-NE)
Flake (R-AZ)
Gardner (R-CO)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kennedy (R-LA)
Lankford (R-OK)
Lee (R-UT)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Perdue (R-GA)
Portman (R-OH)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rounds (R-SD)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sasse (R-NE)
Scott (R-SC)
Shelby (R-AL)
Strange (R-AL)
Sullivan (R-AK)
Thune (R-SD)
Tillis (R-NC)
Toomey (R-PA)
Wicker (R-MS)
Young (R-IN)

Not Voting - 2
Cochran (R-MS)
Menendez (D-NJ)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Mr. Rubio proposes an amendment, #1205 (To establish a deficit-neutral reserve fund relating to tax cuts for working American families). The amendment is adopted by voice vote.