Tulsi in Iowa, impresses many.
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  Tulsi in Iowa, impresses many.
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Author Topic: Tulsi in Iowa, impresses many.  (Read 6767 times)
Beet
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« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2017, 05:19:41 PM »

I knew it. Tulsi Gabbard will be the Democratic nominee, if not her than Kamala Harris.

At least she's started to speak out in favor of diplomacy on North Korea. But given her background and shady connections I just don't trust her. Also, she could use some teeth whitening strips.
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Anti-Bothsidesism
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« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2017, 05:26:06 PM »

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IceSpear
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« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2017, 05:27:51 PM »

I knew it. Tulsi Gabbard will be the Democratic nominee, if not her than Kamala Harris.

At least she's started to speak out in favor of diplomacy on North Korea. But given her background and shady connections I just don't trust her. Also, she could use some teeth whitening strips.

It's far too early to say that. We don't even know if she'll run, and 90% of Democrats probably don't even know who she is right now. Same for Harris.
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Dr. MB
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« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2017, 05:30:42 PM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.
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Beet
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« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2017, 05:30:49 PM »
« Edited: October 17, 2017, 05:36:14 PM by Beet »

I knew it. Tulsi Gabbard will be the Democratic nominee, if not her than Kamala Harris.

At least she's started to speak out in favor of diplomacy on North Korea. But given her background and shady connections I just don't trust her. Also, she could use some teeth whitening strips.

It's far too early to say that. We don't even know if she'll run, and 90% of Democrats probably don't even know who she is right now. Same for Harris.

She has the "hype" factor. Although in her case it isn't all hype as she actually did do something newsworthy. But let's just say she knows how to promote herself. She has the "magic". Harris also does, to a similar extent, but from a more establishment oriented angle. So far those are the only two candidates with the "magic" factor. "Magic" factor candidates always become supercharged. You can always tell from the social media response, and live speech/rally response.

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Lots of reasons. She still has good relations with her very conservative roots, and one gets the sense she only switched to a Democrat because it's important in Hawaii politics to be a Democrat, and she saw how "Muslims disrespected women" during her tour in Iraq. Her ties with the BJP, especially Modi during the time he was heavily criticized for the Gujarati riots. There is a whiff of Islamophobia around her. As late as age 24 she was still opposed to gay rights, which is something very unusual for her generation. Then, there is her secret visit to war criminal Assad. It's one thing to oppose intervention in Syria, a lot of people do, but going out of her way to visit a guy who gassed kids? And her whole tone of it was just fanatical. There is just something off about her. There always is with these super-charged self-promoters. Whether it be total failures like Weiner or successes like Obama, whatever it is, they never turn out to be what they present themselves to be. Whenever I get the sense from a politician that they are a super suave self-promoter I don't trust them. Sadly though, these are the types that Americans love.
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IceSpear
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« Reply #30 on: October 17, 2017, 05:39:11 PM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Well, she has railed against "homosexual extremists" on multiple occasions so I don't trust her "evolution" on that issue.

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Against civil unions? Really? Even Dubya supported those in 2004!

She has some problematic stances on foreign policy. Such as constant Assad apologism and buying into conspiracies about how he never used chemical weapons and it was a false flag.

And the cult around her is annoying. As if she's some martyr who got turned into stone by Debbie Wasserman Schultz's Medusa gaze just because she endorsed Bernie and VOLUNTARILY resigned from the DNC. Roll Eyes
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Dr. MB
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« Reply #31 on: October 17, 2017, 05:53:26 PM »

I knew it. Tulsi Gabbard will be the Democratic nominee, if not her than Kamala Harris.

At least she's started to speak out in favor of diplomacy on North Korea. But given her background and shady connections I just don't trust her. Also, she could use some teeth whitening strips.

It's far too early to say that. We don't even know if she'll run, and 90% of Democrats probably don't even know who she is right now. Same for Harris.

She has the "hype" factor. Although in her case it isn't all hype as she actually did do something newsworthy. But let's just say she knows how to promote herself. She has the "magic". Harris also does, to a similar extent, but from a more establishment oriented angle. So far those are the only two candidates with the "magic" factor. "Magic" factor candidates always become supercharged. You can always tell from the social media response, and live speech/rally response.

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Lots of reasons. She still has good relations with her very conservative roots, and one gets the sense she only switched to a Democrat because it's important in Hawaii politics to be a Democrat, and she saw how "Muslims disrespected women" during her tour in Iraq. Her ties with the BJP, especially Modi during the time he was heavily criticized for the Gujarati riots. There is a whiff of Islamophobia around her. As late as age 24 she was still opposed to gay rights, which is something very unusual for her generation. Then, there is her secret visit to war criminal Assad. It's one thing to oppose intervention in Syria, a lot of people do, but going out of her way to visit a guy who gassed kids? And her whole tone of it was just fanatical. There is just something off about her. There always is with these super-charged self-promoters. Whether it be total failures like Weiner or successes like Obama, whatever it is, they never turn out to be what they present themselves to be. Whenever I get the sense from a politician that they are a super suave self-promoter I don't trust them. Sadly though, these are the types that Americans love.
I read the Wikipedia article on her which describes some of her positions, it does mention she still is "personally opposed" to gay marriage but believes it should be legal. She attributes this to her time in Iraq. For me, even as someone who is bisexual, as long as she respects the law and doesn't fight against gay rights it's fine.

She did say Assad is a dictator, but still the Syrian stance is a bit strange. I don't support overthrowing Assad, not because I support him, which I don't, but instead because I'm a non-interventionist.

Still, her positions are more similar to mine than most of the other potential candidates, so she has my endorsement until further notice.
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Blackacre
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« Reply #32 on: October 17, 2017, 06:36:29 PM »

I hate her for the same reason I hate Andrew Cuomo. She's very craven, very opportunistic. Her spat with the DNC, I don't believe that was genuine.

Also, yeah, she's islamophobic and anti-gay, and frankly I don't give a rat's ass if she thinks same-sex marriage should be legal, because the real battles right now are over LGBTQ homelessness rates and employment and housing discrimination against members of the LGBTQ community. There's no way she'd be a leader on those issues.

Basically she's like 75% of what I dislike about Bernie with none of the positives about Bernie. (and for all I attack him, there are real positives about Bernie) I didn't vote for Bernie, why would I vote for the off-brand, 10x worse version?
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tosk
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« Reply #33 on: October 17, 2017, 08:55:11 PM »

If we somehow end up with a Tulsi vs Trump general in 2020, I'm writing in Scaramucci.

he'll already run the world by 2020
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Starry Eyed Jagaloon
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« Reply #34 on: October 17, 2017, 09:05:24 PM »

If we somehow end up with a Tulsi vs Trump general in 2020, I'm writing in Scaramucci.

he'll already run the world by 2020
Why does he think he's relevant again?
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jfern
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« Reply #35 on: October 17, 2017, 11:37:54 PM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Well, she has railed against "homosexual extremists" on multiple occasions so I don't trust her "evolution" on that issue.

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Against civil unions? Really? Even Dubya supported those in 2004!

She has some problematic stances on foreign policy. Such as constant Assad apologism and buying into conspiracies about how he never used chemical weapons and it was a false flag.

And the cult around her is annoying. As if she's some martyr who got turned into stone by Debbie Wasserman Schultz's Medusa gaze just because she endorsed Bernie and VOLUNTARILY resigned from the DNC. Roll Eyes

She still endorsed SSM before the last Democratic Presidential nominee did.

Assad like Saddam is a bad person, but that doesn't justify a war. We have plenty of bad people (like the House of Saud) that are our "allies".
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AtorBoltox
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« Reply #36 on: October 18, 2017, 01:04:09 AM »

Links to Hindu nationalist groups, Islamophobia, opposition to gay rights, supports Assad over actual left wing resistance in Rojava. What exactly about her is supposed to be progressive?
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jfern
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« Reply #37 on: October 18, 2017, 01:10:51 AM »

Links to Hindu nationalist groups, Islamophobia, opposition to gay rights, supports Assad over actual left wing resistance in Rojava. What exactly about her is supposed to be progressive?

She supports arming the Kurds.
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2016/01/arming-the-kurds-rising-house-dem-finds-common-cause-with-major-bgr-client/

And she opposes Trump's travel ban and supports SSM.
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GoTfan
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« Reply #38 on: October 18, 2017, 01:11:32 AM »

Links to Hindu nationalist groups, Islamophobia, opposition to gay rights, supports Assad over actual left wing resistance in Rojava. What exactly about her is supposed to be progressive?

I could try explaining, but everyone hates her even more than Trump here, so it's pointless for me to even try.
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IceSpear
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« Reply #39 on: October 18, 2017, 01:40:21 AM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Well, she has railed against "homosexual extremists" on multiple occasions so I don't trust her "evolution" on that issue.

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Against civil unions? Really? Even Dubya supported those in 2004!

She has some problematic stances on foreign policy. Such as constant Assad apologism and buying into conspiracies about how he never used chemical weapons and it was a false flag.

And the cult around her is annoying. As if she's some martyr who got turned into stone by Debbie Wasserman Schultz's Medusa gaze just because she endorsed Bernie and VOLUNTARILY resigned from the DNC. Roll Eyes

She still endorsed SSM before the last Democratic Presidential nominee did.

Assad like Saddam is a bad person, but that doesn't justify a war. We have plenty of bad people (like the House of Saud) that are our "allies".

Yeah nice try. Hardly any Democrats opposed civil unions, much less consistently used hateful slurs like "homosexual extremists." Hell, even most Republicans didn't go that far.
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Adam Griffin
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« Reply #40 on: October 18, 2017, 01:42:52 AM »

Ugh Assad and Modi plz drone and incite, respectively
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AtorBoltox
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« Reply #41 on: October 18, 2017, 01:50:01 AM »

Ugh Assad and Modi plz drone and incite, respectively
I think you mean 'Assad pls barrel bomb'
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AtorBoltox
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« Reply #42 on: October 18, 2017, 01:52:23 AM »

Links to Hindu nationalist groups, Islamophobia, opposition to gay rights, supports Assad over actual left wing resistance in Rojava. What exactly about her is supposed to be progressive?

She supports arming the Kurds.
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2016/01/arming-the-kurds-rising-house-dem-finds-common-cause-with-major-bgr-client/

And she opposes Trump's travel ban and supports SSM.
You crucify Hillary over her backflips on SSM yet give Tulsi, whose opposition to it was far more vociferous, a pass?
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jfern
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« Reply #43 on: October 18, 2017, 02:03:28 AM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Well, she has railed against "homosexual extremists" on multiple occasions so I don't trust her "evolution" on that issue.

Quote
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Against civil unions? Really? Even Dubya supported those in 2004!

She has some problematic stances on foreign policy. Such as constant Assad apologism and buying into conspiracies about how he never used chemical weapons and it was a false flag.

And the cult around her is annoying. As if she's some martyr who got turned into stone by Debbie Wasserman Schultz's Medusa gaze just because she endorsed Bernie and VOLUNTARILY resigned from the DNC. Roll Eyes

She still endorsed SSM before the last Democratic Presidential nominee did.

Assad like Saddam is a bad person, but that doesn't justify a war. We have plenty of bad people (like the House of Saud) that are our "allies".

Yeah nice try. Hardly any Democrats opposed civil unions, much less consistently used hateful slurs like "homosexual extremists." Hell, even most Republicans didn't go that far.

Her rather had influenced her views a lot when she was 22, and she came out for SSM before Hillary did.


Links to Hindu nationalist groups, Islamophobia, opposition to gay rights, supports Assad over actual left wing resistance in Rojava. What exactly about her is supposed to be progressive?

She supports arming the Kurds.
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2016/01/arming-the-kurds-rising-house-dem-finds-common-cause-with-major-bgr-client/

And she opposes Trump's travel ban and supports SSM.
You crucify Hillary over her backflips on SSM yet give Tulsi, whose opposition to it was far more vociferous, a pass?

No one tried to claim that Tulsi has been fighting for gays the way they claimed Hillary has.
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Shadows
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« Reply #44 on: October 18, 2017, 04:42:24 AM »

Gabbard is not going to win the primary because no congressman/woman will win in many decades/have won in many decades. You have to be a Gov/Senator. And she is not progressive enough. She needs 15 off years & a record to match it.

Having said that, the comments in this thread are flat out retarded. Hillary Clinton supported the Iraq War which killed millions & she opposed gay marriage her entire life, only to support it in 2013, before her Presidential run (1-2 years before it). She supported tough capital punishments, she supported homophobic laws like DOMA & her VP pick was a notorious anti-choice guy in Tim kaine. Kaine would be the most anti-abortion Dem President in many decades.

So the hatred on Gabbard is stupid at best. Gabbard came from a Conservative Republican family, opposed Gay Marriage etc but turned in 2006/07 odd after visiting the Middle East. She has introduced several bills for the gay community since then, in Congress & in the Hawaii Legislature. By this standard, Obama, Biden all opposed gay marriages in 2008 as well. And Gabbard has used the term "Radical Islamic Territorist"but has also went & has spoken in Islamic conferences, has served in Iraq, visited Syria. I don't like hobnobbing with Assad but there is nothing to say she is "Islamophobic"
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Shadows
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« Reply #45 on: October 18, 2017, 04:52:46 AM »

What's with all the hate? She is one of my favorite politicians.

Well, she has railed against "homosexual extremists" on multiple occasions so I don't trust her "evolution" on that issue.

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Against civil unions? Really? Even Dubya supported those in 2004!

She has some problematic stances on foreign policy. Such as constant Assad apologism and buying into conspiracies about how he never used chemical weapons and it was a false flag.

And the cult around her is annoying. As if she's some martyr who got turned into stone by Debbie Wasserman Schultz's Medusa gaze just because she endorsed Bernie and VOLUNTARILY resigned from the DNC. Roll Eyes

Gabbard supported Same Sex Marriage in 2012. Hillary Clinton supported in 2013. That is certainly not unusual especially if you grow up in a conservative family. Gabbard changed after travelling the word & the Middle East. Gabbard got support from Bernie folks because she was on a suicide mission & supported Bernie at a time when Bernie's campaign was doomed, when Bernie seemed seemed destined to fail. It was after SC when Bernie lost SC by 40-50% after losing Nevada & Iowa. The Super Tuesdays were loaded with Southern states which Bernie was expected to lose big. The only state he was supposed to win was Vermont & everything else was tough. Sanders' campaign was supposed to end in Super Tuesday.

Gabbard was threatened by Clinton campaign about her political future & she put everything on the line against a very likely President Clinton (at that point of time which seemed likely) & risked her whole political career. She was moderate but had a good record on Environmental issues, opposed TPP & has since then moved left & supports Medicare-for-all, 15$ Minimum Wage, Glass Steagal, legalizing marijuana.

Having said that she is an obscure Congresswomen. No member of the House has won the Presidency in a long while & no1 will in the next few decades. She has to get to the Senate first & she needs a long progressive record. She is only 35 odd & I think she will be a strong candidate in 2028. The support she gets from Bernie folks is cause you support people who were there with you when you were at your worst.
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AtorBoltox
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« Reply #46 on: October 18, 2017, 08:53:24 AM »

Who knew that hindu nationalism=progressive heroism?
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BudgieForce
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« Reply #47 on: October 18, 2017, 09:33:53 AM »

My biggest issue with her is her trip to Syria and how she handled the aftermath. She met with a murderous dictator without telling anyone and then lied about how the trip was funded. And before anyone says otherwise, its fine for the secretary of state to visit murderous dictators because they're the presidents top diplomat. Its not fine if a congressperson with no job in the administration does it.
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Mr. Morden
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« Reply #48 on: October 18, 2017, 09:41:42 AM »

My biggest issue with her is her trip to Syria and how she handled the aftermath. She met with a murderous dictator without telling anyone and then lied about how the trip was funded. And before anyone says otherwise, its fine for the secretary of state to visit murderous dictators because they're the presidents top diplomat. Its not fine if a congressperson with no job in the administration does it.

For me, it's not so much that she met with him as it is the fact that she came back and regurgitated his propaganda.  She was obviously only allowed to meet with Assad-approved Syrians while there, and then she comes back and says something like "I talked to the Syrian people, and all of them told me that there's no real difference between the rebel groups and they're all terrorists."  (Not an exact quote, but that was the gist of it.)  Does she even realize that meeting only with people in territory held by Assad is going to produce a skewed picture, or is she that gullible?
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Shadows
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« Reply #49 on: October 18, 2017, 10:18:30 AM »

My biggest issue with her is her trip to Syria and how she handled the aftermath. She met with a murderous dictator without telling anyone and then lied about how the trip was funded. And before anyone says otherwise, its fine for the secretary of state to visit murderous dictators because they're the presidents top diplomat. Its not fine if a congressperson with no job in the administration does it.

For me, it's not so much that she met with him as it is the fact that she came back and regurgitated his propaganda.  She was obviously only allowed to meet with Assad-approved Syrians while there, and then she comes back and says something like "I talked to the Syrian people, and all of them told me that there's no real difference between the rebel groups and they're all terrorists."  (Not an exact quote, but that was the gist of it.)  Does she even realize that meeting only with people in territory held by Assad is going to produce a skewed picture, or is she that gullible?


Cognitive dissonance. Like most in these forums. You selectively take information which justifies your pre-held notions. It was stupid, meaningless & naive.

I do understand her point about regime change & Hillary's terrible hawkish policies which kills millions but that doesn't mean Assad is the good here. Being better than ISIS or reasonably secular is not good enough. The whole Syria fiasco will take her 10 years to erase. She needs to go to Senate when Hirono retires & needs to build a progressive resume for 10 years to be taken as a serious contender.
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