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Author Topic: Pennsylvania  (Read 5802 times)
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ahugecat
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« on: October 16, 2017, 06:15:27 PM »

McCain got a huge jump in the polls because of the Palin pick. Then she opened her mouth.
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60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED
ahugecat
Jr. Member
***
Posts: 868


« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2017, 07:19:02 PM »

McCain got a huge jump in the polls because of the Palin pick. Then she opened her mouth.

Palin was highly scripted. No different from Rubio, but she was a VP, all she needed to do was stick to the script. Financial crisis complicated the issue, because it was a dynamic situation for which the Republican establishment did not have an established talking point for (initially some opposed, others supported TARP, until they eventually formally endorsed TARP in unison). Rubio had similar troubles in non-scripted settings.

Have you seen Game Change (the movie)?
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60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED
ahugecat
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Posts: 868


« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2017, 11:11:15 AM »

I still believe that in the end, the best McCain could have done was a 1968 Humphrey or 1976 Ford style narrow loss even without the financial crisis.  The fundamentals were still horrible for McCain and much worse than they were for even Humphrey and Ford.  Bush's approval ratings were in the 20s and the economy was clearly in recession territory.  Unemployment rose from around 4.4% in summer 2007 to 6.2% in late summer 2008.  No candidate has ever won with the fundamentals so much against them.

Someone said that had the economic collapse not happened, Obama's 2008 win would resemble his 2012 win - 4 popular vote lead, and the 2012 state margins.

That sounds about right. Palin could have been a huge boon if she was better prepped. She truly was the star of the 2008 election - even over Obama. No one cared about McCain.
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60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED
ahugecat
Jr. Member
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Posts: 868


« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2017, 11:14:48 AM »

Apparently, the fundamentals were stacked against GWB, how did he do?

Well he did lose the popular vote and it was the closest electoral college result in history. He only won Florida by the skin of his teeth (10,000 votes).
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60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED
ahugecat
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Posts: 868


« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2017, 12:16:24 PM »

Would've been far closer than 2012. Before Lehman collapsed, not a single poll had Obama up in FL, VA, etc., in contrast, Hillary easily beat Mccain in FL and was competitive in a number of southern states like AR.

Obama was struggling in the polls in Virginia and Florida leading up to election day 2012.

He would have separated himself in 2008 as well. Same margins as 2012. No one cared about McCain and Palin was a flop after initial excitement.

Obama would have won Virginia 3-5 points in 2008 and Florida by 0.5-1.5.
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60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED
ahugecat
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Posts: 868


« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2017, 01:38:47 PM »
« Edited: October 19, 2017, 01:46:15 PM by 60+ GOP Seats After 2018 GUARANTEED »

Would've been far closer than 2012. Before Lehman collapsed, not a single poll had Obama up in FL, VA, etc., in contrast, Hillary easily beat Mccain in FL and was competitive in a number of southern states like AR.

Obama was struggling in the polls in Virginia and Florida leading up to election day 2012.

He would have separated himself in 2008 as well. Same margins as 2012. No one cared about McCain and Palin was a flop after initial excitement.

Obama would have won Virginia 3-5 points in 2008 and Florida by 0.5-1.5.

You're talking about last minute partisan surges, which happens in all normal elections, and would've happened for Mccain too, if not for the collapse. That would've put him over the top in a number of states. Like I said, Palin was no different from Rubio, she had a script, she wouldn't have needed to have done anything else other than read off it under normal conditions. Put Rubio in the same position, and he would've done the exact same things as Palin.

Less people were excited about Romney. Mccain at least had some centrist appeal.

Palin was different from Rubio in that she was a phenomenon. Her acceptance speech got nearly as many views as Obama's did (virtually tied). Her debate with Biden was the highest rated debate (70 million viewers) since Reagan vs. Carter.

Palin had almost as much online interest as Obama did AFTER Obama was declared the winner. To compare how incredible that is, Hillary Clinton didn't even get near Trump after the 2016 election. Remember that Hillary Clinton is also a controversial/infamous figure in American politics.

2008 was Palinmania. If the economic collapse never happened and Palin was better prepared, then perhaps McCain could have made it a close race.

But McCain was doomed due to George W. Bush.
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