Alabama Megathread 2: Thou Shall Not Touch Teenage Girls

[I’m not Stu]

Some more ?s about the yearbook

Why the mention of the restaurant.  Most yearbook entries do not set out the place.

Most yearbook entries I have ever seen are not dated.   Why would a 30 year old guy note the date.

Since she claims to have been a waitress, why would he not have noted waitress rather than girl.

I have no reason to doubt the claims of the other women.

But I think there is a fair chance Gloria might well have decided to horn into all the publicity.

By not turning over the yearbook, Gloria may be giving Moore some extra wind:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/17/exclusive-roy-moore-gloria-allreds-refusal-to-release-yearbook-proves-allegations-are-completely-untrue/

It's Breitbart. Even Fox News and One America News are marginally more credible than Breitbart. At least One America reported the fact that Minnesota Democratic state legislators called for Al Franken to resign.

[Brittain33]

Why the mention of the restaurant.  Most yearbook entries do not set out the place.

He knew her as a waitress from the restaurant where he went to eat. This isn't hard unless you really, really don't want to believe he signed the yearbook.

[Tartarus Sauce]

Alabama Gov: Roy Moore May Be a Child Molester, But At Least He’s Not a Democrat

Alabama Governor Kay Ivey accidentally gave away the Religious Right’s secret yesterday when she was answering questions about fellow Republican Roy Moore. She said of his accusers, “I certainly have no reason to disbelieve any of them.” She added: “There’s never an excuse for or rationale for sexual misconduct or sexual abuse.”

“I’m going to cast my ballot on December the 12th, and I do believe the nominee of the party is the one I’ll vote for,” Ivey said. “I believe in the Republican Party, what we stand for, and most important, we need to have a Republican in the United States Senate to vote on things like the Supreme Court justices, other appointments the Senate has to confirm and make major decisions. So that’s what I plan to do, vote for Republican nominee Roy Moore.”

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2017/11/18/alabama-gov-roy-moore-may-be-a-child-molester-but-at-least-hes-not-a-democrat/

This comment from her perfectly describes modern conservatism.

It represents the very nihilistic moral backslide conservatives have been warning about for decades that would be the result of a secularizing culture. Instead, it is the response from conservatives to a secularizing and liberalizing society that has ushered in a new era of win-at-all-costs tribalism within our political culture. 

[DrScholl]

Some more ?s about the yearbook

Why the mention of the restaurant.  Most yearbook entries do not set out the place.

Most yearbook entries I have ever seen are not dated.   Why would a 30 year old guy note the date.

Since she claims to have been a waitress, why would he not have noted waitress rather than girl.

I have no reason to doubt the claims of the other women.

But I think there is a fair chance Gloria might well have decided to horn into all the publicity.

By not turning over the yearbook, Gloria may be giving Moore some extra wind:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/17/exclusive-roy-moore-gloria-allreds-refusal-to-release-yearbook-proves-allegations-are-completely-untrue/

Why turn over the yearbook? So it can be "accidentally" destroyed? Asking for the evidence to be turned over to the accused is ridiculous.

[Arkansas Yankee]

Some more ?s about the yearbook

Why the mention of the restaurant.  Most yearbook entries do not set out the place.

Most yearbook entries I have ever seen are not dated.   Why would a 30 year old guy note the date.

Since she claims to have been a waitress, why would he not have noted waitress rather than girl.

I have no reason to doubt the claims of the other women.

But I think there is a fair chance Gloria might well have decided to horn into all the publicity.

By not turning over the yearbook, Gloria may be giving Moore some extra wind:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/17/exclusive-roy-moore-gloria-allreds-refusal-to-release-yearbook-proves-allegations-are-completely-untrue/

It's Breitbart. Even Fox News and One America News are marginally more credible than Breitbart. At least One America reported the fact that Minnesota Democratic state legislators called for Al Franken to resign.

I want to say something about your intelligence.  However I shall refrain.  I was not using Breitbart as any evidence about the authenticity of the yearbook notations.  I was using it to show that Moore is using the failure to produce as evidence of its invalidity.  Since so many of you think most Alabamans are boobs and hayseeds, you should have concerns.  Maybe he can ride this failure into the Senate.

As I have thought about it, your intelligence is not question. It is that you so dislike the right, that you really want to think the worst of us all the time.

I know how most of you hate Breitbart, so I would never use it here as actual evidence in factual dispute.  But I will use it show what is going on.  If you do not want to pay attention, so be it.

[Arkansas Yankee]

Some more ?s about the yearbook

Why the mention of the restaurant.  Most yearbook entries do not set out the place.

Most yearbook entries I have ever seen are not dated.   Why would a 30 year old guy note the date.

Since she claims to have been a waitress, why would he not have noted waitress rather than girl.

I have no reason to doubt the claims of the other women.

But I think there is a fair chance Gloria might well have decided to horn into all the publicity.

By not turning over the yearbook, Gloria may be giving Moore some extra wind:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/17/exclusive-roy-moore-gloria-allreds-refusal-to-release-yearbook-proves-allegations-are-completely-untrue/

Why turn over the yearbook? So it can be "accidentally" destroyed? Asking for the evidence to be turned.   over to the accused is ridiculous.

There are many ways neutral observers could be involved to protect the evidence.  You are smart and know it. 

Three weeks of hitting this failure could allow Moore to ride into the Senate.  As you say: "it is Alabama"

I think you know Gloria is of sufficiently low character to try pull such a capper.  It is also possible that Nelson is telling the truth about the actual assault, but Gloria wanted to embellish it.

As I have said the Governor should tell Gloria to turn it over or have the election delayed.

I must admit that if it were determined a forgery, Moore would be elected.  This fear is probably one reason why you do not want to turn it over.

But the contrary is also possible.  If it is found truthful, Moore would likely be forced out.  The Republicans would all vote for Moore in order to have another election.  That may be your greatest fear.

[GeorgiaModerate]

So why doesn't Moore sue her for defamation, as he's threatened to do against his accusers?  Then he could have the yearbook examined as part of discovery. 

(He won't sue, of course, for the same reason Trump has never filed the threatened suits against his own accusers.  Discovery works both ways.)

[DrScholl]

Roy Moore is finished and his fans know it, so all this "hand over the yearbook" cheap is pointless. Even if he does win, he could get expelled, so it's a zero win game.

[Andrew1]

Really? CNN photoshopped this image to support the idea of a forged signature did they? The photo is published on the official CNN twitter account. See here
https://twitter.com/CNN/status/930205088299257859

You must be logged in to read this quote.

The point is that everything up until the name 'Ray' was a genuine original inscription from 1977 (possibly written by Ray Evans who was a student in her school class).

Now some people are just pathologically dishonest as you know and such people are to be found everywhere. Beverly Nelson's own stepson has publicly described her as such a person.  When she heard about all the people looking into possible sexual wrongdoing she had a brainwave. She remembered the inscription in her yearbook and thought 'well the name 'Ray' looks just like 'Roy'. If I can add the name 'Moore' to the end of the inscription along with a date and place I can say this is 'proof' and can be in for some big money.

Nelson would have seen Gloria Allred on he TV during the Presidential election last year. Con artists tend to recognise other con artists and she would have seen exactly what Allred's game was. This opportunity presented itself and Nelson knew that Allred was the person to go to make things happen. So she would have contacted Allred, the two of them would have worked out the script and the performance together as well as working out how Nelson was going to get money off this (either by being paid directly or by some kind of fundraising scam or both).

The ink was meant to look the same colour and from most angles it does. Only when it was held up directly to the light at that particular angle does the CNN camera capture the 40 year old ink reflecting the bright light differently from the recent ink.

I love that a Trump supporter points to CNN for vindication. I don't believe it originated with them, and it has been distorted and then seized upon by conspiracy theorists as evidence of a forged yearbook, the whole image looks too bluish. I watched the live feed of that press conference and saw the yearbook in detail at different angles and saw no such effect.

Let's look at your theory, this "Ray" character apparently has identical handwriting to Roy Moore, looking at samples of Roy Moore's known handwriting, the capital R's, T's and C's are identical:



And look at what Moore's attorney, Phillip Jauregui, said at the press conference: "look at Olde Hickory House which they say Judge Moore wrote, Judge Moore says there's no way in the world that's his handwriting" - the implication being that the rest of it was in his handwriting!

If this is all a conspiracy to discredit Roy Moore they would've done a better job than this.

[EnglishPete]

Alabama Gov: Roy Moore May Be a Child Molester, But At Least He’s Not a Democrat

Alabama Governor Kay Ivey accidentally gave away the Religious Right’s secret yesterday when she was answering questions about fellow Republican Roy Moore. She said of his accusers, “I certainly have no reason to disbelieve any of them.” She added: “There’s never an excuse for or rationale for sexual misconduct or sexual abuse.”

“I’m going to cast my ballot on December the 12th, and I do believe the nominee of the party is the one I’ll vote for,” Ivey said. “I believe in the Republican Party, what we stand for, and most important, we need to have a Republican in the United States Senate to vote on things like the Supreme Court justices, other appointments the Senate has to confirm and make major decisions. So that’s what I plan to do, vote for Republican nominee Roy Moore.”

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2017/11/18/alabama-gov-roy-moore-may-be-a-child-molester-but-at-least-hes-not-a-democrat/

This comment from her perfectly describes modern conservatism.

Maybe she feels that way because modern liberalism has become so terrifying: open borders, 7 year olds deciding they are transgender, leftist limits on free speech, violent Antia, violent resistance, violent black lives matters, Soros, etc.  Could go on and on.

Or maybe she just thinks that all these accusations about Roy Moore molesting teenagers and being banned from malls are just nonsense. She doesn't say that she believes any of this only that she has "no reason to disbelieve any of [the accusers]". She has no reason to believe them either and gives no indication that she does. Phrasing her answer that way is however a convenient way of dodging the question.

[Bakersfield Uber Alles]

Guess there's not much of a point in having people on ignore if everyone is going to keep feeding them.

[EnglishPete]

Looks like both campaigns have had a massive fundraising boost from all the controversy

Doug Jones as reported by NBC

"The Roy Moore scandal has unleashed a torrent of online donations to Democrat Doug Jones, who was collecting around $250,000 per day in its immediate aftermath, according to two sources familiar with the matter who spoke to NBC News on condition of anonymity"

https://archive.fo/BQtrg

Roy Moore as reported by CNN

Rebecca Berg‏Verified account @rebeccagberg 24h

#ALSen news as reported tonight on @CNNSitRoom: Moore campaign chairman Bill Armistead says grassroots fundraising has surged in aftermath of sexual misconduct allegations. "We have raised more in the last six days online than the total raised online since the runoff Sept. 26."

Replying to @rebeccagberg @CNNSitRoom
A source close to the Moore campaign says online fundraising has topped six figures on several days in a row. Suggests Moore has some life, and an energized base, even after being cut off by NRSC/RNC
3:03 pm - 17 Nov 2017
https://twitter.com/rebeccagberg/status/931659176505421825


Elizabeth Landers‏Verified account @ElizLanders 10h
Building off @rebeccagberg's reporting last night: Roy Moore senior adviser Brett Doster tells me that the Moore campaign raised $500k in 2.5 days
----> Doster said that the Moore campaign has been in touch with the White House through "key donors who have spoken with folks at the White House."
4:58 am - 18 Nov 2017
https://twitter.com/ElizLanders/status/931869098753056769

[Keep cool-idge]

To me the year book and the 2 other autographs look totally different.

[GeorgiaModerate]

To me the year book and the 2 other autographs look totally different.

I doubt that any of us here are either experts or unbiased observers. 

As I said earlier: if Moore thinks the yearbook is a forgery, he has a legal avenue that would force it to be examined.  All he needs to do is file the defamation suit he's already threatened, and have it examined by the Court.

If he doesn't do this, then all his claims about the yearbook are just blowing smoke.

[Arkansas Yankee]

To me the year book and the 2 other autographs look totally different.

As I said earlier: if Moore thinks the yearbook is a forgery, he has a legal avenue that would force it to be examined.  All he needs to do is file the defamation suit he's already threatened, and have it examined by the Court.

If he doesn't do this, then all his claims about the yearbook are just blowing smoke.

I do not believe there is time for a suit.  A defendant in a civil suit usually has 30 days to file an answer. The assigned judge is under no requirement to speed things up just because one party is engaged in an election. Numerous court sessions would probably be necessary.

The Governor should state if the yearbook was not turned to a select group she might select by a certain date she would delay the election. The Democrat and Republican state chairman could be selected.  Every state has employed handwriting experts. These could be used or the parties could each select their own. If the parties do not dilly, daly, delay, and stahl,  it could be done quickly.

THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE

[Holmes]

That smells of sore loser-ism. The election will be based on the candidates, not some stupid yearbook. Moving the date of the election because your guy sucks and is losing and blaming it on a stupid yearbook just sounds rotten and corrupt.

[Gustaf]

Guys, seriously. There are 3 people here who are either Russian trolls or fake Christians who support child molestation and are going to hell. These people aren't rational humans worthy of debate. They're bad people who contribute nothing. Stop engaging them, they aren't trying to engage you in civilized discourse.

[Badger]

Guys, seriously. There are 3 people here who are either Russian trolls or fake Christians who support child molestation and are going to hell. These people aren't rational humans worthy of debate. They're bad people who contribute nothing. Stop engaging them, they aren't trying to engage you in civilized discourse.

Even though I get and idea from the posts that have been copied, who is defending sexual assault the most out of the three Horrible's?

I seriously wonder how many sexual assault charges these posters have racked up between them? Well, none for creepo obviously since he's like 12

[Gustaf]

Guys, seriously. There are 3 people here who are either Russian trolls or fake Christians who support child molestation and are going to hell. These people aren't rational humans worthy of debate. They're bad people who contribute nothing. Stop engaging them, they aren't trying to engage you in civilized discourse.

Even though I get and idea from the posts that have been copied, who is defending sexual assault the most out of the three Horrible's?

I seriously wonder how many sexual assault charges these posters have racked up between them? Well, none for creepo obviously since he's like 12

I guess they've been careful enough to put themselves in environments where sexual assaults rarely gets charged.

Greedo is the one most openly in support of sexual assault because he doesn't really care to defend Moore. EnglishPete is doing crazy conspiracy nonsense as usual. Arkansas Yankee is doing a FuzzyBear routine of "aw shucks" likeable folksiness to hide his agenda but he's coming off as pretty pro-molestation as well.

It's just annoying to have the thread cluttered with arguments over whether Good Christians should molest minors or not. I want to follow the actual race.

[Blackacre]

The RCP Average currently has Jones up by... 0.2 percent, meaning this race is virtually tied at the moment. I'm interested therefore in seeing the next poll, as it could continue the trend and give Jones a real lead in the average or it could put Moore back in the lead.

For those of us who are going to be watching election night very closely, what are the key counties that are going to give us an early clue on the outcome?

[DrScholl]

Madison County and Mobile County are the ones to really watch.

[Arkansas Yankee]

So we are Russian trolls.  That is from folks who undoubtedly supported Ted Kennedy who actually went to the Soviet Union in 1984 to ask for Soviet help to defeat Reagan. 

You also support a party that through their nuclear winter crusade undermined Reagan repeatedly in his efforts to deal with the Soviet Union.

Do you want to talk about what real collusion is like.  I thought not.  I tell you again if Trump colluded with Russia or the Russians aided him, the Russians made a real BIG mistake.  He is not following Russian policy in Europe, the Mideast, North Africa, Israel, or North Korea.  Obama and Clinton policies were actually more in tune with Putin's than Trump's policies are.  Your brains are so clouded with delusion from your loss that you cannot see the trees for the Forrest in your fogged minds. Show me one area were he is actually supporting Russian policy. 

Then you charge me with supporting child molesters.  You should not talk about people you do not know. I was molested when I was 16 after a year of grooming. Back then matters like that were just not reported.  I hope my molester died of Aids.

Yes I detest Gloria Allred.

My great hope still is to force Moore out and then get him more votes so Jones will not be elected. My hope is that Moore wrote the notation and Nelson forged the signature.  I actually think that is what happened.  Then maybe we can get rid of Moore and at least wound Gloria.

Why don't you guys take care of your main sex pervert before you start attacking other innocent people like me.  Why don't you atone for supporting a man who let a young lady die in a pond.  Why don't you atone for your party's undermining of Reagan.  Jeepers. 

[Hindsight was 2020]

Hey Arkansas complaining about being called a Russian troll and then using whataboutism doesn't help convince anyone

[Gass3268]

Madison County and Mobile County are the ones to really watch.

I fully expect Madison County to go for Jones. It's % college Educated is too high for Moore. Not so sure about Mobile County.

[Arkansas Yankee]

Hey Arkansas complaining about being called a Russian troll and then using whataboutism doesn't help convince anyone

The left wingers like you at this site like to engage in ad hominem attacks with no facts.

Trump is arming the Ukraine.  He is putting defensive missiles in Poland, which Obama denied them.  He is giving more missiles to Israel and sending troops to help with their manning and firing.  He not playing Russia's game in Syria.  That cannot be said for Obama.  He is shifting Saudi Arabia around. He is not dealing with North Korea as Putin would like.

Please list Trump policies that have aided Russia now that we are 11 months into his administration.

I was a Rubio supporter, so i will not accept any Russian collusion complaints from any of you.  Trump and Hillary each had way too many Russian contacts for me to like.  She and her husband got rich on their contacts with out doing any business there. As a Rubio supporter I had to chose the lesser of two evils.  My choice was Trump.  From hindsight I believe that was the best choice.