Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
October 19, 2018, 06:40:12 pm
HomePredMockPollEVCalcAFEWIKIHelpLogin Register
News: Please delete your old personal messages.

+  Atlas Forum
|-+  General Discussion
| |-+  Religion & Philosophy (Moderator: Gustaf)
| | |-+  Opinion of the United Methodist Church
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Print
Poll
Question: ??
Freedom Church   -14 (77.8%)
Horrible Church   -4 (22.2%)
Show Pie Chart
Total Voters: 18

Author Topic: Opinion of the United Methodist Church  (Read 848 times)
Alabama_Indy10
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,058
United States


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: November 19, 2017, 03:49:31 pm »

Opinion of the United Methodist Church
Logged
TDAS04
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 13,471
Nepal


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2017, 08:52:14 pm »

Freedom Church.  Seems pretty moderate on balance, even though they tend to be somewhat more conservative than me theologically.  I wouldn't mind being a member if they lifted their ban on gay clergy and weddings.
Logged

Economic:  -2.71
Social:  -5.74
True Federalist
Ernest
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 35,609
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2017, 10:49:34 pm »

Freedom Church.  Seems pretty moderate on balance, even though they tend to be somewhat more conservative than me theologically.  I wouldn't mind being a member if they lifted their ban on gay clergy and weddings.

That won't ever happen in my lifetime and probably not yours.  The UMC is in some regards a victim of its own success in evangelizing outside the United States. The Methodists in the US are but a fraction of the total membership of the UMC. That's why I foresee the UMC continuing to shrink in this country. The way it is organized makes it nigh on impossible for local churches to go beyond where they have gone on LGBT issues and I see no real future in this country for an otherwise liberal church that doesn't fully embrace the LGBT community.

It's a lot easier for individual members to change church than for a church as a whole to abandon its building and start anew elsewhere, which until the overseas portion of the church liberalizes on that issue is all that UMC members can do to go farther.
Logged

Quote from: Ignatius of Antioch
He that possesses the word of Jesus, is truly able to bear his very silence. — Epistle to the Ephesians 3:21a
The one thing everyone can agree on is that the media is biased against them.
Clarence Thomas's Pubic Hair
Ascott
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 9,361
Norway


Political Matrix
E: -4.26, S: -6.43

P P
View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2017, 11:13:47 pm »

Freedom Church.  Seems pretty moderate on balance, even though they tend to be somewhat more conservative than me theologically. I wouldn't mind being a member if they lifted their ban on gay clergy and weddings.

That won't ever happen in my lifetime and probably not yours.  The UMC is in some regards a victim of its own success in evangelizing outside the United States. The Methodists in the US are but a fraction of the total membership of the UMC. That's why I foresee the UMC continuing to shrink in this country. The way it is organized makes it nigh on impossible for local churches to go beyond where they have gone on LGBT issues and I see no real future in this country for an otherwise liberal church that doesn't fully embrace the LGBT community.

It's a lot easier for individual members to change church than for a church as a whole to abandon its building and start anew elsewhere, which until the overseas portion of the church liberalizes on that issue is all that UMC members can do to go farther.

I believe most progressive American Methodists are expecting a schism.
Logged


"Accept suffering and achieve atonement through it — that is what you must do."
-- Fyodor Dostoevsky
True Federalist
Ernest
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 35,609
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2017, 07:35:11 am »

I believe most progressive American Methodists are expecting a schism.

It'll be painful if it happens. the progressive schismatics will have to buy new church buildings as the UMC is decidedly not a congregational church.  It'll be easier for progressive members to shift affiliation to other established liberal churches, and I don't see a way for a mass coordinated exodus to establish a new denomination.
Logged

Quote from: Ignatius of Antioch
He that possesses the word of Jesus, is truly able to bear his very silence. — Epistle to the Ephesians 3:21a
The one thing everyone can agree on is that the media is biased against them.
RINO Tom
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 11,219
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.13, S: -4.70

View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2017, 01:00:42 pm »

Seems alright.
Logged

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."

- Abraham Lincoln, 16th President
Enduro
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,608


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2017, 01:50:08 pm »

One is letting us use their building to host a swing dance, so Freedom Church.

In all seriousness, I don't really think any Church is completely horrible, and I try to be able to be a brother to Christians of all denominations.
Logged

"Above all else, love each other deeply, for love can cover a multitude of sins." 1 Peter 4:8
DC Al Fine
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 12,062
Canada


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2017, 06:39:25 am »

I believe most progressive American Methodists are expecting a schism.

It'll be painful if it happens. the progressive schismatics will have to buy new church buildings as the UMC is decidedly not a congregational church.  It'll be easier for progressive members to shift affiliation to other established liberal churches, and I don't see a way for a mass coordinated exodus to establish a new denomination.

1) That explains a lot. If they were Presbyterians or Baptists, they would have schismed a while ago.

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Logged
True Federalist
Ernest
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 35,609
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2017, 08:13:58 am »

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Not easily.  The way it's organized, there is no US branch per se.  They have five regional conferences in the US and then several conferences covering various parts of the rest of the world.
Logged

Quote from: Ignatius of Antioch
He that possesses the word of Jesus, is truly able to bear his very silence. — Epistle to the Ephesians 3:21a
The one thing everyone can agree on is that the media is biased against them.
America's Sweetheart ❤/𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕭𝖔𝖔𝖙𝖞 𝖂𝖆𝖗𝖗𝖎𝖔𝖗
TexArkana
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 6,736
United States


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2017, 04:20:05 pm »

I feel neutral on it, I think it's okay as fart as Methodist churches go.
Logged
Türkisblau
H_Wallace
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,355
Ireland, Republic of


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2017, 05:05:49 pm »

HC, heretics ofc
Logged

┏┓
┃┃╱╲ In this
┃╱╱╲╲ house
╱╱╭╮╲╲ we love
▔▏┗┛▕▔ & tune into 
╱▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔╲
The God Channel
╱╱┏┳┓╭╮┏┳┓ ╲╲
▔▏┗┻┛┃┃┗┻┛▕▔
DC Al Fine
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 12,062
Canada


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2017, 06:28:32 am »

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Not easily.  The way it's organized, there is no US branch per se.  They have five regional conferences in the US and then several conferences covering various parts of the rest of the world.

That makes it even easier then, no? Presumably the progressives are concentrated in a couple regions. Why couldn't they walk out as a group?
Logged
True Federalist
Ernest
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 35,609
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2017, 08:12:42 am »

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Not easily.  The way it's organized, there is no US branch per se.  They have five regional conferences in the US and then several conferences covering various parts of the rest of the world.

That makes it even easier then, no? Presumably the progressives are concentrated in a couple regions. Why couldn't they walk out as a group?

Because their church properties would still be owned by the UMC they are leaving.  As I've pointed out before, the UMC is not a congregationally organized church.  For the most part, the churches are owned by the UMC, not the individual congregations nor by the regions.   It's a lot easier for individual members to leave the UMC than for whole congregations or groups of congregations.
Logged

Quote from: Ignatius of Antioch
He that possesses the word of Jesus, is truly able to bear his very silence. — Epistle to the Ephesians 3:21a
The one thing everyone can agree on is that the media is biased against them.
DC Al Fine
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 12,062
Canada


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2017, 04:48:41 pm »

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Not easily.  The way it's organized, there is no US branch per se.  They have five regional conferences in the US and then several conferences covering various parts of the rest of the world.

That makes it even easier then, no? Presumably the progressives are concentrated in a couple regions. Why couldn't they walk out as a group?

Because their church properties would still be owned by the UMC they are leaving.  As I've pointed out before, the UMC is not a congregationally organized church.  For the most part, the churches are owned by the UMC, not the individual congregations nor by the regions.   It's a lot easier for individual members to leave the UMC than for whole congregations or groups of congregations.

There's the issue. I was wondering if regional bodies (e.g. Diocese of XXX) owned the buildings or the national/global body. Apparently its the latter.
Logged
Thomas from NJ
SNJ1985
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 2,194
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.13, S: 7.04

View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2017, 08:48:13 pm »

My opinion of them has improved now that I know they left the ''Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice''. Still, Independent Baptist churches remain the best.
Logged

Jesus Christ is the only way to Heaven. Accept Him as your Savior now. Repent and believe the Gospel.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/how_to_be_saved.html

kingjamesbibleonline.org

officialstreetpreachers.blogspot.com
Let Dogs Survive
MormDem
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 16,627
United States


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2017, 10:31:39 pm »

Technically, they're apostates, but most of those people tend to be decently morally centered.
Logged

PR
Progressive Realist
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 8,983
United States


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #16 on: December 07, 2017, 01:36:08 pm »

FC, in spite of many things.

(Full disclosure: I was raised in the UMC.)
Logged

Oldiesfreak1854
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 13,790
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2017, 12:01:13 pm »

FC, in spite of many things.
Logged

Quote from: Dwight D. Eisenhower
There is nothing wrong with America that the faith, love of freedom, intelligence, and energy of
her citizens cannot cure.
Lechasseur
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,838
France


Political Matrix
E: -0.52, S: 3.13

View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2018, 07:22:42 pm »

Technically, they're apostates, but most of those people tend to be decently morally centered.

How are they apostates?
Logged
DC Al Fine
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 12,062
Canada


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2018, 05:50:27 am »

Technically, they're apostates, but most of those people tend to be decently morally centered.

How are they apostates?

He's Mormon I think? I think most of us are apostate by that standard.
Logged
swf541
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1,145


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2018, 06:18:41 pm »

Technically, they're apostates, but most of those people tend to be decently morally centered.

How are they apostates?

He's Mormon I think? I think most of us are apostate by that standard.

Which is ironic since they seriously are apostates....
Logged
Prolocutor Bagel23
Bagel23
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 7,015
United States


Political Matrix
E: -2.65, S: -1.13

P P
View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2018, 06:44:06 pm »

Mom converted from orthodoxy to it. Not either, but I still have large respect for both, solid institutions.
Logged

I'm a Southern Blue-Dog Democrat... one of the few still left...

#FDT

Proud Member of the Federalist party in Atlasia.

Kingpoleon
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 17,843
United States


View Profile Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #22 on: January 07, 2018, 04:24:48 pm »

2) What's the progressive/conservative proportions in the United States? If progressives are the majority in the United States, could the US branch of the UMC walk out as one group?
Not easily.  The way it's organized, there is no US branch per se.  They have five regional conferences in the US and then several conferences covering various parts of the rest of the world.

That makes it even easier then, no? Presumably the progressives are concentrated in a couple regions. Why couldn't they walk out as a group?

Because their church properties would still be owned by the UMC they are leaving.  As I've pointed out before, the UMC is not a congregationally organized church.  For the most part, the churches are owned by the UMC, not the individual congregations nor by the regions.   It's a lot easier for individual members to leave the UMC than for whole congregations or groups of congregations.
Larry Goodpaster is the most prominent Methodist Progressive I know of.


For the record, Wesleyanism is broadly popular throughout progressive and conservative circles. The church won’t schism over social issues, as it has broad agreement on theology.
Logged

“Passion and prejudice govern the world; only under the name of reason. It is our part, by religion and reason joined, to counteract them all we can.“ - John Wesley

"Good speech and good looks covers man's every vice. Plain speech and plain looks covers man's every virtue." - Yours Truly

Economic: 1.38
Social: -2.36
True Federalist
Ernest
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 35,609
United States


View Profile WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #23 on: January 07, 2018, 09:47:50 pm »

It has broad agreement on the social gospel, but how to apply that in specific situations, especially LGBT issues and to a far lesser extent, the role of women in the church, is where a potential schism could occur.  But as I said, given the structure of the UMC, I don't expect a schism, just a slow migration of members for whom a liberal view of those issues is important to other churches where LGBT marriage and ordination are acceptable.
Logged

Quote from: Ignatius of Antioch
He that possesses the word of Jesus, is truly able to bear his very silence. — Epistle to the Ephesians 3:21a
The one thing everyone can agree on is that the media is biased against them.
Pages: [1] Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Logout

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines