Was Trump the only candidate that could beat Hillary Clinton

[Da2017]

It was said Trump would lose to any democrat not named Hillary and visa versa.

[Mr. Smith]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

[dw93]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

I agree with you. Kasich was the only other Republican who could flip all three of the rust belt states that gave Trump the Presidency and could possibly put Minnesota in real danger of flipping. He'd most likely win New Hampshire as well. Nevada and Virginia could also narrowly go Kasich to. Colorado most likely stays Democratic in either case.

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

Apparently Atlas thinks that regular conservatism is more toxic than Donald Trump.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

I agree with you. Kasich was the only other Republican who could flip all three of the rust belt states that gave Trump the Presidency and could possibly put Minnesota in real danger of flipping. He'd most likely win New Hampshire as well. Nevada and Virginia could also narrowly go Kasich to. Colorado most likely stays Democratic in either case.

I believe Kasich would do much better in the Suburbs than Trump did this flipping CO


Also I believe Stein would do much better if Kasich is the GOP nominee and I Believe this would be the popular vote numbers if Kasich was nominee

52-45-3


With those numbers even States like Oregon could flip as Oregon PVI is +8 Dem and with Stein doing much better than OTL Oregon could flip(Kasich wouldn’t beat Hillary+ Stein though and if Stein underperforms Hillary wins Oregon by around 3-4 points) .



The fac

[dw93]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

I agree with you. Kasich was the only other Republican who could flip all three of the rust belt states that gave Trump the Presidency and could possibly put Minnesota in real danger of flipping. He'd most likely win New Hampshire as well. Nevada and Virginia could also narrowly go Kasich to. Colorado most likely stays Democratic in either case.

I believe Kasich would do much better in the Suburbs than Trump did this flipping CO


Also I believe Stein would do much better if Kasich is the GOP nominee and I Believe this would be the popular vote numbers if Kasich was nominee

52-45-3


With those numbers even States like Oregon could flip as Oregon PVI is +8 Dem and with Stein doing much better than OTL Oregon could flip(Kasich wouldn’t beat Hillary+ Stein though and if Stein underperforms Hillary wins Oregon by around 3-4 points) .



The fac

I think what you said about  Oregon applies to Colorado. If Stein and Johnson take more votes there than they did with Trump as the Republican nominee, Kasich could win it. If they don't Clinton wins it by 1 or 2% as opposed to the almost 5% that she won it by in real life against Trump.  As for Oregon, if Bush couldn't flip it in 2000 with Nader's strong showing and with the West Coast in general being less Democratic then than it was in 2016, I don't think Kasich flips it, even if Stein does better than OTL (I honestly don't see her doing better than Nader did in 2000 regardless of who the GOP nominates).

[OSR stands with Israel]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

I agree with you. Kasich was the only other Republican who could flip all three of the rust belt states that gave Trump the Presidency and could possibly put Minnesota in real danger of flipping. He'd most likely win New Hampshire as well. Nevada and Virginia could also narrowly go Kasich to. Colorado most likely stays Democratic in either case.

I believe Kasich would do much better in the Suburbs than Trump did this flipping CO


Also I believe Stein would do much better if Kasich is the GOP nominee and I Believe this would be the popular vote numbers if Kasich was nominee

52-45-3


With those numbers even States like Oregon could flip as Oregon PVI is +8 Dem and with Stein doing much better than OTL Oregon could flip(Kasich wouldn’t beat Hillary+ Stein though and if Stein underperforms Hillary wins Oregon by around 3-4 points) .



The fac

I think what you said about  Oregon applies to Colorado. If Stein and Johnson take more votes there than they did with Trump as the Republican nominee, Kasich could win it. If they don't Clinton wins it by 1 or 2% as opposed to the almost 5% that she won it by in real life against Trump.  As for Oregon, if Bush couldn't flip it in 2000 with Nader's strong showing and with the West Coast in general being less Democratic then than it was in 2016, I don't think Kasich flips it, even if Stein does better than OTL (I honestly don't see her doing better than Nader did in 2000 regardless of who the GOP nominates).

Well I think Kasich does much better nationally than Bush did so while Oregon May go for him it doenst mean that Oregon is less democratic than it was in 2000. What required a Bush popular vote win in 2000 to win Oregon now requires a GOP 7-8 point win .


As for Colorado, I think Kasich does well in the traditional GOP suburbs , better among Hispanics which should let him win the state outright .

[catographer]

It would be like if Romney had beat Obama in 2012.

[SWE]

Obviously the only person who could possibly beat the second least popular politician in America was the least popular politician in America . Any non joke candidate would have beaten Hillary in both the Electoral College and popular vote.

[Del Tachi]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

This is something that I think people don't consider enough.  No other Republican could have contrasted with Hillary the way Trump did.

[RINO Tom]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

This is something that I think people don't consider enough.  No other Republican could have contrasted with Hillary the way Trump did.

Agree to disagree, as I think Kasich would carry some of the necessary "compassionate conservatism" along with also not offending large swathes of our voters in various suburban areas.

[Joey1996]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

Lol no he wouldn't have, the Trump base would stay home and he wouldn't win any independents

[mencken]

I've raised this question before, to little response.. County level results seem to suggest that Trump won a fair number of previously Democratic voters, a good number of whom crossed over to vote for him specifically in the primary, but they clearly had no affection for Hillary Clinton either.

I suspect a more conventional Republican wins Wisconsin (where Trump's losses in WOW were enough to offset his gains in the rest of the state), Iowa and Ohio by narrow margins. Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Florida are would have gone Democrat without Trump.

[Joey1996]

I've raised this question before, to little response.. County level results seem to suggest that Trump won a fair number of previously Democratic voters, a good number of whom crossed over to vote for him specifically in the primary, but they clearly had no affection for Hillary Clinton either.

I suspect a more conventional Republican wins Wisconsin (where Trump's losses in WOW were enough to offset his gains in the rest of the state), Iowa and Ohio by narrow margins. Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Florida are would have gone Democrat without Trump.

I think Rubio could have possibly won NH, maybe NV.

[Joe McCarthy Was Right]

TPP might have derailed Rubio and Kasich in the Rust Belt.

[uti2]

I've raised this question before, to little response.. County level results seem to suggest that Trump won a fair number of previously Democratic voters, a good number of whom crossed over to vote for him specifically in the primary, but they clearly had no affection for Hillary Clinton either.

I suspect a more conventional Republican wins Wisconsin (where Trump's losses in WOW were enough to offset his gains in the rest of the state), Iowa and Ohio by narrow margins. Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Florida are would have gone Democrat without Trump.

I think Rubio could have possibly won NH, maybe NV.

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

Lol no he wouldn't have, the Trump base would stay home and he wouldn't win any independents

Why would Trump's base stay home for Kasich, but not Rubio? Ideologically if anything, Trump voters would be more inclined to back Kasich than Rubio, Trump consistently won primaries based on support from 'moderate' republicans. In comparison, Cruz/Rubio both won votes from the more conservative voting cohort.

[Mr. Smith]

I've raised this question before, to little response.. County level results seem to suggest that Trump won a fair number of previously Democratic voters, a good number of whom crossed over to vote for him specifically in the primary, but they clearly had no affection for Hillary Clinton either.

I suspect a more conventional Republican wins Wisconsin (where Trump's losses in WOW were enough to offset his gains in the rest of the state), Iowa and Ohio by narrow margins. Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Florida are would have gone Democrat without Trump.

I think Rubio could have possibly won NH, maybe NV.

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

Lol no he wouldn't have, the Trump base would stay home and he wouldn't win any independents

Why would Trump's base stay home for Kasich, but not Rubio? Ideologically if anything, Trump voters would be more inclined to back Kasich than Rubio, Trump consistently won primaries based on support from 'moderate' republicans. In comparison, Cruz/Rubio both won votes from the more conservative voting cohort.

Yeah, I do think Kasich would have the next best chance after Trump, but his "compassionate conservatism" is a mode of rule that has long been thwarted by all sides of the aisle at this point when expedient. I think Hillary would've managed to outdo his advantages in most of the Midwest by holding Florida [Trump needed an artificially high amount of white vote there], and very narrowly holding Michigan or Pennsylvania.

Hell, given how far Utah, Arizona, and Texas drifted, it's possible Kasich would've won the popular vote at the cost of the electoral college.

[fluffypanther19]

Precisely.

Anyone else would've fed the troll, including Biden.

On the other hand, the rest of the GOP lot weren't seriously willing to part with the toxic far-right Ryanomics to even try and appease the angry base like Trump was, which would've left a nice opening for Hillary to just Obama '12 the thing as originally planned.

If Comey hadn't tipped the scales, and/or there were a few more calendar days for Trump to shoot himself in the foot again, the result would've been quite a bit different.

Kasich would have easily beaten Hillary

Lol no he wouldn't have, the Trump base would stay home and he wouldn't win any independents

this

[mencken]

I've raised this question before, to little response.. County level results seem to suggest that Trump won a fair number of previously Democratic voters, a good number of whom crossed over to vote for him specifically in the primary, but they clearly had no affection for Hillary Clinton either.

I suspect a more conventional Republican wins Wisconsin (where Trump's losses in WOW were enough to offset his gains in the rest of the state), Iowa and Ohio by narrow margins. Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Florida are would have gone Democrat without Trump.

I think Rubio could have possibly won NH, maybe NV.

If Rubio couldn't win either state in the primary, I don't see why he would drum up enough enthusiasm to win them in the general.

[Rookie Yinzer]

She had fundamental problems with her own base, so maybe not. I would honestly have to see how she would have campaigned with a regular Republican opponent.

[uti2]

She had fundamental problems with her own base, so maybe not. I would honestly have to see how she would have campaigned with a regular Republican opponent.

It's been suggested in this thread that a normal republican would've had problems with Trump's base. It should also be kept in mind that Trump himself is at least 10x less the team player than Sanders is. Sanders openly campaigned for Clinton at least, what would Trump have done in that scenario? Trump & Stone were threatening actual riots at the convention.

[Mr. Morden]

She had fundamental problems with her own base, so maybe not. I would honestly have to see how she would have campaigned with a regular Republican opponent.

It's been suggested in this thread that a normal republican would've had problems with Trump's base. It should also be kept in mind that Trump himself is at least 10x less the team player than Sanders is. Sanders openly campaigned for Clinton at least, what would Trump have done in that scenario? Trump & Stone were threatening actual riots at the convention.

Well, obviously it depends on the nature of the hypothetical.  If we're positing a scenario in which, say, Marco Rubio won the nomination instead of Trump, then Trump's base in that hypothetical would not have been as big as it was in real life, or else how does Rubio win the nomination?

Alternatively, you could imagine a hypothetical in which Trump opts not to run for president at all.  In which case, how much of a team player he is doesn't really matter.

[Holy Unifying Centrist]

Kasich was polling +8 against Hillary, idk what garbage you guys are smoking when you say Trumps base would have stayed home. The republican base is far more reliable at voting. Turnout wouldn't even break 53% in Kasich vs Hillary (and low turnout benefits old white Republicans who always vote). Barely anyone would care about the election and Kasich wins plenty of moderates.

Obvious Reminder: Trump underperformed Generic Republicans in basically every state (Even in Pennsylvania and Wisconsin). I guess Minnesota was one of the few exceptions, but the DFL party is really good at getting elected.

Most people wanted Obamacare repealed, most people wanted a more conservative president after Obama, etc. -- It's clear if you look at the exit poll results that people wanted a more conservative president, and obviously Hillary was not that.

[AtorBoltox]

Kasich was polling +8 against Hillary

Only because he basically went unattacked in the GOP primaries. People knew little about him apart from the fact he was a 'sane' republican. When facing the full scrutiny of 1 on 1 Presidential campaign who knows what would have happened