Trump: Guns for teachers will end school shootings
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  Trump: Guns for teachers will end school shootings
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Author Topic: Trump: Guns for teachers will end school shootings  (Read 2518 times)
Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2018, 06:28:25 AM »

It only shows how totally disconnected Trump is from real life IMO.

Marco Rubio had at least the good sense of turning down that proposal in yesterday's town hall.
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Koharu
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« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2018, 07:32:15 AM »

Third-grader pulls trigger on Maplewood cop’s gun, firing a shot

That was with a trained police officer. Thankfully no one was hurt.

Forcing teachers to have yet another job piled on their shoulders, where they may have to use deadly force, is disgusting and wrong.
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Mopsus
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« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2018, 08:03:01 AM »

Lot of anti-Sikh bigotry ITT
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SingingAnalyst
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« Reply #28 on: February 24, 2018, 10:00:39 AM »

Third-grader pulls trigger on Maplewood cop’s gun, firing a shot

That was with a trained police officer. Thankfully no one was hurt.

Forcing teachers to have yet another job piled on their shoulders, where they may have to use deadly force, is disgusting and wrong.
^^^ As a teacher, I couldn't agree more.

In retrospect, it now appears that one or more trained police officers failed to act in Parkland last week. Having trained police or security officers close at hand (not necessarily on school grounds at all times) would seem to be the best, at this time, of a rather bad lot of solutions.

I already have to balance teaching, classroom management, lesson planning, grading, continuing my education as required by the State and my accrediting agency, and overall work-life balance.

Would public funds pay for firearm training for teachers? Would teachers be required to partake? So many other questions about whether to keep it loaded, what about teachers who "snap", and what I might tactfully call the "racial angle": Black teachers who carry put themselves at added risk (remember Philandro Castle) and Black students may be at greater risk of being shot by an errant teacher.

A bad idea, on so many levels. We need to stop grasping at straws.
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HAnnA MArin County
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« Reply #29 on: February 24, 2018, 12:27:19 PM »

Those who can, teach. Those who can't, make laws about teaching.

If this were me, I'd play the Kim Davis card and say that it's against my religion to use guns.
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America's Sweetheart ❤/𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕭𝖔𝖔𝖙𝖞 𝖂𝖆𝖗𝖗𝖎𝖔𝖗
TexArkana
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« Reply #30 on: February 24, 2018, 12:30:17 PM »

And more heroin for heroin addicts will stop overdoses.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #31 on: February 24, 2018, 06:04:09 PM »

Yes --

1. Make the legal age for buying guns and ammo  21.

2. Put more funding into mental health.

3. Ban people who have issues of mental health, drug or alcohol use, or spouse/child abuse from buying guns or ammo. 

I would add

Prohibit people banned from buying guns and ammo in their state from  buying guns and ammo in another state.

Bad ideas:

1. Arming teachers or school administrators.

2. Armed guards at schools. That fosters a gun culture.
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SingingAnalyst
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« Reply #32 on: February 24, 2018, 06:14:15 PM »

Yes --

1. Make the legal age for buying guns and ammo  21.

2. Put more funding into mental health.

3. Ban people who have issues of mental health, drug or alcohol use, or spouse/child abuse from buying guns or ammo. 

I would add

Prohibit people banned from buying guns and ammo in their state from  buying guns and ammo in another state.

Bad ideas:

1. Arming teachers or school administrators.

2. Armed guards at schools. That fosters a gun culture.
I would add requiring would-be gun owners to pass a safety class (just as we do for driver's ed-- we could require something akin to a road test and a written test). This would certainly cut down on both deliberate and accidental shootings, not just the more sensational mass shootings.
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darklordoftech
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« Reply #33 on: February 24, 2018, 06:22:52 PM »

If you treat students like prisoners, they're going to act like prisoners.
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Xing
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« Reply #34 on: February 24, 2018, 07:23:53 PM »

And I'm sure that adding more sugar into our food will end the obesity crisis in this country.

Just like TDAS said, if the money exists to provide us guns, it would be better spent, you know, actually paying us the way other highly qualified professionals like doctors and lawyers are paid.
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Meclazine for Israel
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« Reply #35 on: February 24, 2018, 07:45:25 PM »

In retrospect, it now appears that one or more trained police officers failed to act in Parkland last week. Having trained police or security officers close at hand (not necessarily on school grounds at all times) would seem to be the best, at this time, of a rather bad lot of solutions.

The deputies who failed to enter the situation are being unfairly treated. Think about it; if semi-automatic gun fire started in your neighbourhood, would you run towards it?

So then to ask teachers to run towards it is a stretch.

Whilst I agree that schools are attractive targets to shooters because they are gun-free zones, there should be other solutions. Secure door locks, metal detectors etc.

I just find it hard to blame everyone else but the elephant in the room - availability of military grade guns.

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JGibson
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« Reply #36 on: February 24, 2018, 09:16:15 PM »

Teachers and other school staff with guns = bad idea.
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Dr Oz Lost Party!
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« Reply #37 on: February 24, 2018, 09:34:42 PM »

Dear God, he's such an awful president.
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CookieDamage
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« Reply #38 on: February 24, 2018, 09:51:58 PM »

There are schools in this country that don't even have enough money to pay for heating. Is the GOP going to buy every teacher a gun?
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Fuzzy Stands With His Friend, Chairman Sanchez
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« Reply #39 on: February 24, 2018, 09:53:11 PM »

If you treat students like prisoners, they're going to act like prisoners.

True enough.  But kids are treated like inmates far more by their predatory peers (gang members, drug dealers, pathological bullies, and other head cases) than they are by school staff.

I have advocated arming teachers who are amenable to that for years in both high school and middle school settings.  Such teachers ought to be granted the status of LIMITED Law Enforcement Officers, going through firearms training, including training in tactical shooting, and giving them the status of LIMITED Law Enforcement officers, giving them the power to detain and arrest students and other persons who commit crimes on school campuses.  Not every teacher is suitable for such a status, but  corps of teachers in any school ought to be.  No, I'm not advocating concealed carry for any old teacher, but I AM advocating open carry of a 9 mm semiautomatic pistol for teachers who qualify for this special certification (which, in FL, could be designed and offered through the Florida Department of Law Enforcement).  I would also suggest that any police officer, correctional officer, or probation officer that wished to transition to teaching be afforded a plan for temporary certification (FL needs teachers BADLY!) as teachers, and they would be armed in class, with the special teacher's Limited Law Enforcement certification after some training that would be developed and offered through Law Enforcement Basic Recruit Academies.

I thought of this long before Trump came up with the idea.  Having my then 8 year old son beaten in school to the point of trauma and being unwilling to name his tormentors made me realize that my public school cannot guarantee my son's safety, even though they mandate him to attend public school.  I know a child who was sent to an in-school detention for being 30 secs late to a class, where a psychotic kid beat him to a pulp, leaving him with a lingering head injury, while an unarmed teacher did nothing to protect the boy.  Yes, the resource officer was a minute away, but a traumatic head injury was 10 seconds away.  (I won't even talk about that coward Broward Deputy that didn't even enter the school, or the three (3) others that didn't enter.  I'm too busy puking.)

I'm not real comfortable with my own idea.  It certainly flies in the fact of what I want a school to be.  But I can tell you that Florida's schools do not, and cannot, protect the students they are charged with.  They cannot protect them from external threats and they cannot protect them from their predatory peers.  That's just not acceptable.  And taking away MY firearms and my law-abiding neighbors' firearms isn't going to make the schools any safer.  So you tell me what's going to guarantee the safety of students in our schools who aren't in position to kick ass and take names.
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #40 on: February 24, 2018, 10:28:42 PM »

He's doubled down:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/967472757025001472


I think we should start a petition to take away this genius's Secret Service detail, and replace it with a gun and an annual firearms course.
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Fuzzy Stands With His Friend, Chairman Sanchez
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« Reply #41 on: February 24, 2018, 11:25:13 PM »

He's doubled down because no one else has a more sensible idea that will actually, and immediately, make schools safer for children that are forced to go to them.

A lot of folks here are for gun control because they don't like guns, and they don't like the NRA because it's a GOP interest group.  They really don't care about the safety of schoolchildren because they're now out of high school, but they don't have kids to think about yet.  It's mere politics for them now.  For some of us, however, this issue involves thinking of the safety of lives we are specifically responsible for.  We're playing for keeps, not just to win an argument that will help our favorite candidate win.
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Sestak
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« Reply #42 on: February 24, 2018, 11:26:31 PM »

He's doubled down because no one else has a more sensible idea that will actually, and immediately, make schools safer for children that are forced to go to them.

A lot of folks here are for gun control because they don't like guns, and they don't like the NRA because it's a GOP interest group.  They really don't care about the safety of schoolchildren because they're now out of high school, but they don't have kids to think about yet.  It's mere politics for them now.  For some of us, however, this issue involves thinking of the safety of lives we are specifically responsible for.  We're playing for keeps, not just to win an argument that will help our favorite candidate win.

This is ridiculous. High school students don't care about their own safety? Come on.
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Dr. Arch
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« Reply #43 on: February 24, 2018, 11:36:13 PM »

He's doubled down because no one else has a more sensible idea that will actually, and immediately, make schools safer for children that are forced to go to them.

A lot of folks here are for gun control because they don't like guns, and they don't like the NRA because it's a GOP interest group.  They really don't care about the safety of schoolchildren because they're now out of high school, but they don't have kids to think about yet.  It's mere politics for them now.  For some of us, however, this issue involves thinking of the safety of lives we are specifically responsible for.  We're playing for keeps, not just to win an argument that will help our favorite candidate win.

This is ridiculous. High school students don't care about their own safety? Come on.

Agreed. We just want to feel friggin safe. I'm not a high school student, but I teach. It's always lingering in the back of my mind, and my parents are pretty much perpetually concerned nowadays, seeing that they consider that the mainland is now "the place where they let their own children massacre each other over taking action."
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Dr Oz Lost Party!
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« Reply #44 on: February 24, 2018, 11:37:40 PM »

Because a kindergarten teacher having a gun in the classroom is completely appropriate. This man is an imbecile.
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Koharu
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« Reply #45 on: February 24, 2018, 11:53:20 PM »

He's doubled down because no one else has a more sensible idea that will actually, and immediately, make schools safer for children that are forced to go to them.

A lot of folks here are for gun control because they don't like guns, and they don't like the NRA because it's a GOP interest group.  They really don't care about the safety of schoolchildren because they're now out of high school, but they don't have kids to think about yet.  It's mere politics for them now.  For some of us, however, this issue involves thinking of the safety of lives we are specifically responsible for.  We're playing for keeps, not just to win an argument that will help our favorite candidate win.

Don't you even dare.

I care about school children. I care about one of my closest friends, who is a school teacher. I care about half a dozen of my other friends, who are also school teachers.

But I also care about the teachers I don't know, the students I will never meet, all of them. No child deserves to die, especially not one merely going through their daily routine.

I am for gun control because I truly believe it is the best way to keep children and those who care for them safe. I have nothing against guns themselves. I grew up in a house with a shotgun and rifle, both used for hunting. I do have something against people who believe their right to own any kind of gun they want without licensing trumps the safety of children. I do have something against people who want to continually increase the number of guns in the world. I do have something against people who think they should be allowed to pack heat wherever they want. I do have something against people who are so terrified of the world that they're okay seeing children die time after time if it's the sacrifice that has to be made so they can continue to hold on to their cold metal security blanket.

Don't ever assume that only those who agree with you care about others. In addition to being wrong, it's just disgusting. The reason I believe as strongly as I do is because I believe it the best option, just as you feel about your beliefs.
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darklordoftech
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« Reply #46 on: February 25, 2018, 02:47:39 AM »
« Edited: February 25, 2018, 02:51:26 AM by darklordoftech »

When I was in school, I was far more scared of teachers and security than I was of school shooters. An actual believer in the second amendment (as opposed to someone who thinks teenagers/antifa/Mexicans/Muslims/blacks/socialists are scary) would say that the students should have guns to overthrow tyrannical teachers, principles, superintendents, and school boards.
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #47 on: February 25, 2018, 07:45:17 AM »

The argument that the Second Amendment is intended to allow the people to rebel against a tyrannical government is absurd on its face.  Note the wording:

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Note security of the State.  Not against the State.
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dead0man
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« Reply #48 on: February 25, 2018, 08:01:11 AM »

And more heroin for heroin addicts will stop overdoses.
actually, it does.  As long as it's clean (ie, just heroin) and dosed, addicts aren't going to OD.  Free heroin to heroin addicts is probably the best thing for them.



as for the OP, anybody that tells you they can end school shootings is a liar or the worst authoritarian you'll ever meet and they shouldn't be anywhere near a position of power.
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AtorBoltox
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« Reply #49 on: February 25, 2018, 08:17:30 AM »

And more heroin for heroin addicts will stop overdoses.
actually, it does.  As long as it's clean (ie, just heroin) and dosed, addicts aren't going to OD.  Free heroin to heroin addicts is probably the best thing for them.



as for the OP, anybody that tells you they can end school shootings is a liar or the worst authoritarian you'll ever meet and they shouldn't be anywhere near a position of power.
So school shootings are just a fact of life and can't be stopped? Why then do they rarely, if ever, happen in countries other than the United States?
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