China/Trump ongoing proposal of TARIFFS. Dangerous trade war imminent

[Brittain33]

I seriously hope they're going to disproportionately hurt Trump states. Those f-ckers wanted it, so I want to make sure they're the ones that take it on the chin. California voted for Hillary, thank you very much. We have no interest in a trade war.

People continue to post this sick sh!t and some people are defending it. One of the worst things about the atlas left.

I don't know why we should discuss a trade war as if it were an act of God or a misfortune befalling voters when this has always been a clear and predictable outcome of electing a protectionist President.

What I take issue with is the fact that the atlas left has a tendency to wish suffering on conservatives and in instances where it would be politically advantageous. We should at least have a sense of human decency towards those we disagree with.

While that may be the case... in this case the voters are truly hoist on their own petard.

The central philosophy of the Republican Party under Trump is imposing pain and punishment on others—immigrants, African-Americans, Latinos, people in cities, college students—to improve the relative status of their own voters and “Make America Great Again.” Exhibit A, B, C, D,...Z is every speech Trump gave which should have disqualified him from office, and yet he rolled up historic margins in counties targeted by these sanctions. Why would you call out the “Atlas left” for reacting to this attack on themselves and their political coalition? Why is ok for the Trump coalition to wish harm and destruction on people, and use the federal government to do it?

[HisGrace]

I seriously hope they're going to disproportionately hurt Trump states. Those f-ckers wanted it, so I want to make sure they're the ones that take it on the chin. California voted for Hillary, thank you very much. We have no interest in a trade war.

People continue to post this sick sh!t and some people are defending it. One of the worst things about the atlas left.

I don't know why we should discuss a trade war as if it were an act of God or a misfortune befalling voters when this has always been a clear and predictable outcome of electing a protectionist President.

America 'losing' a trade war, or being forced to back down will probably be incredibly psychologically damaging.

While that is the most likely outcome here, Fox/Breitbart et all will just spin it as Trump somehow "winning" so those in the echo chamber won't care.

[pbrower2a]

America First means the world last so I'm glad to see the PRC isn't holding back against this imperialist attack against them. Also, always good to see America show their true colors.

Rich people in the PRC are going to be pissed.  Too bad they don't have any power...yet.

You've just described what makes the Chinese model much superior than western "democracy" (more like dictatorship of the 1%), rich people don't decide the fate of the other 99%. In the west that has led to trickle down, union bust, stagnant wages and fascists running loose. Good to see China is truly a People's Republic.

Lol almost 40% of the world's billionaires are Chinese thanks to the policies of the Chinese "Communist" Party.

Being a billionaire in China is a curse, the government goes hard after you, the billionaire's list is called "Sha Zhu Bang" (Kill Pigs List) because it's truly bad news, your stocks drop after you make it, lots of them go to prison, a few get the death penalty and half of them actually LOSE wealth, meanwhile, in America, Don Blankenship wants to be Senator.

Also, billionaires DO NOT control the state in China, the party is above anything and they are the representatives of the workers, meanwhile, in the West, being a billionaire can give you an entire political caucus working for you, see the Koch Bros. All I need to know about China being supposedly capitalist is the fact that western capitalists would try to overthow its government in a second if they were submitted to its regulations and the fact that western media always resorts to "evil communists" when China does something they don't like, they only talk about chinese "capitalism" to steal their achievements and try to tie what Dengism has achieved to neoliberalism, despite the latter being a force of destruction who enriches nobody but the 1%, while Dengism has created the longest continuous economic growth in modern times and has never faced a crisis, a typical capitalist feature.

What  is different is that the political apparatus exists first, and then people get rich in China, especially if they  have good connections.  Of course, some aspects  of Chinese  political life are a capitalist's dreams: weak and ineffective unions (if at all), no welfare state, and a harsh system of criminal law. Environmental regulations so far are lax. China is arguably less socialist than most advanced non-communist states. One consequence is severe inequality of economic results.

Of course, America is headed to a dictatorship under Donald Trump, and his idea of "Making America Great Again" looks like a return to the norms of the 1920s in tax structure, the absence of a welfare state, emasculated unions, and a (lax) regulatory climate. The biggest owner of television stations is transforming them all into conduits for right-wing propaganda (that's Sinclair -- not Fox).   

[Beet]

I seriously hope they're going to disproportionately hurt Trump states. Those f-ckers wanted it, so I want to make sure they're the ones that take it on the chin. California voted for Hillary, thank you very much. We have no interest in a trade war.

People continue to post this sick sh!t and some people are defending it. One of the worst things about the atlas left.

I don't know why we should discuss a trade war as if it were an act of God or a misfortune befalling voters when this has always been a clear and predictable outcome of electing a protectionist President.

What I take issue with is the fact that the atlas left has a tendency to wish suffering on conservatives and in instances where it would be politically advantageous. We should at least have a sense of human decency towards those we disagree with.

While that may be the case... in this case the voters are truly hoist on their own petard.

The central philosophy of the Republican Party under Trump is imposing pain and punishment on others—immigrants, African-Americans, Latinos, people in cities, college students—to improve the relative status of their own voters and “Make America Great Again.” Exhibit A, B, C, D,...Z is every speech Trump gave which should have disqualified him from office, and yet he rolled up historic margins in counties targeted by these sanctions. Why would you call out the “Atlas left” for reacting to this attack on themselves and their political coalition? Why is ok for the Trump coalition to wish harm and destruction on people, and use the federal government to do it?

Because two wrongs don't make a right. Because you can't stop others from wishing harm on you by wishing harm on them. What I don't get is - why all the hostility? Why can't we just get along? People -- everyone, should be more pro social. The hate is killing us.

[OSR stands with Israel]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

[Statilius the Epicurean]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

Or we could use normal tools of diplomacy and not sacrifice trade, which enriches all of us.

[OSR stands with Israel]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

Or we could use normal tools of diplomacy and not sacrifice trade, which enriches all of us.

Lol like China will agree to opening new negotiations when the current system benefits them 100 percent.


And what’s wrong with buying products from other countries who can give us products at the same price as China can and not buy them from a country who is a threat to the US

[ProudModerate2]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other) ....

Are you on the same planet as the rest of us? ...
Where do you get such bizarre "economic" ideas?
The chances of this happening are close to zero, so why even discuss it.

[Frodo]

Trump is in the process of reminding us why we as a nation abandoned protectionism as an economic policy in the first place.  I guess we needed the reminder.  

[OSR stands with Israel]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other) ....

Are you on the same planet as the rest of us? ...
Where do you get such bizarre "economic" ideas?
The chances of this happening are close to zero, so why even discuss it.

It’s called trading with countries who can give us the same product that China gives us at the same price who don’t steal US intellectual property, and have an expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

But here is the problem, China can screw us six ways to Sunday, but no one wants to do anything about it because it is too "disruptive".

Whatever you think about Trump, there is a problem here that needs to be addressed somehow. Like I said in 2012, if you don't address it there would be a rebellion on this issue. Now you have a protectionist President.

What do you think will happen next politically if still nothing is done?

[Statilius the Epicurean]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

Or we could use normal tools of diplomacy and not sacrifice trade, which enriches all of us.

Lol like China will agree to opening new negotiations when the current system benefits them 100 percent.

The current system benefits everyone. It's how global wealth has increased 12 times over since the end of WW2.

And what’s wrong with buying products from other countries who can give us products at the same price as China can and not buy them from a country who is a threat to the US

The fact that it would 1) destroy any dispute resolution mechanism for when foreign countries decide to victimise US producers for protectionist or political reasons in turn and 2) it would cost more and those costs would be passed on to American consumers? If countries were selling to the US as cheap as China is then you wouldn't need to raise tariffs on Chinese goods in the first place...  

[OSR stands with Israel]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

Or we could use normal tools of diplomacy and not sacrifice trade, which enriches all of us.

Lol like China will agree to opening new negotiations when the current system benefits them 100 percent.

The current system benefits everyone. It's how global wealth has increased 12 times over since the end of WW2.

And what’s wrong with buying products from other countries who can give us products at the same price as China can and not buy them from a country who is a threat to the US

The fact that it would 1) destroy any dispute resolution mechanism for when foreign countries decide to victimise US producers for protectionist or political reasons in turn and 2) it would cost more and those costs would be passed on to American consumers? If countries were selling to the US as cheap as China is then you wouldn't need to raise tariffs on Chinese goods in the first place...  

It is because we dont have trade agreements with India , Latin America etc


 

[Statilius the Epicurean]

The US , Canada, Europe, Israel, India, Japan, South Korea should unite against the China and demand China do these things or all of them together will put trade restrictions on them(while they increase trade with each other)


- End all support to North Korea Immediately

- Stop their expansionist foreign policy in the Pacific

- Stop stealing intellectual property


China is a threat and should be dealt like one,

Or we could use normal tools of diplomacy and not sacrifice trade, which enriches all of us.

Lol like China will agree to opening new negotiations when the current system benefits them 100 percent.

The current system benefits everyone. It's how global wealth has increased 12 times over since the end of WW2.

And what’s wrong with buying products from other countries who can give us products at the same price as China can and not buy them from a country who is a threat to the US

The fact that it would 1) destroy any dispute resolution mechanism for when foreign countries decide to victimise US producers for protectionist or political reasons in turn and 2) it would cost more and those costs would be passed on to American consumers? If countries were selling to the US as cheap as China is then you wouldn't need to raise tariffs on Chinese goods in the first place...  

It is because we dont have trade agreements with India , Latin America etc

Then sign those agreements to lower trade barriers. That's how free trade works! Nothing is stopping the US from doing so except a protectionist impulse. But if you want something like TPP, signing trade agreements with US allies to contain China, then Trump canned that approach last year.

[ProudModerate2]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[OSR stands with Israel]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

[ProudModerate2]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

[OSR stands with Israel]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators

They steal intellectual property

And they are a threat in the pacific



Threats must be dealt with 

[Person Man]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/china-announces-retaliatory-tariffs-on-dollar34-billion-in-us-goods/ar-AAyHSD8?li=BBnbfcN

[alomas]

12 June - Appease China with exercise cancellation and vows to return US troops.

15 June - Hit China with massive tariffs and accuse them of intellectual theft.

[ProudModerate2]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators
They steal intellectual property
And they are a threat in the pacific
Threats must be dealt with  

And this may all be true, but you didn't answer my question.
If China retaliates in equal form, we are back to square-one, and they are still getting-away with everything you just pointed-out.
So how does that solve anything? Where does that help us? Consumers, employees (and some businesses) here in the USA are hurt.
I don't care to pay more for items I purchase, because the Orange-Narcissist-ManChild is having a world-wide trade tantrum.

[OSR stands with Israel]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators
They steal intellectual property
And they are a threat in the pacific
Threats must be dealt with  

And this may all be true, but you didn't answer my question.
If China retaliates in equal form, we are back to square-one, and they are still getting-away with everything you just pointed-out.
So how does that solve anything? Where does that help us? Consumers, employees (and some businesses) here in the USA are hurt.
I don't care to pay more for items I purchase, because the Orange-Narcissist-ManChild is having a world-wide trade tantrum.

Well yes thats true and that why I only partially support it and not fully. The reason I dont fully support it is because Trump strategy towards this is terrible.


I would prefer doing it the way Romney planned: Get LAFTA passed, TPP passed (Trump stupitly withdrew) and then do this because then we have trade partners we can trade with who can give us goods at the same price China does

[ProudModerate2]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators
They steal intellectual property
And they are a threat in the pacific
Threats must be dealt with  

And this may all be true, but you didn't answer my question.
If China retaliates in equal form, we are back to square-one, and they are still getting-away with everything you just pointed-out.
So how does that solve anything? Where does that help us? Consumers, employees (and some businesses) here in the USA are hurt.
I don't care to pay more for items I purchase, because the Orange-Narcissist-ManChild is having a world-wide trade tantrum.

Well yes thats true and that why I only partially support it and not fully. The reason I dont fully support it is because Trump strategy towards this is terrible.

I would prefer doing it the way Romney planned: Get LAFTA passed, TPP passed (Trump stupitly withdrew) and then do this because then we have trade partners we can trade with who can give us goods at the same price China does

Well, then you and I are in general agreement.
I also thought that TPP would have been good for the USA, to fight the trade "injustices" that China was committing (the ones you listed). It would have given us a Pacific-wide trade association without China as a member, and this could have been used to our advantage (and would have greatly helped the other Pacific nations in the association).
But because it was "an Obama idea," the Orange Clown and his cult followers dismissed it and now we are all in this mess that trump created.

[Badger]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators

They steal intellectual property

And they are a threat in the pacific



Threats must be dealt with 

By shooting ourselves in the foot?

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

While I 100% oppose Trump's Tariffs on Canada and the EU , I partially support them on China because China has already been waging a trade war against the United States and it is time for the United States to respond.

And when China places an equal amount of tariffs on our exports, the net effect from tariffs is zero. Except you and I pay more for many items, some US businesses do benefit, but some others will be harmed (and some may shut-down).
Is that what you want? There is no substantial, overall benefit to the USA or its citizens, unless China doesn't retaliate (which is not going to happen).

China are currency manipulators

They steal intellectual property

And they are a threat in the pacific



Threats must be dealt with 

By shooting ourselves in the foot?

Trump appears to be aiming higher.