Pope Francis: It's okay to be gay

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

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Relevant Magazine

HE SAID IT
...And without any 'buts,' either!

[afleitch]

It'll be clarified within days to mean something completely different. What he said isn't necessarily contrary to what the church has said before and doesn't validate loving gay relationships.

[Blue3]

This has been the Catholic positon for years/decades.

The thing is "it's ok to be gay, God loves you as you are... but you should choose celibacy, that is in your control, this is a test."

[afleitch]

This has been the Catholic positon for years/decades.

The thing is "it's ok to be gay, God loves you as you are... but you should choose celibacy, that is in your control, this is a test."

Yes. Celibacy conditions imposed by the Church on a sexuality gifted from god.

[7,052,770]

Baby steps, guys. If he makes it 10 more years, the Church will have full gay marriage within 2 popes.

[TPIG]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

[7,052,770]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

[RINO Tom]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

[Citation needed]

[TPIG]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

It's certainly not true that nobody cares, and for those Catholics that are apathetic on this issue, that represents a failure of the church and its adherents to live up to its ideals. Unless the church is going to give up on the idea of mortal sins and sanctifying grace, which it won't, it's wholly wrong to mislead people on a matter that jeopardizes their eternity.

[7,052,770]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

[Citation needed]

Do you want to see my Confirmation certificate or something?

[7,052,770]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

It's certainly not true that nobody cares, and for those Catholics that are apathetic on this issue, that represents a failure of the church and its adherents to live up to its ideals. Unless the church is going to give up on the idea of mortal sins and sanctifying grace, which it won't, it's wholly wrong to mislead people on a matter that jeopardizes their eternity.

The Episcopal Church, which is basically the same thing with a few cosmetic differences, has already laid out a framework for complete LGBT affirmation, which the Catholic Church could just copy and tweak.

Just because your particular denomination believes that homosexuality is a sin doesn't mean all denominations do.

[TPIG]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

It's certainly not true that nobody cares, and for those Catholics that are apathetic on this issue, that represents a failure of the church and its adherents to live up to its ideals. Unless the church is going to give up on the idea of mortal sins and sanctifying grace, which it won't, it's wholly wrong to mislead people on a matter that jeopardizes their eternity.

The Episcopal Church, which is basically the same thing with a few cosmetic differences, has already laid out a framework for complete LGBT affirmation, which the Catholic Church could just copy and tweak.

Just because your particular denomination believes that homosexuality is a sin doesn't mean all denominations do.

I understand that not all Christian denominations consider homosexuality a sin, but you specifically said that Catholics don't care about this issue, which is untrue. The Catechism of the church says 'Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered." They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved."

That remains the position of the church and to make people think otherwise is wrong.

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church universally said one thing since the Roman Empire, and now Francis is saying another thing.  I'm not sure why a pope would in essence say that every Catholic was wrong before the last few decades, but I'm not Catholic.  I wonder what African Catholics are thinking about this.

Anyway, it seems like Pope Francis is trying to be confusing.  He wants to keep everyone happy so he talks out of both sides of his mouth.  He would have made a great politician.

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church universally said one thing since the Roman Empire, and now Francis is saying another thing.  I'm not sure why a pope would in essence say that every Catholic was wrong before the last few decades, but I'm not Catholic.  I wonder what African Catholics are thinking about this.

Anyway, it seems like Pope Francis is trying to be confusing.  He wants to keep everyone happy so he talks out of both sides of his mouth.  He would have made a great politician.

Tell that to the actively homosexual popes. Why is change so difficult on literally any issue? How did it take so long to develop universal morals on slavery?

[7,052,770]

I understand that not all Christian denominations consider homosexuality a sin, but you specifically said that Catholics don't care about this issue, which is untrue. The Catechism of the church says 'Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered." They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved."

That remains the position of the church and to make people think otherwise is wrong.

Yeah, I probably overstated it a little bit, but it was in response to you citing "sacred scripture" when discussing the beliefs on a denomination that's explicitly not Bible literalist. If you don't believe in the literal inerrancy of the Bible, it's very easy to make the case that homosexuality isn't a sin.

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church universally said one thing since the Roman Empire, and now Francis is saying another thing.  I'm not sure why a pope would in essence say that every Catholic was wrong before the last few decades, but I'm not Catholic.  I wonder what African Catholics are thinking about this.

Anyway, it seems like Pope Francis is trying to be confusing.  He wants to keep everyone happy so he talks out of both sides of his mouth.  He would have made a great politician.

"Every Catholic" ...

Polls show high support (sometimes majority, sometimes not) all over the world (OK, not Africa really) for LGBT equality among Catholics. This transition is inevitable in all churches in developed countries, just like they've all eventually stopped supporting slavery and Jim Crow. It may the Catholics in the 2020s, the Baptists in the 2030s, and the Pentecostals in the 2040s, or it may be later [or sooner] in all 3, but it's coming.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

My friends have been calling me gay for years, so this is a relief.

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church universally said one thing since the Roman Empire, and now Francis is saying another thing.  I'm not sure why a pope would in essence say that every Catholic was wrong before the last few decades, but I'm not Catholic.  I wonder what African Catholics are thinking about this.

Anyway, it seems like Pope Francis is trying to be confusing.  He wants to keep everyone happy so he talks out of both sides of his mouth.  He would have made a great politician.

Tell that to the actively homosexual popes. Why is change so difficult on literally any issue? How did it take so long to develop universal morals on slavery?

I'm guessing that change is difficult in the RCC because change could mean that the previous popes were wrong.

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church universally said one thing since the Roman Empire, and now Francis is saying another thing.  I'm not sure why a pope would in essence say that every Catholic was wrong before the last few decades, but I'm not Catholic.  I wonder what African Catholics are thinking about this.

Anyway, it seems like Pope Francis is trying to be confusing.  He wants to keep everyone happy so he talks out of both sides of his mouth.  He would have made a great politician.

"Every Catholic" ...

Polls show high support (sometimes majority, sometimes not) all over the world (OK, not Africa really) for LGBT equality among Catholics. This transition is inevitable in all churches in developed countries, just like they've all eventually stopped supporting slavery and Jim Crow. It may the Catholics in the 2020s, the Baptists in the 2030s, and the Pentecostals in the 2040s, or it may be later [or sooner] in all 3, but it's coming.

What is much more likely is that we'll see the evaporation of the religious center and instead there will be a very religious minority and a secular majority with little in between.  I don't know if theological liberalism will still be relevant in 2040.  Christian support of slavery and Jim Crow was never universal, so that comparison doesn't make sense.

And pretty much all Catholics were against homosexuality until very recently.  The only reasons for Catholics to go against church teaching are 1) Someone wants to be in a homosexual relationship and still be Catholic, 2) Someone still wants to be Catholic but also wants to be part of respectable society, or 3) Someone wants to remain Catholic out of tradition but ignores Church teaching.  That's all I can come up with.

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

But it's not ok to have gay sex, right? I always thought that was the Catholic position.

[Mr. Smith]

Forgive me, but I don't see any change here, not even a re-posturing. Seems like an unnecessary re-affirmation.

[Sir Mohamed]

But it's not ok to have gay sex, right? I always thought that was the Catholic position.

Agreed. The same is true for pastors, who aren't gay.

[RINO Tom]

Pretty dangerous for the Pope to be misleading people on this issue. Sacred scripture makes it quite clear that homosexuality is a grave sin and that has always been the position of the church, and still is.

LOL nobody cares, at least not in the Catholic Church. That's why despite being mostly ex-Catholic, the Catholic Church will still always be superior to Evangelicals.

[Citation needed]

Do you want to see my Confirmation certificate or something?

Hahaha, my bad, man.  In retrospect, that looks hilarious.  I read it as you saying most Catholics were ex-Catholics.

[courts]

But it's not ok to have gay sex, right? I always thought that was the Catholic position.

more like it's not ok to have sex outside of marriage period

[Illiniwek]

The thread title makes me think of seeing Brother Jed spew his hate speech on the Quad ever spring and fall down at UofI. He would sing a song called "Its Not Ok To Be Gay". It was always really fun to troll him and get him all riled up.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

The thread title makes me think of seeing Brother Jed spew his hate speech on the Quad ever spring and fall down at UofI. He would sing a song called "Its Not Ok To Be Gay". It was always really fun to troll him and get him all riled up.

Oh my God, that guy's hilarious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-t8DZAcP09k

What an honor it must have been to be in his presence.

[America Needs a 13-6 Progressive SCOTUS]

The church is usually about 2 or 3 centuries behind on social issues. I would expect full acceptance of LGB people in the church to come in the 23rd century.