Sen. Merkley: Barred from migrant processing center, attacked by White House

[JA]

The White House responds to Jeff Merkley: He’s to blame for immigrant crimes

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Sen. Jeff Merkley says images of migrant processing center are "seared" in his mind

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[Unapologetic Chinaperson]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

[Progressive Pessimist]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

If they are hated by people like us, it just makes the people who support them become more devout. I doubt it's part of a Machiavellan plan or anything, they aren't that smart. But they are that opportunistic.

[GeorgiaModerate]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

If they are hated by people like us, it just makes the people who support them become more devout. I doubt it's part of a Machiavellan plan or anything, they aren't that smart. But they are that opportunistic.

It's a whole mentality.  Everyone is either with them or against them, and everything is zero-sum.  They can only go up if the other side goes down.  They can only win if someone else loses.  This is also exemplified by Trump's philosophy on trade; if the US has a trade deficit, we must be losing in his mind.  (It's always surprised me that a businessman doesn't realize the strength of a win-win philosophy, but he clearly doesn't.)

[Progressive Pessimist]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

If they are hated by people like us, it just makes the people who support them become more devout. I doubt it's part of a Machiavellan plan or anything, they aren't that smart. But they are that opportunistic.

It's a whole mentality.  Everyone is either with them or against them, and everything is zero-sum.  They can only go up if the other side goes down.  They can only win if someone else loses.  This is also exemplified by Drumpf's philosophy on trade; if the US has a trade deficit, we must be losing in his mind.  (It's always surprised me that a businessman doesn't realize the strength of a win-win philosophy, but he clearly doesn't.)

It's a very problematic mentality that is permeating the Republican Party and conservatism at large. They can tell you everything they are against but very rarely do they espouse what they are in favor of without denigrating someone or something else. Trump saw that, capitalized on it, and made it the status quo.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Don't you know that Bernie supporters only care about economic issues?

[Bidenworth2020]

Don't you know that Bernie supporters only care about economic issues?

ayy lmao

[JA]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

If they are hated by people like us, it just makes the people who support them become more devout. I doubt it's part of a Machiavellan plan or anything, they aren't that smart. But they are that opportunistic.

It's a whole mentality.  Everyone is either with them or against them, and everything is zero-sum.  They can only go up if the other side goes down.  They can only win if someone else loses.  This is also exemplified by Drumpf's philosophy on trade; if the US has a trade deficit, we must be losing in his mind.  (It's always surprised me that a businessman doesn't realize the strength of a win-win philosophy, but he clearly doesn't.)

It's a very problematic mentality that is permeating the Republican Party and conservatism at large. They can tell you everything they are against but very rarely do they espouse what they are in favor of without denigrating someone or something else. Trump saw that, capitalized on it, and made it the status quo.

That's because, aside from hate or opposition, they really don't have anything on which they all agree.  Their coalition is composed of a White working class that hates the fiscal agenda of the Congressional GOP and a White collar class that primarily supports said fiscal agenda.

[Badger]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

[Rookie Yinzer]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

[I’m not Stu]

I saw the part about Merkley being rebuffed already, and that's bad enough, but the White House going out of their way to shame him? Are they trying to be hated?

I think Trump wants to be hated in California. I think he would actually be happy if Cox loses to Newsom. Trump couldn't care less if his buddies Dana Rohrabacher and Devin Nunes lose re-election.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

Being a working American, I can't be on Atlas all day on my employer's dime.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

But Jeff Merkley is a US Senator.  He's an overseer of these organizations, and he has a right to see firsthand how his tax dollars are used.  And if this were a PUBLIC facility, he'd have gotten in, but it's not.  It's a privatized detention center; part of the privatized prison industry, and those folks can lean on their "private" label to do these sorts of things to a sitting Senator (especially one hostile to their industry).

It is long past time to end private prisons, private jails, and private detention facilities in our societies.  Let the government detain and confine in its own name, and not through some corporate do-boys that have contributed enough money to campaigns to where the recipients of those monies will overlook their abuses.  Prisons are a necessary evil.  Private Prisons are modern slavery. 

[Badger]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

Being a working American, I can't be on Atlas all day on my employer's dime.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

But Jeff Merkley is a US Senator.  He's an overseer of these organizations, and he has a right to see firsthand how his tax dollars are used.  And if this were a PUBLIC facility, he'd have gotten in, but it's not.  It's a privatized detention center; part of the privatized prison industry, and those folks can lean on their "private" label to do these sorts of things to a sitting Senator (especially one hostile to their industry).

It is long past time to end private prisons, private jails, and private detention facilities in our societies.  Let the government detain and confine in its own name, and not through some corporate do-boys that have contributed enough money to campaigns to where the recipients of those monies will overlook their abuses.  Prisons are a necessary evil.  Private Prisons are modern slavery. 

Or, maybe, immigration laws should be changed so that such horrid unchristian practices aren't followed, especially against relative Innocents who are largely guilty of no crime greater than wanting a better life in America but not being able to afford over 10 grand for an immigration attorney and coming from, as the nurse assistant chief puts it, sh**tholecountries rather than nice white ones like Norway

[Fuzzy Bear]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

Being a working American, I can't be on Atlas all day on my employer's dime.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

But Jeff Merkley is a US Senator.  He's an overseer of these organizations, and he has a right to see firsthand how his tax dollars are used.  And if this were a PUBLIC facility, he'd have gotten in, but it's not.  It's a privatized detention center; part of the privatized prison industry, and those folks can lean on their "private" label to do these sorts of things to a sitting Senator (especially one hostile to their industry).

It is long past time to end private prisons, private jails, and private detention facilities in our societies.  Let the government detain and confine in its own name, and not through some corporate do-boys that have contributed enough money to campaigns to where the recipients of those monies will overlook their abuses.  Prisons are a necessary evil.  Private Prisons are modern slavery. 

Or, maybe, immigration laws should be changed so that such horrid unchristian practices aren't followed, especially against relative Innocents who are largely guilty of no crime greater than wanting a better life in America but not being able to afford over 10 grand for an immigration attorney and coming from, as the nurse assistant chief puts it, sh**tholecountries rather than nice white ones like Norway

How we treat detainees is a valid humanitarian issue.

Having closed borders is not.  It's a national sovereignty issue.  WE get to decide who comes into our country and who doesn't, and no one has a right to come in just because their uncle or cousin did.

Countries like Norway don't send immigrants to the US because they are prosperous.  They don't have particularly open borders, either.  The solution to the lives of the non-prosperous folks is not to import them all to the US.  It's just not. 

[Panda Express]

The issue at hand here is not about your views on immigration.The issue at hand is how we should treat detainees. Even if you think they should all be deported, any civilized or moral person would want it to be done in a humane manner. I understand a large part of Trump’s base is comprised of nihilistic deplorables, but I have to believe good patriotic Americans would find this unacceptable.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that. 

Yeah, sounds like something Jesus Christ would say

[KingSweden]

The issue at hand here is not about your views on immigration.The issue at hand is how we should treat detainees. Even if you think they should all be deported, any civilized or moral person would want it to be done in a humane manner. I understand a large part of Trump’s base is comprised of nihilistic deplorables, but I have to believe good patriotic Americans would find this unacceptable.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that. 

Yeah, sounds like something Jesus Christ would say

This is more or less my view.

[Fuzzy Bear]

The issue at hand here is not about your views on immigration.The issue at hand is how we should treat detainees. Even if you think they should all be deported, any civilized or moral person would want it to be done in a humane manner. I understand a large part of Trump’s base is comprised of nihilistic deplorables, but I have to believe good patriotic Americans would find this unacceptable.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that. 

Yeah, sounds like something Jesus Christ would say

That's one thing I love about Atlas.  I am always amused when folks, especially those who advocate abortion on demand and same-sex marriage (lambasting those who dissent as HPs) insist that Jesus would be the God of Open Borders, even when there is much Biblical evidence to show that Jesus would not sign off on abortion or SSM and no evidence that Jesus would be an open borders guy. 

There is a difference between mercy and justice, and the difference is that mercy is not an entitlement.  That's not a justification of harsh confinement conditions for these detainees; that appears to be a function of the profit motive of a private prison company that houses these detainees.  But it IS a statement to address the fact that these folks KNOWINGLY sought to break our laws.  Breaking into my place of employment isn't a good way to get hired by my boss, nor is it a good way to convince my boss that you're of good character.  Maybe I'm getting senile, but, somehow, I find the analogy valid.

[pbrower2a]

Silence from The Usual Suspects in this thread. I don't think it's any sense of Shame, of course, just they know when they're orange oberfuhrer can't be defended.

Cruelty in service to the Personality Cult is expected, and any opposition to that cruelty is treachery. Fascism depends upon a puerile lack of empathy and upon loyalty no higher than the level of the tribe (even if the nation is the tribe). 

[Koharu]

The issue at hand here is not about your views on immigration.The issue at hand is how we should treat detainees. Even if you think they should all be deported, any civilized or moral person would want it to be done in a humane manner. I understand a large part of Trump’s base is comprised of nihilistic deplorables, but I have to believe good patriotic Americans would find this unacceptable.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that. 

Yeah, sounds like something Jesus Christ would say

That's one thing I love about Atlas.  I am always amused when folks, especially those who advocate abortion on demand and same-sex marriage (lambasting those who dissent as HPs) insist that Jesus would be the God of Open Borders, even when there is much Biblical evidence to show that Jesus would not sign off on abortion or SSM and no evidence that Jesus would be an open borders guy. 

There is a difference between mercy and justice, and the difference is that mercy is not an entitlement.  That's not a justification of harsh confinement conditions for these detainees; that appears to be a function of the profit motive of a private prison company that houses these detainees.  But it IS a statement to address the fact that these folks KNOWINGLY sought to break our laws.  Breaking into my place of employment isn't a good way to get hired by my boss, nor is it a good way to convince my boss that you're of good character.  Maybe I'm getting senile, but, somehow, I find the analogy valid.

As a Christian myself, lol lol lol lol. Please provide this "evidence." Also, let's consider the fact that Mary and Joseph were refugees for a while to protect their son from a corrupt government. Jesus routinely argued for/provided mercy for those who went against the social norms and was happy to break religious laws when it was obvious people would suffer by being forced to keep them. Mercy is not an entitlement, for sure, but humane treatment is.

[Mr. Morden]

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

Wait, I'm confused.  Is this migrant processing center only for those who crossed illegally?  I thought it included those who showed up at the border and claimed refugee status?  If I'm coming up from Guatemala or whatever and showing up at the border saying that I'm a refugee, have I done anything illegal?  Doesn't the illegal part only come into play if I sneak across the border and evade detection?

[GeorgiaModerate]

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

Wait, I'm confused.  Is this migrant processing center only for those who crossed illegally?  I thought it included those who showed up at the border and claimed refugee status?  If I'm coming up from Guatemala or whatever and showing up at the border saying that I'm a refugee, have I done anything illegal?  Doesn't the illegal part only come into play if I sneak across the border and evade detection?

You are correct.  The separated families include some who have presented themselves to seek asylum in accordance with U.S. law.

[Fuzzy Bear]

The issue at hand here is not about your views on immigration.The issue at hand is how we should treat detainees. Even if you think they should all be deported, any civilized or moral person would want it to be done in a humane manner. I understand a large part of Trump’s base is comprised of nihilistic deplorables, but I have to believe good patriotic Americans would find this unacceptable.

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that. 

Yeah, sounds like something Jesus Christ would say

That's one thing I love about Atlas.  I am always amused when folks, especially those who advocate abortion on demand and same-sex marriage (lambasting those who dissent as HPs) insist that Jesus would be the God of Open Borders, even when there is much Biblical evidence to show that Jesus would not sign off on abortion or SSM and no evidence that Jesus would be an open borders guy. 

There is a difference between mercy and justice, and the difference is that mercy is not an entitlement.  That's not a justification of harsh confinement conditions for these detainees; that appears to be a function of the profit motive of a private prison company that houses these detainees.  But it IS a statement to address the fact that these folks KNOWINGLY sought to break our laws.  Breaking into my place of employment isn't a good way to get hired by my boss, nor is it a good way to convince my boss that you're of good character.  Maybe I'm getting senile, but, somehow, I find the analogy valid.

As a Christian myself, lol lol lol lol. Please provide this "evidence." Also, let's consider the fact that Mary and Joseph were refugees for a while to protect their son from a corrupt government. Jesus routinely argued for/provided mercy for those who went against the social norms and was happy to break religious laws when it was obvious people would suffer by being forced to keep them. Mercy is not an entitlement, for sure, but humane treatment is.

The underlined part is a misstatement.  Jesus didn't "argue for mercy" for nonconformists; he GRANTED mercy to SINNERS and COMMANDED his Diciples to forgive those who wronged them "not seven (times), but seventy times seven (times)".  Jesus wasn't some really cool liberal pundit of is day; he was the Word Made Flesh and dwelling amongst us.  He  WAS and IS the Lord of All, and not just the guy with the biggest Twitter following in the ancient Commentariat.

I'd also point out that Joseph and Mary never left the Roman Empire during their flight.  I grant you that this was a time when the concept of nation-states was significantly different than it is now.  

Jesus was the enemy of the religious establishment, and he called out their hypocrisy over and over, but when he showed mercy, he did not fail to mention the sin of those he was showing mercy to.  To the Woman at the Well, He pointed out that she had five husbands, and the man she was with now was not her husband.  To the woman who was about to be stoned to death for adultery, he specifically mentioned that she was guilty, and under the law the penalty was justified.  When he scattered their accusers, he told her, "Neither do I condemn thee.  Go, then, and sin no more."  He called a tax collector (the "legal theives" of the day) from a tree to dinner, and he called the man to repentance, but he made the man aware of his sin, after which he vowed to restore those he cheated fourfold.  

How would Jesus view folks crashing the Southern border?  I certainly believe he would call out folks for maintaining harsh conditions in detention facilities.  But would he tell us to open up our borders to everyone in a tight spot that wants in?  

https://www.gotquestions.org/illegal-immigration.html

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I wonder which Jesus the above poster believes in?  Is it the Jesus who was born of a Virgin, who was crucified and died for our sins, who rose from the dead, who ascended into Heaven, who will come back for His Church, and will rule this World for 1,000 years?  The Jesus who is the Only Begotton Son of God?  Or is he something less?  Lots of folks who say they're Christians and who subscribe to a great many of his teachings do not believe that He is all of who He said he is.  It is onlyt the Jesus that is all He said he was in Scripture that has any authority.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I don't feel sorry for the fact that those trying to illegally come to our country are being detained, on the way to being sent back to where they came from.  They don't have a right to be here, and the heart-wrenching scenes from inside the detention center doesn't change that.  These folks shouldn't have done what they did, and they shouldn't have involved their kids in it, either.

Wait, I'm confused.  Is this migrant processing center only for those who crossed illegally?  I thought it included those who showed up at the border and claimed refugee status?  If I'm coming up from Guatemala or whatever and showing up at the border saying that I'm a refugee, have I done anything illegal?  Doesn't the illegal part only come into play if I sneak across the border and evade detection?

You are correct.  The separated families include some who have presented themselves to seek asylum in accordance with U.S. law.

I understand this, and I'm not condoning the conditions.  Neither am I condoning Trump's response to Merkley.