Crimea
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Author Topic: Crimea  (Read 1540 times)
DavidB.
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« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2018, 11:04:59 AM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.
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Karpatsky
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« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2018, 11:36:16 AM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.

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kelestian
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« Reply #27 on: July 17, 2018, 12:14:31 PM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.


Putin wouldn't annex it if crimean population didn't want it. Also i don't think it's imperialism, more like irredentism, but that's another question.
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America Needs R'hllor
Parrotguy
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« Reply #28 on: July 17, 2018, 02:19:45 PM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.


Putin wouldn't annex it if crimean population didn't want it. Also i don't think it's imperialism, more like irredentism, but that's another question.

If the population of the Russian Far East randomly deicded they'd really fancy to be part of America and the U.S. conquered it, would you call it imperialism?
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Helsinkian
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« Reply #29 on: July 17, 2018, 02:50:11 PM »

It should be noted that in Russia even suggesting that a part of the country should secede from the Russian Federation is a crime that can land you in prison for years.
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muon2
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« Reply #30 on: July 17, 2018, 11:12:24 PM »

Arguably Khrushchev shouldn't have transferred the Crimea to Ukraine, but that certainly was no excuse for Putin's invasion.

The treaty that recognized the breakup of the USSR should have taken a moment to look at internal moves made during the Soviet era and determined if they reflected new national boundaries or the bureaucracies of the Soviet state. That treaty should have been the time and place to adjudicate the future of Crimea.
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Karpatsky
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« Reply #31 on: July 18, 2018, 08:24:42 AM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.


Putin wouldn't annex it if crimean population didn't want it. Also i don't think it's imperialism, more like irredentism, but that's another question.

Is that why he rigged the status referendum instead of having a fair election to find out whether they actually wanted it?
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
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« Reply #32 on: July 18, 2018, 08:54:34 AM »

If Russia had respected Ukraine's sovereignty and not gone full imperialistic for the sake of boosting Putin's domestic popularity, Crimea would be still be under Ukrainian control. Now, it seems, Crimea will be under Russian control for a long time.
Fixed that for you.

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Torie
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« Reply #33 on: July 18, 2018, 09:27:22 AM »

Arguably Khrushchev shouldn't have transferred the Crimea to Ukraine, but that certainly was no excuse for Putin's invasion.

The treaty that recognized the breakup of the USSR should have taken a moment to look at internal moves made during the Soviet era and determined if they reflected new national boundaries or the bureaucracies of the Soviet state. That treaty should have been the time and place to adjudicate the future of Crimea.

Good point, but one complication is that Stalin took measures by authoritarian means to change the demographics of Crimea, and Russianize it. That does not necessarily mean that one should try to put the genie back in the bottle, but it is a factor. I also read somewhere, I think, that if a referendum had been held in Crimea as to which nation they preferred to be a part of prior to Russia taking it over by force of arms, even though Russianized, the polls suggested that the voters would have picked the Ukraine. So that is another complicating element, if what I think is true, is in fact true.
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kelestian
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« Reply #34 on: July 18, 2018, 11:17:55 AM »

It should be noted that in Russia even suggesting that a part of the country should secede from the Russian Federation is a crime that can land you in prison for years.

Yes, and i think it's not good. If, for example, Chechens want independence, they should get it.
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