Between SS privatization & SS state opt-out, which would you prefer?
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  Between SS privatization & SS state opt-out, which would you prefer?
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Question: Between SS privatization & SS state opt-out, which would you prefer?
#1
Social Security is completely privatized
 
#2
States can opt-out of Social Security, and their resident no longer taxed, if they don't want it
 
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Total Voters: 37

Author Topic: Between SS privatization & SS state opt-out, which would you prefer?  (Read 1277 times)
Blue3
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« on: August 08, 2018, 09:36:14 PM »

Between Social Security privatization & Social Security state opt-out, which would you prefer?

If a state "opts out" then their residents would no longer pay the taxes, and no longer receive the benefits, of the federal Social Security program.

Or there's complete privatization.

There's more options, but if these were the only 2, which is better?
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Dr. Arch
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« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2018, 10:33:04 PM »
« Edited: August 09, 2018, 08:25:46 AM by Arch »

Opt out, easily
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Mr. Smith
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« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2018, 11:26:40 PM »

Opt out.
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Santander
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« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2018, 11:32:38 PM »

I love SS.
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NewYorkExpress
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2018, 12:15:34 AM »

I'd rather see our military budget zeroed out, and that money put into social security, than either of these two options.
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Co-Chair Bagel23
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2018, 12:16:42 AM »

By states, at least some will still have it.
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🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2018, 12:41:47 AM »

opt-out: How does this work?   If you move, do you stop getting Social Security benefits?   

privatization: what does this mean?  What is privatized?
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Fuzzy Stands With His Friend, Chairman Sanchez
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« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2018, 09:13:06 AM »

I favor neither version, but privatization is better than opt out.  I have no faith that my state won't be stupid.
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KingSweden
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« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2018, 09:28:08 AM »

I favor neither version, but privatization is better than opt out.  I have no faith that my state won't be stupid.

Yeah this. Some countries have made semi-privatization work (like Chile). Of course I have zero confidence we could make it work here.
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Torie
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« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2018, 09:34:03 AM »

One problem with privatization is that about 95% of the population is clueless about investing, and manages to earn about 2% per annum under market returns. Social security is a marvelous program. The two options are fraught with huge and negative policy problems.
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mvd10
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« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2018, 09:35:58 AM »

I favor neither version, but privatization is better than opt out.  I have no faith that my state won't be stupid.

This tbh, enough states would be stupid or nihilist enough to go for the opt out

Privatization sounds like a nice and wonky idea on paper, but you'll have enormous transition issues which means either exploding the deficit or wanking current seniors. I'd favour (voluntary) partial privatization if it's done in a cautious way, maybe allow people to invest up to 15% of their SS taxes in personal accounts or so (if the budgetary situation allows for it, there will be some transition issues).

The second problem with privatization is that a lot of privatization proposals include some guarantee, which kinda defeats the idea of privatization and will inevitably end up badly for obvious reasons.
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Saint Milei
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« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2018, 02:16:30 PM »

Opt out. Privatizing is difficult and too many people rely on it
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2018, 03:05:07 PM »

Opt out. Privatizing is difficult and too many people rely on it
Exactly. It's too critical a program.
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I’m not Stu
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« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2018, 03:08:16 PM »

Opt-out. SS should remain a public entity.
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Holy Unifying Centrist
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« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2018, 03:10:28 PM »

The SS need to stay. They are fantastic
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Santander
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« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2018, 03:20:03 PM »

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Technocracy Timmy
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« Reply #16 on: August 09, 2018, 03:34:12 PM »


I tried getting a job at the SS office recently but I didn’t quite have all the necessary paperwork available :/
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Santander
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« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2018, 03:37:52 PM »


I tried getting a job at the SS office recently but I didn’t quite have all the necessary paperwork available :/

Surely you didn't need paperwork to prove your Aryan heritage?
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#gravelgang #lessiglad
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« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2018, 09:43:34 AM »

Privatization, easily. As long as this means that I can take my social security contributions and invest them in my own personal account in index funds. If it means that the government invests it in one of those junk target retirement funds with unnecessarily high fees, then pass.
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Indy Texas
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« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2018, 05:50:47 PM »

I don't understand why opt-out would be a state decision when state governments don't contribute anything to Social Security. (As opposed to Medicaid, which they do pay for part of.)

You also get into the issue of people moving from one state to another, and of cities that border two states so people could be living in one and working in another.

What would happen if a state opted out and then opted back in later on? (Or vice versa.)

As far as privatization, you're going to have to get more specific.

My personal conception of privatization was always that the Social Security trust fund would function more like a sovereign wealth fund and be investing in stocks, real estate and various types of bonds. But people would still pay their fixed FICA tax rate, and the payouts would still function as they do now. I would be averse to this precisely because I can't imagine what sort of scammy embezzlement Trump would be engaging in with Wilbur Ross and all the other usual suspects.
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DavidB.
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« Reply #20 on: August 15, 2018, 05:55:05 PM »

A privatized SS, would that have been something like Blackwater?
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Famous Mortimer
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« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2018, 06:03:59 PM »

opt-out: How does this work?   If you move, do you stop getting Social Security benefits?   

I assume no one answered this question because their is no answer. Opt out is logistically impossible.
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Ohioguy29
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« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2018, 06:21:11 PM »

In the words of Lindsey Graham, "It's like being shot or poisoned. What does it really matter?"
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Blue3
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« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2018, 10:37:14 PM »

opt-out: How does this work?   If you move, do you stop getting Social Security benefits?   

I assume no one answered this question because their is no answer. Opt out is logistically impossible.
See how Medicaid works from state to state.
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Kyle Rittenhouse is a Political Prisoner
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« Reply #24 on: August 15, 2018, 11:47:54 PM »

I vote for forcing people to just invest in the Dow. SS has sh**tty returns.
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