SB 2018-302: Living Wage Act (Debating)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I think the best approach is a combination of what Haslam and Pericles said. A phase in period, combined with some kind of cost of living basis for the wage in different areas of the country.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I think the best approach is a combination of what Haslam and Pericles said. A phase in period, combined with some kind of cost of living basis for the wage in different areas of the country.

Clearly thats the best method but is unlikely with this Senate.

Hope springs eternal!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

To begin with as a frame of reference, I started working in retail in 2014 making 7.65 an hour. I got bumped up to $9 in 2015, $10 in 2016 and finally $11 early this year. So remember that this bill would directly impact people in the exact same situation that I am in IRL.


The thing about the minimum wage is that it is a singular standard, but wages differ in relation to economies that very across the country. You have areas where $15 is a significant amount of money, and you have areas where $15 won't even pay the rent. There is also the reality that companies over the next ten years are going to aggressively be exploring ways to eliminate human labor in its entirety to cut costs and avoid waste in form of training associates who then quit or change jobs. Machines can be used until worn out and then replaced.

Against the backdrop of that reality, it must be remembered that the minimum wage is not, it is not a magic bullet that will suddenly make everyone in Alabama rich. The minimum wage is just that, a floor, it is not a path to long term economic improvement, that is education. However, for many people incremental increases in the minimum wage can be very beneficial if implemented smartly and careful and in relation to the context in which it has impacts.

Therefore I find myself as I stated while President in agreement with then Senator Haslam, that it is important for the minimum wage to be staggered or in some other fashion structured to reflect the marked differences between areas that have such markedly different standards of living. I also find myself in agreement with former Speaker Pericles that it has to be phased in over a period of time.

Finally, I think strong consideration should be given to the point made by 1184AZ, that in effect in light of the necessity of staggering, we should strongly consider the regional component. Now that doesn't necessarily dictate a repeal of the Federal minimum wage, but it does for instance induce a strong consideration for keeping the Federal Minimum wage lower so that we can have a reasonable consideration with regards to how best to set it beyond the federal rate, at the region level.

Perhaps in light of these considerations the best approach is to merely take the present rate, which if I recall is in the nine range?, and merely index that to inflation. As to my friends on the left, who might make a legitimate case against corrupt and bought off state legislatures refusing to raise the minimum wage such as North Carolina (minimum wage, medicaid expansion, redistricting reform and violations of separation of powers were the big reasons why I voted Democratic for State Legislature), I would point out that the left nominally has control of all three regional legislatures right now and this was the case last year for a period of time as well. In light of this the notion that we need "Centralism" as the cure for "backwards regions" falls flat, as the left has had the opportunity to raise the minimum wage in all three regions in both 2017 and 2018. If such has not happened, it is either by choice or be inactivity induced incompetence.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[/quote]

Sponsor Feedback: None Given
Status: Pending Revisions from Amendment Sponsor

What is the ETA on those revisions, Senator Lok?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I like how the Federalists are complaining about changes to the minimum wage being too quick when they literally cut it by (more than) half in one swoop a couple of years ago.

Wait, what? We never cut it in half?

Unless you are blaming the reset, reducing it to RL levels, on us?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I also like how Labor is blindly pushing on the path to the elimination of human labor in favor of automated production.


I have worked minimum wage, I understand the need and desire for more money. But I also know how these companies operate. I walked into a Walmart today that I don't normally go into and found they had tripled their self checkout capacity since I was last in there just a few months ago. TRIPLED. And the automated checkout lanes are just the tip of the ice berg. You have internet sites now where you can buy almost anything you can at Wal-Mart, from the click of a mouse. So much so, that Walmart has gone to that too, it is called Online Grocery Pickup. You pay online, and come to the side door and they take your groceries to your car. Five people, replace 15 people.

A uniform $14 minimum wage without concern for differentials in local economies will basically be the equivalent of Hillary Clinton saying "we are going to put a lot of coal miners out of work". You guys are going to put a lot of cashiers out of work. A lot of these people are single mothers, people of color and college students. You are not going to give them a raise to $14 an hour, you are given them a pay cut to $0.

You have to look past the first glance appear. Everything sounds good at first, but you eat too much ice cream, you get fat and need dentures. You cut too much taxes and you give people explosive interest rates and you raise the minimum wage too much and you get robots replacing people. Nothing good is good in all amounts and circumstances. NOTHING!

I will say it again.

1. There as to be variation based on local cost of living.
2. It has to be phased in over a reasonable period of time.

And also it should be pegged to economic indicators as well, so at least in theory politicians will stop using the minimum wage as a political football.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also (Puts on Deputy PPT hat), we need some sponsor feedback here now on both amendments.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[/quote]

Sponsor Feedback: Hostile
Status: A vote is now open on the Above amendment, please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Aye on Yankee's amendment

I didn't offer an amendment on this.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

While saying that the minimum wage increases unemployment, the evidence is far less clear on this matter and often there does not appear to be any relation. Those with increased incomes will also benefit the economy through increased consumption. So on the whole this will be beneficial to workers, especially if done properly, and my personal belief is that the risks are overblown.

I would agree with this argument, at lower levels! However when you start getting into the mid teens and beyond the sheer increase in cost will make technological based efficiency most cost efficient and eventually those numbers will catch up.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

AYE on the Lok amendment, S15:12.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You know this is why I used to number and link amendments. Makes things less confusing when multiple get introduced.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You know this is why I used to number and link amendments. Makes things less confusing when multiple get introduced.

I have addressed this problem.

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=305653.msg6591521#msg6591521

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also, have we actually heard from lok over whether he still wants to move forward with his amendment?

Kind of late to be asking that considering we have been voting on Lok's amendment S15:12 for days now.

Your amendment S15:13 was not put at vote at the same time because I deemed them to conflict to much to hold them both at the same time. I mean, what if both were to pass!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Btw, does the passage or failure of one amendment mean the automatic passage or failure of the other? Or will there have to be a second vote?

Second vote.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Vote on final passage of Lok's Amendment S15:12:

Aye (3): Lechasseur, Lok1999, NC Yankee
Nay (2): Pericles and Zaybay
Abstain (0):

Didn't Vote (1): Sestak


With extended time having expired as of about 5 PM on the 19th, The amendment is adopted.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[/quote]

Sponsor Feedback: Hostile
Status: A vote is now open on the above amendment, S15:13 by Pericles to the Living Wage Act. Senators Please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

NAY

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Nay