Opinion of feminism

[ChelseaT]

Modern feminism is a joke.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

I love the type of people who pretend they would have been super cool with second wave feminism but third wave feminism goes TOO FAR. I don't know whether it's genuine historical cluelessness or attempts at being disingenuous, but a large chunk of second wave feminism was legitimately off the wall stuff (like a lot of the New Left that emerged in the 60's/70's) mixed in with good. That was the era when people legitimately preached lesbian seperatism, when Valerie Solonas tried to kill Andy Warhol as part of her larger (possibly satirical?) goal to "eliminate the male sex" - there really isn't a widely mocked trend that is unique to the third wave that wasn't absent in the second wave. I highly doubt that many here would have been super fine with feminism until muh snarkeesian said mean things about Call of Duty.

If anything third wave feminism is typified by its dullness and its easy capture by corporate interests. Radical feminism has largely been sidelined, which is why they are increasingly being forced to make kind of bizarre coalitions with Christians and the like against the mainstream liberal feminists.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

It's also worth noting that modern feminism has paved the way for insanely dumb college courses such as this:
http://courses.middlebury.edu/hub/MCUG/2014-2015/spring/GSFS/0225A

New wave feminism might be most closely tied to social media, however it's following is large enough that it does lead to changes in society that are not always for the better. We can thank it for ridiculous "safe spaces", especially on college campuses, and meaningless trigger warnings on every little thing that might offend someone, just to name a couple examples.

The principal villain there is the marketisation of higher education.

[Goldwater]

I love the type of people who pretend they would have been super cool with second wave feminism but third wave feminism goes TOO FAR. I don't know whether it's genuine historical cluelessness or attempts at being disingenuous, but the a large chunk of second wave feminism was legitimately off the wall stuff (like a lot of the New Left that emerged in the 60's/70's) mixed in with good. That was the era when people legitimately preached lesbian seperatism, when Valerie Solonas tried to kill Andy Warhol as part of her larger (possibly satirical?) goal to "eliminate the male sex" - there really isn't a widely mocked trend that is unique to the third wave that wasn't absent in the second wave. I highly doubt that many here would have been super fine with feminism until muh snarkeesian said mean things about Call of Duty.

If anything third wave feminism is typified by its dullness and its easy capture by corporate interests. Radical feminism has largely been sidelined, which is why they are increasingly being forced to make kind of bizarre coalitions with Christians and the like against the mainstream liberal feminists.

Yeah, right wing romanization of second wave feminism is bizarre, to say the least..

[Rules for me, but not for thee]

If anything third wave feminism is typified by its dullness and its easy capture by corporate interests. Radical feminism has largely been sidelined, which is why they are increasingly being forced to make kind of bizarre coalitions with Christians Radical Islamists and the like against the mainstream liberal feminists TERFs.

FTFY. They are aligning "intersectionally" with those that are "oppressed" in order to subvert western values.  They will align with a culture of that supports "Taharrush" and the oppression of women there for some small win for their minority here.  But they are now fighting each other and I cannot wait for the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y_LG1706rM&

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

If anything third wave feminism is typified by its dullness and its easy capture by corporate interests. Radical feminism has largely been sidelined, which is why they are increasingly being forced to make kind of bizarre coalitions with Christians Radical Islamists and the like against the mainstream liberal feminists TERFs.

FTFY. They are aligning "intersectionally" with those that are "oppressed" in order to subvert western values.  They will align with a culture of that supports "Taharrush" and the oppression of women there for some small win for their minority here.  But they are now fighting each other and I cannot wait for the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y_LG1706rM&

This is the other problem: people nowadays are far too online. If you really think the mainstream feminist world (whatever its weaknesses and blinkers) is in a mainstream alliance with Islamists, then you are far too gone.
(I'm not going to bother watching some YouTube bore whine about his lame life btw)

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

[SWE]

Obviously very good

[Rules for me, but not for thee]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

[Sestak]

Case by case tbh. There are some areas where the movement's case is much stronger than in others.

[Co-Chair Bagel23]

Freedom philosophy easily. Unless you are talking about the abortion part, they can go and get lost on that point.

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

[😥]

HP

[Intell]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Media portrayals objectively change how we see the world and different groups, and you have to actively ignore science to say that they don't.
http://ontario.cmha.ca/wp-content/files/2012/07/moods_media_200812.pdf
http://sciencenordic.com/media-influences-our-attitude-towards-wealthy
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a7e0/293918f3264401227e34d441e6b04bda132d.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248933230_Media_Influence_on_Citizen_Attitudes_Toward_Police_Effectiveness
Media can make us fear people with mental health problems, influence our attitude towards the wealthy, change how fat people are viewed, and influence perception of police effectiveness. It would be laughable to suggest that this influence magically goes away with horrifically sexist portrayals of women(in all media, but much more audaciously vile in video games and subtly devious in other media forms).

[Technocracy Timmy]

I don’t understand why feminists and gamers feud so much. One would think that both groups would be united in their lack of physical exercise to bond over.

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

I'd say it was largely good up until the 1960s.

[Lechasseur]

I'd say it was largely good up until the 1960s.

This. Feminism turned into a joke and an HP philosophy in the 1960s.

[smoltchanov]

Mixed. In extreme form - HP.

[Goldwater]

I don’t understand why feminists and gamers feud so much. One would think that both groups would be united in their lack of physical exercise to bond over.

I mean, clearly that bond isn't enough to keep atlas posters united.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Both are smart enough to realize that people can be influenced by their environment, including cultural inputs and participatory behavior. Shocking, I know.

[Rules for me, but not for thee]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Media portrayals objectively change how we see the world and different groups, and you have to actively ignore science to say that they don't.
http://ontario.cmha.ca/wp-content/files/2012/07/moods_media_200812.pdf
http://sciencenordic.com/media-influences-our-attitude-towards-wealthy
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a7e0/293918f3264401227e34d441e6b04bda132d.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248933230_Media_Influence_on_Citizen_Attitudes_Toward_Police_Effectiveness
Media can make us fear people with mental health problems, influence our attitude towards the wealthy, change how fat people are viewed, and influence perception of police effectiveness. It would be laughable to suggest that this influence magically goes away with horrifically sexist portrayals of women(in all media, but much more audaciously vile in video games and subtly devious in other media forms).

If you want take away people's outlets for their reptile-brain violent or sexual tendencies and move them from the video games to the real world, well that's on you.

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Media portrayals objectively change how we see the world and different groups, and you have to actively ignore science to say that they don't.
http://ontario.cmha.ca/wp-content/files/2012/07/moods_media_200812.pdf
http://sciencenordic.com/media-influences-our-attitude-towards-wealthy
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a7e0/293918f3264401227e34d441e6b04bda132d.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248933230_Media_Influence_on_Citizen_Attitudes_Toward_Police_Effectiveness
Media can make us fear people with mental health problems, influence our attitude towards the wealthy, change how fat people are viewed, and influence perception of police effectiveness. It would be laughable to suggest that this influence magically goes away with horrifically sexist portrayals of women(in all media, but much more audaciously vile in video games and subtly devious in other media forms).

If you want take away people's outlets for their reptile-brain violent or sexual tendencies and move them from the video games to the real world, well that's on you.

TIL video games reduce crime rates.


(and before you claim that actually they did, the nineties was around when leaded gasoline was banned, which is the likely culprit. Also video game playing peaked way after the nineties.)

[Rules for me, but not for thee]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Media portrayals objectively change how we see the world and different groups, and you have to actively ignore science to say that they don't.
http://ontario.cmha.ca/wp-content/files/2012/07/moods_media_200812.pdf
http://sciencenordic.com/media-influences-our-attitude-towards-wealthy
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a7e0/293918f3264401227e34d441e6b04bda132d.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248933230_Media_Influence_on_Citizen_Attitudes_Toward_Police_Effectiveness
Media can make us fear people with mental health problems, influence our attitude towards the wealthy, change how fat people are viewed, and influence perception of police effectiveness. It would be laughable to suggest that this influence magically goes away with horrifically sexist portrayals of women(in all media, but much more audaciously vile in video games and subtly devious in other media forms).

If you want take away people's outlets for their reptile-brain violent or sexual tendencies and move them from the video games to the real world, well that's on you.

TIL video games reduce crime rates.


(and before you claim that actually they did, the nineties was around when leaded gasoline was banned, which is the likely culprit. Also video game playing peaked way after the nineties.)

Even Polygon saw a correlation between video games sales spikes and drops in violent crime:

https://www.polygon.com/2014/9/12/6141515/do-violent-video-games-actually-reduce-real-world-crime

And if you think that's more far-fetched than some wacky theory of the elimination of the use of leaded gasoline, then there will be no reasoning with you anyway.

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

I feel like people tend to underestimate the fact that media both shows and reinforces our values as a culture. Look at all the myths people believe because they were in all the movies. The mentality that leads to portraying women almost entirely as sex objects or damsels in distress is the same one that leads to sexual harrassment, minimization of rape, etc etc etc(video games are particularly odious BTW).

I guess as an adult person that has sufficient willpower as not to be influenced to assume things that happen in games are OK in real-life...leave my games alone or make them all 18+ requiring ID like tobacco if you want to be authoritarian about it.

lol, "leave my games alone". Ok honey. If you honestly think you're magically immune to stereotyping because you're an adult(who unironically says that feminists are allying with "Radical Islamists" to destroy "western values" and supports it by linking to a man who has literally said that women "destroy civilization" with treachery and sh*t), than you have a lot to learn.  https://www.nyu.edu/classes/jackson/causes.of.gender.inequality/Readings/Wood%20-%20Gendered%20Media%20-%2094.pdf

Also considering that you linked to an insane MRA and presumably watch him, so I'm not gonna give you any benefit of the doubt on sexism, esp. when you get offended by the idea that the kind of toxic male fantasies seen in video games aren't good.

GAMES CAUSE VIOLENCE, GAMES (tv shows, movies) ARE THE PROBLEM OF "X, Y, Z". This trope is ridiculous when done by the SJW left or the conservative right.

Media portrayals objectively change how we see the world and different groups, and you have to actively ignore science to say that they don't.
http://ontario.cmha.ca/wp-content/files/2012/07/moods_media_200812.pdf
http://sciencenordic.com/media-influences-our-attitude-towards-wealthy
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a7e0/293918f3264401227e34d441e6b04bda132d.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248933230_Media_Influence_on_Citizen_Attitudes_Toward_Police_Effectiveness
Media can make us fear people with mental health problems, influence our attitude towards the wealthy, change how fat people are viewed, and influence perception of police effectiveness. It would be laughable to suggest that this influence magically goes away with horrifically sexist portrayals of women(in all media, but much more audaciously vile in video games and subtly devious in other media forms).

If you want take away people's outlets for their reptile-brain violent or sexual tendencies and move them from the video games to the real world, well that's on you.

TIL video games reduce crime rates.


(and before you claim that actually they did, the nineties was around when leaded gasoline was banned, which is the likely culprit. Also video game playing peaked way after the nineties.)

Even Polygon saw a correlation between video games sales spikes and drops in violent crime:

https://www.polygon.com/2014/9/12/6141515/do-violent-video-games-actually-reduce-real-world-crime

And if you think that's more far-fetched than some wacky theory of the elimination of the use of leaded gasoline, then there will be no reasoning with you anyway.

Like half of polygon is video games. And its a single study. And it only proves a correlation. Which, considering that video game sales spike at a relatively consistent rate in the winter, basically proves that homicides and video game sales are both affected by winter weather. Also, they measure all games, not just violent ones.

Also, the idea that not getting see women treated like pieces of meat for male pleasure all the time will increase rapes is ludicrous. At best, rape has no real effect on sexual violence.
https://vawnet.org/material/pornography-and-sexual-violence  https://medium.com/@JonahMix/pornography-doesnt-cause-sexual-violence-it-is-sexual-violence-6ff8206407cb
http://www.calcasa.org/2010/03/what-is-the-influence-of-pornography-on-rape/
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/is-pornography-driving-increased-sexual-violence-in-ireland-1.3508313
https://www.aauw.org/2009/06/12/effects-of-pornography-on-perceptions-of-women-and-sexual-violence/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22852438
And sexist male fantasies aren't even required for a game to be violent.