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  Boisanaro to allow all Brazilians without criminal records to own firearms
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Author Topic: Boisanaro to allow all Brazilians without criminal records to own firearms  (Read 1335 times)
Tender Branson
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« Reply #25 on: December 31, 2018, 04:21:36 am »

MedUni Vienna study highlights a correlation: Stricter firearm legislation lowers murder and suicide rates

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(Vienna, 18 July 2018) - A statistical analysis carried out by researchers from the Department of Psychiatry and Psychotherapy and the Center for Medical Statistics at the Medical University of Vienna shows that stricter firearm legislation is associated with a reduction in firearm-related murder and suicide rates.

There had been a continuous decline in these figures in Austria for over 20 years following the introduction of stricter firearm legislation in the 1997 reform. However, this trend has been slowing down ever since the 2008 economic crisis.

A possible explanation for this may be that the general feeling of insecurity among the population led to more people obtaining licences for guns, which significantly increased the percentage of firearms involved in murders and suicides.

In Austria, the number of murders and suicides had been falling continuously for decades. There was even a change in the percentage of acts of violence involving firearms: since the firearm legislation reform in 1997, when it became more difficult to obtain a firearm, there was a continuous decline in the number of new licences, which is also reflected in the statistics for firearm-related murders and suicides.

For example, in 1998 there were 3.7 firearm-related suicides per 100,000 head of population and, by 2008, this figure had dropped to 2.4.

https://www.meduniwien.ac.at/web/en/about-us/news/detailsite/2018/news-im-juli-2018/stricter-firearm-legislation-lowers-murder-and-suicide-rates
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Parrotguy
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« Reply #26 on: December 31, 2018, 04:31:33 am »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.


Img


Or just maybe it's to do with the gross levels of income inequality, racial inequality and conflict and a non-existent welfare state and social fabric.

Mass non-terroristic gun shootings aren't equivalent to homicides of all sorts, and those mass-shootings are massively more frequent in the US than in the rest of the world, there's just no denying it. It's funny how pro gun socialists and libertarians both blame poor people for gun violence- stop muddying the water, mass shootings aren't rare at all even in the whitest, most well-to-do neighborhoods. Not everything is caused by economic woes.

A homicide is a homicide though, whether it is "mass" or not. Gun Control only stops mass shootings and results in homicides being done by other means and has a negligible impact on the homicide rate (which is the relevant crime rate when discussing gun control).

Homicides are much more frequent in us than the rest of the (western world) but that's not due to loose gun laws. Data and results from other countries show there is no correlation between homicides, violent crimes and gun control. Australia enacted major gun control, NZ did not, both countries had a lowering of the homicide rate the by the same rate.

Switzerland has loose gun control and a low homicide rate and very rare mass shooting. Again the issue is not to do with gun control.

But it does matter. Regular homicide is vastly different from mass shootings so frequent in the US. I mean, denying this fact is just being morally dishonest and twisting facts to fit your ideology, all on the backs of dozens of corpses- the US is the only country where these mass shootings, especially in schools, regularly happen. There's also no denying that the only possible reason is gun laws, because all other factors between the US and the rest of the world are similar. There's no compelling reason to give people guns so freely with this in mind and the studies others pointed out, it's simply dumb.

And the most amusing takeaway I have from this is how socialists and libertarians both love blaming poor people Tongue
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Intell
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« Reply #27 on: December 31, 2018, 04:47:17 am »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.


Img


Or just maybe it's to do with the gross levels of income inequality, racial inequality and conflict and a non-existent welfare state and social fabric.

Mass non-terroristic gun shootings aren't equivalent to homicides of all sorts, and those mass-shootings are massively more frequent in the US than in the rest of the world, there's just no denying it. It's funny how pro gun socialists and libertarians both blame poor people for gun violence- stop muddying the water, mass shootings aren't rare at all even in the whitest, most well-to-do neighborhoods. Not everything is caused by economic woes.

A homicide is a homicide though, whether it is "mass" or not. Gun Control only stops mass shootings and results in homicides being done by other means and has a negligible impact on the homicide rate (which is the relevant crime rate when discussing gun control).

Homicides are much more frequent in us than the rest of the (western world) but that's not due to loose gun laws. Data and results from other countries show there is no correlation between homicides, violent crimes and gun control. Australia enacted major gun control, NZ did not, both countries had a lowering of the homicide rate the by the same rate.

Switzerland has loose gun control and a low homicide rate and very rare mass shooting. Again the issue is not to do with gun control.

But it does matter. Regular homicide is vastly different from mass shootings so frequent in the US. I mean, denying this fact is just being morally dishonest and twisting facts to fit your ideology, all on the backs of dozens of corpses- the US is the only country where these mass shootings, especially in schools, regularly happen. There's also no denying that the only possible reason is gun laws, because all other factors between the US and the rest of the world are similar. There's no compelling reason to give people guns so freely with this in mind and the studies others pointed out, it's simply dumb.

And the most amusing takeaway I have from this is how socialists and libertarians both love blaming poor people Tongue

Again, Finland, New Zeland and Switzerland have loose gun control laws and still have very rare mass shootings.

The rest of the world is also a stupid example as gun violence is daily life in many countries around the world, so the US is not immune to this.

Again, regarding studies that show how gun control has reduced homicides ignore the fact that crime has been reducing all together and gun control is not the result of that.

I mean I'm blaming poverty and inequality, which is obviously the root issue (alongside mental illness) of countries with higher gun violence vs those with not, but apparently, that's blaming poor people.

Regarding gun violence and the suicide rate, gun control does probably reduce the suicide rate but funding for mental illness and having programs related to such will be a much better reducer of the suicide rate.
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Parrotguy
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« Reply #28 on: December 31, 2018, 04:56:25 am »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.


Img


Or just maybe it's to do with the gross levels of income inequality, racial inequality and conflict and a non-existent welfare state and social fabric.

Mass non-terroristic gun shootings aren't equivalent to homicides of all sorts, and those mass-shootings are massively more frequent in the US than in the rest of the world, there's just no denying it. It's funny how pro gun socialists and libertarians both blame poor people for gun violence- stop muddying the water, mass shootings aren't rare at all even in the whitest, most well-to-do neighborhoods. Not everything is caused by economic woes.

A homicide is a homicide though, whether it is "mass" or not. Gun Control only stops mass shootings and results in homicides being done by other means and has a negligible impact on the homicide rate (which is the relevant crime rate when discussing gun control).

Homicides are much more frequent in us than the rest of the (western world) but that's not due to loose gun laws. Data and results from other countries show there is no correlation between homicides, violent crimes and gun control. Australia enacted major gun control, NZ did not, both countries had a lowering of the homicide rate the by the same rate.

Switzerland has loose gun control and a low homicide rate and very rare mass shooting. Again the issue is not to do with gun control.

But it does matter. Regular homicide is vastly different from mass shootings so frequent in the US. I mean, denying this fact is just being morally dishonest and twisting facts to fit your ideology, all on the backs of dozens of corpses- the US is the only country where these mass shootings, especially in schools, regularly happen. There's also no denying that the only possible reason is gun laws, because all other factors between the US and the rest of the world are similar. There's no compelling reason to give people guns so freely with this in mind and the studies others pointed out, it's simply dumb.

And the most amusing takeaway I have from this is how socialists and libertarians both love blaming poor people Tongue

Again, Finland, New Zeland and Switzerland have loose gun control laws and still have very rare mass shootings.

The rest of the world is also a stupid example as gun violence is daily life in many countries around the world, so the US is not immune to this.

Again, regarding studies that show how gun control has reduced homicides ignore the fact that crime has been reducing all together and gun control is not the result of that.

I mean I'm blaming poverty and inequality, which is obviously the root issue (alongside mental illness) of countries with higher gun violence vs those with not, but apparently, that's blaming poor people.

Regarding gun violence and the suicide rate, gun control does probably reduce the suicide rate but funding for mental illness and having programs related to such will be a much better reducer of the suicide rate.


But you've just been told that Switzerland, for example, tightened the rules. I'm also sure that the American gun culture coupled with the loose rules contributes to it. And again, homicide rates aren't the story, the story is that only America has these mass non terroristic shootings every month, sometimes several times a month. It's madness, and there's no way to explain it other than loose gun laws and a toxic gun culture caused by them.
But it's fine. You can just ignore a very compelling solution for the sake of populism. These school kids dying doesn't affect you anyway, and The Onion posting a "nothing we can do about it, says the only nation where this regularly happens" headline several times a month is just amusing.
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Mr. Reactionary
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« Reply #29 on: December 31, 2018, 10:42:22 am »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.

Speaking of dozens of kids dying, aren't there some Palestinian schoolchildren throwing rocks somewhere that need "taking care of"?
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Parrotguy
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« Reply #30 on: December 31, 2018, 10:53:51 am »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.

Speaking of dozens of kids dying, aren't there some Palestinian schoolchildren throwing rocks somewhere that need "taking care of"?

Possibly, luckily our "taking care of" consists of taking every measure to save innocent lives on both sides (and obviously priotrizing ours), and not just bombing civilian buildings without any warning and killing freely like a certain leader of the free world Wink
Oh and we also don't target kindergartens with missiles but you know
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Horus
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« Reply #31 on: December 31, 2018, 10:55:00 am »
« Edited: December 31, 2018, 11:02:51 am by Horus »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.

Speaking of dozens of kids dying, aren't there some Palestinian schoolchildren throwing rocks somewhere that need "taking care of"?

Possibly, luckily our "taking care of" consists of taking every measure to save innocent lives on both sides (and obviously priotrizing ours), and not just bombing civilian buildings without any warning and killing freely like a certain leader of the free world Wink
Oh and we also don't target kindergartens with missiles but you know

So you do everything you can to save Jewish lives on both sides of the border? Typical Israeli doublespeak.
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dead0man
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« Reply #32 on: December 31, 2018, 03:28:02 pm »

So, what the gun control fanboys know here is that there will be a mass increase in shootings in Brazil?  Are we clear on that?  Because this thread will still exist in 5 years.  I just want to make sure you guys have your story straight now.  The assumption you're going on is that now that a bunch of non-criminals in Brazil will have access to guns that gun violence will go up proportionally.... or if not proportionately, at least a statistically significant amount.


If there is a large increase in gun crime that would be an excellent point in your favor.
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seb_pard
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« Reply #33 on: December 31, 2018, 04:22:58 pm »

Gun violence will probably will not raise (it is already high) but I'm sure there will be plenty of cases of land and green activists murdered by guards or land owners under the "self-defense" excuse.

Very sad but expected news.
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dead0man
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« Reply #34 on: December 31, 2018, 04:31:52 pm »

Gun violence will probably will not raise (it is already high) but I'm sure there will be plenty of cases of land and green activists murdered by guards or land owners under the "self-defense" excuse.
the kinds of people who could get away with that in Brazil already have guns....assuming it's like most places that don't let regular law abiding citizens own guns.
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Sentor MAINEiac4434 of Lincoln
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« Reply #35 on: December 31, 2018, 04:48:54 pm »

This is dreadful news. Political violence is going to increase exponentially because of this, not to mention non political violence.
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HenryWallaceVP
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« Reply #36 on: December 31, 2018, 05:44:52 pm »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.

There is a line of logic that goes something like -

I want to be populist to prove I am in in touch with the "white working class", so I need to be Socially Conservative. I don't want to be nasty to immigrants, cos that's racist; and I don't want to be nasty to LGBT people, cos that's homophobic - so how about guns and abortion? They don't affect me in any way whatsoever, so may as well have them as my token "Socially Conservative" issues, right?

I'm always surprised how many Dems here support gun rights so strongly. It's basically the equivalent of climate denial.
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Hardline Remainer
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« Reply #37 on: January 04, 2019, 02:59:43 pm »

A huge uptake in people owning firearms in a country whose social fabric is already being torn apart at the seams?

What could go wrong...

Also, Atlas "lefties" are so terrible on this issue. If you wanna be #populists, be populists on the backs of your own school kids. Don't strive for other countries to become shooting-infested nations like your country. It's not even funny seeing all of you cheer for this with the full knowledge that dozens of kids are dying every year in your country because of gun violence, with weak gun control being the only thing differentiating you from other countries and thus the probable cause for these deaths- it's disgusting.

There is a line of logic that goes something like -

I want to be populist to prove I am in in touch with the "white working class", so I need to be Socially Conservative. I don't want to be nasty to immigrants, cos that's racist; and I don't want to be nasty to LGBT people, cos that's homophobic - so how about guns and abortion? They don't affect me in any way whatsoever, so may as well have them as my token "Socially Conservative" issues, right?

I'm always surprised how many Dems here support gun rights so strongly. It's basically the equivalent of climate denial.
It's so stupid. Every good democrat needs to support every measure which makes gun ownership more difficult and convoluted. Guns kill people; killing people is bad; there should be fewer guns. It's really that simple.
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dead0man
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« Reply #38 on: January 04, 2019, 05:38:24 pm »

This is dreadful news. Political violence is going to increase exponentially because of this, not to mention non political violence.
"exponentially"?  Really?  Anybody else want to stand by this claim?  Did you predict the same thing when all the US states started allowing concealed carry?
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Deleted User #4049
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« Reply #39 on: January 04, 2019, 09:05:44 pm »

Wonderful move!
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Storebought
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« Reply #40 on: January 06, 2019, 06:32:02 pm »

This is indeed a fascist move, the key phrase here being "without criminal records."

It's completely obvious that members of Bolsonaro's political opposition will find themselves charged with something -- anything -- to negate their legal ability to possess firearms, just the same way Lula was charged with, what exactly?, to keep him from running for reelection. (Yes, I'm not so naive to think that anyone on this thread thinks that is such a bad thing). 

Oh, and it's just as obvious that "without criminal records" means "not Black", just like in the US, even though they and the Browns in the northeast are the ones suffering the worst from the violent crime epidemic.

The sad thing, though, is that the one subgroup in that country truly in need of self-defense, the Amazonian Indians, will curiously not be informed of their newly granted "right" by anyone from government agencies tasked to contact them.
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