LC 2.2 Transportation Improvement Bill (Rejected)

[S019]

Nay

[lfromnj]

Nay

[Adam Griffin]

Aye

[Zaybay]

Glad this amendment was proposed, the previous bill was completely ludicrous.

AYE

[lfromnj]

Glad this amendment was proposed, the previous bill was completely ludicrous.

AYE

Oh the bill is overall ludicrous too. I just want to effectively table it.

[Former President tack50]

Toll roads serve practically no effective purpose, their creation leads to much higher costs for consumers than the increase in taxes would require per capita, and a combination of $0.10 per mile + increased taxes for justified road work in my amendment is far less than pinging people the better part of a dollar per mile across a variety of arterial roadways.

Likewise, we do not have the capacity for feasibility studies that are actually worthwhile; we're talking about building new highways and converting major highways into toll roads that cost 2-3x per mile what gas + car maintenance costs. It's ridiculous, and the original bill as-is is all fluff and no substance.

If there is a need for new highways and roads, the public sector is more than capable of making those decisions based on the good of the people. If not - but there is a desire for such - then a private company can choose to build a road and maintain it on their own to supply such a service. Why so many are in favor of handouts to corporations and taxpayer burdens that line the pockets of a few is beyond me. Taxpayers shouldn't be subsidizing private businesses when there is a clear, defined and well-established public sector alternative. All it ends up creating is waste and price-gouging.

As I've said before, toll roads to serve a purpose in transportation.

In public roads, as I've said, you can either not pay (or pay less) for the actual construction, in exchange for tolls. You might argue that is a handout to construction companies and in fact this is a very common avenue for corruption, but with proper studies it can actually save taxpayers money.

It's also a decent idea to raise money for the government by putting tolls in public roads, and can work as an interesting alternative to raising the gas tax (though you may argue that gas taxes are better and more effective).

Finally, I will remind everyone that pretty much all roads are built with public money. Big construction projects are usually ordered by the state and not private corporations. So this amendment pretty much eliminates all tolls from Lincoln. I believe the current toll road policies are working fine and see no need for changes in either direction.

[Former President tack50]

The vote on Amendment L 2:25 by Adam Griffin is now closed

Aye: 4 (Pyro, thr33, Griff, Zaybay)
Abstain: 0
Nay: 3 (tack50, S019, lfromnj)
Not voting: 2 (Dipper Josh, Ninja)

So this amendment passes

[S019]

This bill calls for building a tolled closed system mega highway with a toll of $0.75 $0.30 per mile, from Philadelphia to Buffalo

It also calls to add tolls to the following interstate highways at the price of $0.80 $0.40 per mile: I-80 (PA), I-95 (RI), I-70 (IN)

It also calls to add express toll lanes at the price of $1.25 $0.75 per mile on the following highways in the New York City area (I-495, I-278, I-95 (until Exit 14), I-695, I-295) and in the Philadelphia area (I-276, I-95, I-76 (until Schuykill Haven)

This bill also calls for renovating the Verrazano Narrows Bridge and mandating a toll hike of 50% on all existing Lincoln tolls to pay for it

The money generated from this toll revenue, will be used to make repairs to roads in poor conditions and also to make improvements to major airports, such as Chicago O’Hare, New York City’s JFK, and Boston Logan.

I would like to a propose a new amendment

This amendment shall replace the bill in its entirety

[Former President tack50]

Well, it seems thanks to SNJC we have pretty much found a way for a sponsor of a given bill to unilaterally nullify any amendments he wants, even if the rest of the Council is in favour of them.

That seems to be something that can be easily abused and should be fixed. In any case, I am afraid as per the current rules I must do this:

Amendment L 2:29 by S019 to LC 2.2 Transportation Improvement Bill

This bill calls for building a tolled closed system mega highway with a toll of $0.75 $0.30 per mile, from Philadelphia to Buffalo

It also calls to add tolls to the following interstate highways at the price of $0.80 $0.40 per mile: I-80 (PA), I-95 (RI), I-70 (IN)

It also calls to add express toll lanes at the price of $1.25 $0.75 per mile on the following highways in the New York City area (I-495, I-278, I-95 (until Exit 14), I-695, I-295) and in the Philadelphia area (I-276, I-95, I-76 (until Schuykill Haven)

This bill also calls for renovating the Verrazano Narrows Bridge and mandating a toll hike of 50% on all existing Lincoln tolls to pay for it

The money generated from this toll revenue, will be used to make repairs to roads in poor conditions and also to make improvements to major airports, such as Chicago O’Hare, New York City’s JFK, and Boston Logan.

Sponsor feedback: Origination
Status: Added into the bill

This amendment replaces the bill in its entirety

[S019]

I wanted to try a more moderate amendment and see if one person could be peeled over, I am open to moderate amendments, but do not try to wreck the bill. Also, if people keep wanting to wreck the bill, just let them either tank it with the filibuster or final vote, like if my healthcare amendment actually passed, I imagine that the bill would have just been tanked, tabled, or the sponsor would have just started all over, again.

[Former President tack50]

Seeing how SNJC could pretty much nullify any amendment (and this applies to any sponsor of any bill mind you), I guess this will be the best course of action:

I motion for a final vote. 24h to object

[S019]

I object

I want to see, if this actually has the votes to pass

[AustralianSwingVoter]

Well you now get to try out the new part of the standing orders.

D. After the conclusion of the first 72 hours for debate, any Councillor or the Chancellor may call for a vote on said legislation. The Speaker shall open a vote if neither another Councillor nor the Chancellor objects within 24 hours of the call for a vote. If a Councillor objects to the motion within 24 hours, a vote shall be held on whether or not to proceed to a final vote, with a two thirds majority required for the objection to be overruled if the legislation has been on the floor for less than 240 hours; and a simple majority required if the legislation has been on the floor for more than 240 hours.

[Former President tack50]

Councillors, a vote on the objection to a final vote has started

Please vote AYE, NAY or Abstain
Since there is nothing in the rules specifying length, this vote shall last for 48h or until all Councillors have voted

As this piece of legislation has been on the floor of the Council for more than 240 hours, a simple majority is needed

[Sestak]

So Lincoln literally has manager's amendments. Lol.

[Adam Griffin]

Aye

[S019]

Aye

[Sirius_]

Aye

[S019]

Do the people voting “AYE,” support this, or do you just want to kill the bill

[Former President tack50]

Aye

Do the people voting “AYE,” support this, or do you just want to kill the bill

Can't speak for anyone else, but I personally do want to kill this bill.

[lfromnj]

Do the people voting “AYE,” support this, or do you just want to kill the bill

Can't speak for anyone else, but I personally do want to kill this bill.

[Pyro]

Aye.

I want to see, if this actually has the votes to pass

You do understand that this course of action opens you up to humiliation, yes?
It's generally a bad idea to push legislation if the Council universally opposes it.

[Former President tack50]

The vote on the objection is now closed

Aye: 6 (Griffin, S019, Ninja, thr33, tack50, Pyro)
Abstain: 0
Nay: 0
Not voting: 3 (lfromnj, Dipper Josh, Zaybay)

So the objection has been overruled and we shall proceed to a final vote

[Former President tack50]

Councillors, a FINAL vote is now open on the following legislation

Transportation improvement Bill

This bill calls for building a tolled closed system mega highway with a toll of $0.30 per mile, from Philadelphia to Buffalo

It also calls to add tolls to the following interstate highways at the price of $0.40 per mile: I-80 (PA), I-95 (RI), I-70 (IN)

It also calls to add express toll lanes at the price of $0.75 per mile on the following highways in the New York City area (I-495, I-278, I-95 (until Exit 14), I-695, I-295) and in the Philadelphia area (I-276, I-95, I-76 (until Schuykill Haven)

Please vote AYE, NAY or Abstain
This vote shall last for 48h or untill all Councillors have voted

[Former President tack50]

Nay