Argentina mass stock market crash
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Author Topic: Argentina mass stock market crash  (Read 1269 times)
lfromnj
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« on: August 13, 2019, 04:38:01 PM »

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/argentina-on-brink-of-financial-crisis-market-rout-election-surprise-2019-8-1028443209

48%, Hillgoose will probably argue for an invasion to stabilize his Argentinian stock holdings.
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Green Line
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« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2019, 10:18:47 PM »

Just goes to show you how awful the opposition is.  Christina Kirchner is a less important but even dumber version of Trump.

Maybe we’ll have to sanction Argentina soon as well.
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HillGoose
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« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2019, 12:19:28 PM »
« Edited: August 14, 2019, 12:32:37 PM by Dope and Diamonds »

Paul Singer should hire Blackwater for this one.

Seriously though, I'm pissed. I don't own shares in any Argentinean firms but I do own shares in firms that have major operations in Argentina as well as ETFs that have holdings in Argentinean firms and along with DJIA -700 today it's been brutal for my portfolio. 😠😠😠
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Santander
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« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2019, 11:50:09 AM »

Time for regime change.
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Green Line
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« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2019, 01:46:19 PM »


The bad ones haven’t even won yet.  Preemptive regime change?  I like the way you think.
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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2019, 04:52:17 PM »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ
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PSOL
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« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2019, 05:35:08 PM »

Stock markets are not representative of how an economy is going in any shape or form. Woe to the downtrodden Argentine upper class, the ones that still have money to invest in the stock market in the first place.
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PSOL
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« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2019, 06:03:33 PM »

Stock markets are not representative of how an economy is going in any shape or form. Woe to the downtrodden Argentine upper class, the ones that still have money to invest in the stock market in the first place.

Yeah, because is not like the currency also crashed by some 30%, and its not like the average Argentinian needs to buy basic foods and other products, that are now going to be much more expensive. Screw the stupid Argentinian upper class, its not like they employ anybody, like cleaners or maids, who are now going to lose their jobs. Take that, dirty American Imperialists!
 
  
Hmm, maybe I should have put an /s tag at the end of my post.
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Velasco
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« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2019, 06:09:11 PM »


Peronists are back, indeed ✌ Wink
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Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy
Alex
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« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2019, 08:43:06 PM »

The stock market is still very low, but the dollar seems to have stabilized at around 55/60 pesos per dollar (it was at 46 on Sunday) and the country risk / EMBI is slowly getting lower
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HillGoose
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« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2019, 09:21:50 PM »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ

Chill out brah. All caps is like, yelling.

Also, the Argentine government has a history of bad behavior financially, as well as predatory debt restructuring practices that screw over foreign creditors. That is a hallmark of a corrupt government.
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Green Line
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« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2019, 10:17:44 PM »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ

Its not funny, just prudent.  South America is a disaster & don't yell at me Anthony.
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Sirius_
Ninja0428
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« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2019, 10:28:50 PM »

Stock markets are not representative of how an economy is going in any shape or form. Woe to the downtrodden Argentine upper class, the ones that still have money to invest in the stock market in the first place.
The stock market crash of 1929 would like to have a word with you. Most economic downturns are accompanied by a stock market decline.
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Velasco
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« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2019, 10:59:45 PM »
« Edited: August 16, 2019, 12:20:42 AM by Velasco »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ

Chill out brah. All caps is like, yelling.

Also, the Argentine government has a history of bad behavior financially, as well as predatory debt restructuring practices that screw over foreign creditors. That is a hallmark of a corrupt government.

The caps are just yelling "YOU ARE DUMB BRO".

On the other hand, lacking sense of humour is often a hallmark of stupidity.

Don't take offence, but some of the aberrations dumped here deserve a mention in "Worst Posts of Modern Atlas"

I know this advice is unwanted, but please don't give us lessons in Argentinian or Latin American history. They are not in the Trumpette's area of expertise. Thank you bros.
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Insomnian
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« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2019, 01:56:33 AM »

Stock markets are not representative of how an economy is going in any shape or form. Woe to the downtrodden Argentine upper class, the ones that still have money to invest in the stock market in the first place.
The stock market crash of 1929 would like to have a word with you. Most economic downturns are accompanied by a stock market decline.

The Argentine stock crash in one day was larger than the entire week long stock crash of 1929 lol
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CrabCake
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« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2019, 05:17:31 AM »

The issue is that coups and foreign subterfuge are not an effective treatment to political and economic instability, but partially a major contributor. Most of the Latin American caudillos presided over shambolic, corrupt and populist economies, with political support effectively bought off by public works. Even Argentina's own history shows this in spades: the tenure of dictator Jorge Rafael Videla was completely disastrous economically, even by the standards of your average Argentinian President.

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Zinneke
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« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2019, 05:35:35 AM »

The issue is that coups and foreign subterfuge are not an effective treatment to political and economic instability, but partially a major contributor. Most of the Latin American caudillos presided over shambolic, corrupt and populist economies, with political support effectively bought off by public works. Even Argentina's own history shows this in spades: the tenure of dictator Jorge Rafael Videla was completely disastrous economically, even by the standards of your average Argentinian President.



I don't think anybody is seriously suggesting a coup as a solution on this thread though right, or in Argentina, or indeed in major FP circles in the US. If governments in Latin America defaulted to military rule its because the military remained the most organised, stable and er, reliable institution there, although civil-military relations in these countries have improved massively over the years. The foreign sponsors are what happens when intelligence agencies with bloated budgets sense an opportunity to do business with reliable business partners, which the military are more than the political class for reasons HillGoose explained. 
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HillGoose
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« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2019, 11:15:31 AM »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ

Chill out brah. All caps is like, yelling.

Also, the Argentine government has a history of bad behavior financially, as well as predatory debt restructuring practices that screw over foreign creditors. That is a hallmark of a corrupt government.

The caps are just yelling "YOU ARE DUMB BRO".

On the other hand, lacking sense of humour is often a hallmark of stupidity.

Don't take offence, but some of the aberrations dumped here deserve a mention in "Worst Posts of Modern Atlas"

I know this advice is unwanted, but please don't give us lessons in Argentinian or Latin American history. They are not in the Trumpette's area of expertise. Thank you bros.


Dude Trump is like, a big gov communist.

Small gov ftw
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Velasco
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« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2019, 06:24:58 AM »


It's rather irrelevant if Trump is not enough libertarian to your taste (that "small government" fetish). You are advocating some interventionist policies that John Bolton could support. The worldviews of Trump and Bolton match with yours
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Sirius_
Ninja0428
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« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2019, 08:44:15 AM »

Is there any chance this will affect the votes in the second round?
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Sirius_
Ninja0428
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« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2019, 08:44:57 AM »


It's rather irrelevant if Trump is not enough libertarian to your taste (that "small government" fetish). You are advocating some interventionist policies that John Bolton could support. The worldviews of Trump and Bolton match with yours
I don't know if you aren't aware, but you don't argue with Hillgoose. If you do be prepared for maximum frustration.
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lfromnj
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« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2019, 12:59:41 PM »

LOL US HISTORY OF CRUSHING DEMOCRACY IN LATIN AMERICA AND PROPPING UP CORRUPT OLIGARCHIES IS HILARIOUS AMIRITE GUYZ

Chill out brah. All caps is like, yelling.

Also, the Argentine government has a history of bad behavior financially, as well as predatory debt restructuring practices that screw over foreign creditors. That is a hallmark of a corrupt government.

The caps are just yelling "YOU ARE DUMB BRO".

On the other hand, lacking sense of humour is often a hallmark of stupidity.

Don't take offence, but some of the aberrations dumped here deserve a mention in "Worst Posts of Modern Atlas"

I know this advice is unwanted, but please don't give us lessons in Argentinian or Latin American history. They are not in the Trumpette's area of expertise. Thank you bros.


Hillgoose is arguably the most laid back and humorous person on this forum IRL lol.
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Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy
Alex
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« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2019, 06:38:29 PM »

Is there any chance this will affect the votes in the second round?

The exchange rate difference, maybe slightly. But most people wil forget about the stock market crash (if they were ever really aware of it as the exchange rate difference dominated the news)
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Velasco
andi
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« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2019, 02:55:48 AM »
« Edited: August 18, 2019, 03:51:43 AM by Velasco »

I don't know if you aren't aware, but you don't argue with Hillgoose. If you do be prepared for maximum frustration.

Thank you for the advice, but I'm not feeling frustrated at all. I don't expect to have a serious argument with this poster in particular, actually. I tend to avoid certain boards on this forum, as the "discussion" is dominated by a certain typology of Atlas poster. For instance, my comments on US politics are very scarce (and I prefer the AAD anyway, because the "discussion" here is insane). In what regards this IGD board, it is dominated by some posters whose bigotry and narrow worldview make me chill occasionally. Most of the times I ignore them, as engaging in a discussion is a waste of time, but sometimes I can't help but saying something.


Quote
Is there any chance this will affect the votes in the second round?

Middle and lower class voters turned their backs on Macri due to the terrible economic situation. They find Macri is guilty of the galloping inflation, which reduces the purchasing power and impoverishes a large segment of the population. Macri promised to reduce poverty and inflation when elected and failed miserably, so it's not strange he got belted. It seems unlikely pressure from "the markets" will play to Macri's interests. Actually it's in the national interest to calm the markets. Macri and Fernández are fully aware of that and had a phone talk aimed to reduce turbulence. The extreme polarization and the fact that both rivals are in campaign prevent major cooperation, but nobody wants a total collapse of the economy. Alberto Fernández is more than likely the ext president, but there is a degree of unpredictability in Argentinian voters that prevents me to say his chances are at 100%. Nobody in the ruling alliance (except maybe the ineffable Lilita Carrió) believes in a full recovery, but Macri & Friends will try to improve the electoral performance in October in order to win seats in Congress or provincial governments. Macri announced some emergency measures including VAT reduction or elimination on basic products (it was at 21%) or increase some subsidies. Finance minister resigned.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/18/cristina-kirchner-fiery-ex-president-returns-crisis-argentina

Quote
Macri, a millionaire businessman, is paying a heavy price for failing to deliver on his emphatic promise of zero inflation and zero poverty when he took office in December 2015. Inflation hit 54% over the last 12 months, twice the rate when he took office. Foreign debt has also more than doubled, after a loss of investor confidence in emerging markets forced Macri to seek a $57.1bn rescue package from the IMF last September, the largest loan it has ever handed out (...)

Juan Grabois, a social leader who also has close links with Pope Francis, heads the Movement of Excluded Workers (MTE), a large alliance of people without formal employment. According to him, Argentina’s “new poor” – street sellers, trash rummagers – total about six million people.

Grabois agreed that Macri’s Cambiemos party had lost touch with the dire situation of Argentina’s poor workers and middle class. “Now we are facing a crisis similar to the one in 2001,” he said.

The only reason Argentina hasn’t descended into the popular unrest and supermarket lootings that marked that crisis is due to the social aid programmes put into place by Kirchner’s government. Although these were heavily criticised by Macri’s party, the president himself has tripled the amount of social aid being handed out to stave off unrest.

“The aid only lasts those who receive it to the middle of the month, with luck, but that’s enough to keep them waiting until the start of the next month rather than taking to the streets,” Grabois said.

Grabois criticised as insufficient a string of measures announced by Macri over the course of last week: a reduction in taxes on wages and on essential food items, price controls and the freezing of mortgage payment instalments. He also questioned Macri’s chances of making it to the end of his term this December. 
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