DNC strips Florida of all delegates

[Lief 🗽]

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http://apnews.myway.com//article/20070825/D8R868K00.html

Obviously, this a good thing for not-Hillary, whoever that not-Hillary may eventually be.

[© tweed]

doesn't mean the media won't pay attention to it, which why early primaries matter, not because of the delegates involved.

[Lief 🗽]

Florida could still move to super Tuesday and get their delegates back. No idea whether or not they will though.

[© tweed]

they'll have more influence by being one of two states to hold a primary on Jan 29 and having no delegates than they would by moving to Super Tuesday and being one of 20+ states despite getting their delegates back.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I don't think so much. Look at that DC straw poll in 2004 before the actual DC caucus. Didn't do much. There's also going to be rather low turnout here, so once again, it just looks like a straw poll.

And even if the media does give it much attention, there's still going to be low turnout, and that might benefit Obama and Edwards as their supporters are more left wing and thus more likely to turn out.

[Bacon King]

Looks like there's gonna be a bit of a scuffle about this. From politics1:

FLORIDA: Some key Florida Democrats dared the DNC to sanction the state for advancing the Presidential primary to January 29. US Senator Bill Nelson and US Representatives Alcee Hastings, Kendrick Meek, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, and Kathy Castor issued an open letter to the DNC on Thursday, demanding that the DNC drop any threat of sanctions. In case the message was missed, the group threatened possible US Justice Department complaints or court challenges if the DNC moves forward with sanctions. "If the DNC strips Florida of all or some of its delegates to the national convention, we would ask the appropriate legal officials to determine whether this could violate any state or federal laws governing and protecting individual voting rights," stated the letter. They raise an interesting question of whether the DNC and RNC can legally conspire to preserve the protected first-in-the-nation status of the Iowa and New Hampshire contests without violating the Voting Rights Act and other constitutional protection against racial discrimination in voting. US Census data shows Iowa's population is 92% non-Hispanic White. New Hampshire's population is 94% non-Hispanic White. Neither even remotely represents any racial or ethnic diversity. Florida's population, by contrast, is 15.7% Black, 2% Asian, and 19.5% Hispanic. While parties are entitled to largely control the nomination process' rules, they cannot do so in any manner that would violate federal voting and civil rights laws by depriving minority voters of having their votes count because they sought the same early voting rights as the white voting population of Iowa and New Hampshire. As Governor Jennifer Granholm, US Senator Carl Levin and other prominent Michigan Dem leaders likewise support their state's move to break the official schedule with a January 15 primary, look for them to soon make threaten similar actions if Michigan is threatened with DNC sanctions. The RNC is also threatening sanctions against both states.

[Lief 🗽]

Florida's kinda selfish, really. They're already one of the most important swing states. They're already a big, rich state that candidates love to milk for money. They already decided the 2000 election. And now they want to move ahead of every single state but 3 or 4?

[Mr. Morden]

It's virtually a certainty that Iowa and New Hampshire will also move up their caucus and primary to before the DNC-sanctioned dates (so they can go before NV and SC), so expect them to lose their delegates as well.....and of course, the same thing will happen to Michigan if they hold their primary on Jan. 15th.  In all probability, the first Democratic primary or caucus to actually confer any delegates will be the Nevada caucus.

[poughies]

problem in the case of iowa and new hampshire is that the candidates already have so much invested in those states.....

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Yeah, I'd be very surprised if that happens. I think the basic policy will be that the only states that can go before Feb. 5th are IA, NH and NV.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

The Presidential Primary system is epic failure.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Hopefully, though I doubt it, this will eventually end with the States getting out of the business of running political primaries.  They should be run by the parties with not a single cent of public money being used on them.

[Mr. Morden]

Yeah, I'd be very surprised if that happens. I think the basic policy will be that the only states that can go before Feb. 5th are IA, NH and NV.

I think the DNC will strip IA and NH of their delegates, but the candidates will campaign there anyway.  IA and NH don't have that many delegates anyway.  The candidates campaign there to get momentum, not delegates.  And momentum is determined by how much media coverage the primary gets, which in turn is determined largely by how much the candidates campaign there.  (It's a vicious circle.)

FL and MI are completely different.  It costs so much $ to campaign in states that big, that I doubt the candidates will make much of an effort if they won't get any delegates whatsoever by winning.

[Frodo]

If this stop-gap measure fails, then it seems as if a national primary is going to be the wave of the future. 

[The Dowager Mod]

Good to see they called Floridas bluff.

[Sensei]

damn. That's my first ever ballot cast.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

This crap is a mess

[Aizen]

florida? more like floridumb.


Seriously, they were being selfish and deserved to have their delegates stripped. Hopefully they move back to Feb. 5th.

[Mr. Morden]

Seriously, they were being selfish and deserved to have their delegates stripped. Hopefully they move back to Feb. 5th.

Not a chance.  The state legislature is controlled by the GOP, and they don't care what the DNC does.  The only thing the FL Dems could do is allocate the delegates in a caucus (paid for by the state party).  But they haven't shown any inclination to do that.

[Padfoot]

Seriously, they were being selfish and deserved to have their delegates stripped. Hopefully they move back to Feb. 5th.

Not a chance.  The state legislature is controlled by the GOP, and they don't care what the DNC does.  The only thing the FL Dems could do is allocate the delegates in a caucus (paid for by the state party).  But they haven't shown any inclination to do that.

Was this move in violation of RNC rules?  If so, will the RNC be taking action?   I think if the Republicans get their delegates stripped also Florida will move back to Feb. 5th

[Lief 🗽]

It's ridiculous that the legislature has control over when a party is allowed to hold its own primary.

[Tender Branson]

To avoid disenfranchising voters in a state which has already had problems in the past, I think a non-partisan comission should work out a compromise primary plan for the future which is binding for all states, and if it´s not a national primary day (big travel burden for unknown candidates), it could be eased with a rotating 3 stage regional primary in the first or second quarter of a presidential year, something like this:

Each region makes up about 1/3 of the US population and rotates like:

2008: W-N-S
2012: N-S-W
2016: S-W-N

[Mr. Morden]

Seriously, they were being selfish and deserved to have their delegates stripped. Hopefully they move back to Feb. 5th.

Not a chance.  The state legislature is controlled by the GOP, and they don't care what the DNC does.  The only thing the FL Dems could do is allocate the delegates in a caucus (paid for by the state party).  But they haven't shown any inclination to do that.

Was this move in violation of RNC rules?  If so, will the RNC be taking action?   I think if the Republicans get their delegates stripped also Florida will move back to Feb. 5th

For the GOP, any state that votes before Feb. 5th loses half of its delegates.  The RNC can't change these rules until the 2008 convention itself.  Anyway, half its delegates in a big state like FL is still a lot of delegates, so the FL GOP is perfectly happy to hold a Jan. 29th primary, and hope to make up for the lost delegates by influencing the race with momentum.

[Mr. Morden]

To avoid disenfranchising voters in a state which has already had problems in the past, I think a non-partisan comission should work out a compromise primary plan for the future which is binding for all states, and if it´s not a national primary day (big travel burden for unknown candidates), it could be eased with a rotating 3 stage regional primary in the first or second quarter of a presidential year, something like this:

Only problem with that: Whichever region goes first is going to have way more influence on the result than the regions that go next.  So in one election, we'd have the South deciding the nominees, then four years later, the West deciding the nominees, etc.  Might it make more sense to have the first round of primaries to include states that are more spread out geographically?

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Remove the primary system. Actually screw it just abolish democracy and give me absolute power.