If the evangelicals buck and go for a third party, will it cost the GOP 2008?

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Hy!

I'm french, so sorry if my engish is not perfect.

I follow from my country for a couple of years the evangelicals movements arround the world and especially in the USA, I thinck they can progress through the populations all over the world and they are also in my small french city of the south west of France (7 evangelicals churches, 1 traditionnal protestant and 8 traditionnal catholic churches, for 45.000 peoples).

I came on this forum to ask questions about them on the US elections and precisely on the question of this topic: can the evangelicals make a third party? In my question i mean a third party as the democrates party or the republicans one.

So i would have several more precise questions:

Have some evangelicals politicians tried to create a third party? If they did, does that work?

Are evangelicals politicians some pastors?

Do the evangelicals churches try to federate them? If they do, does that work?

What is the place of the evangelicals in the US mass medias as CBS, ABC or NBC? How do we speack about them on these mass medias?

Lot of thancks for all the ones who can give some of these informations to me.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Thancks a lot state boiler to answer my questions.

First i would like to precise that i'm not for the evangelicals. I just try to get informations about them cause i thinck they can have a very important place arround the world in the years to come.

When i asked if they tried to federate their churches, i wanted to know if, as there is a lot of different evangelical churches, they try to group them in a sort of federation of churches or in a sort of a big only evangelical movement with a only name, with a boss, with a strategy on a large scale and all the things that can do a big organization and not some different smalls.

I would also like to know if there is some debates in US mass medias on the separation of the Church and the State. If there are, does it take a large place, or a larger and larger place?

What i thinck from what i can see from my country is that the evangelicals will be deserved in 2008 but if the movement continue to spread in the population, i thinck they can come back stronger for the presidency elections to follow. What do you thinck about it?

Thanck you

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Thanck you for your answers Goa Tse.

I heard speacking about the "Christian coalition", isn't its strategy more international?
I also knew for schools, the one i knew is the "Patrick Henry college" did you hear about it?
And i'm not surprised at all that they have thinck tanks.

When you tell me that you don't thinck that the evangelical can go bigger cause they are splinting there ideology and they are becoming more open minded, i thinck it is the only way for them to can have a future. I thinck that if they want to survive, they have to be more pragmatic with the world. My thinck is that they will concentrate them on some traditionnal values plus maybe the creationism and almost they will put the maximum on the proselythism and still above on the charismatic way of life that make that peoples who have troubles in their life and in their mind will can sing and scream at church and then feel better. I thinck that is that can work in the US and it works also all arround the world. I thinck they are enough intelligent to feel it and to do in consequence, especially the baptists and the pentecotists who are thancks to me the ones on who we have to keep an eye.

What do you thinck about it?

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Sorry for my unknowledge but GOP? (republican party?) CDs? (christian democrats?) Cons? (conservators?)

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Sorry for my unknowledge but GOP? (republican party?) CDs? (christian democrats?) Cons? (conservators?)

GOP stands for "Grand Old Party" which refers to the Republicans because they won so many presidential elections from the American Civil War until the Great Depression in 1932.

I'm not sure what he meant with CD.

Cons. is short for conservatives, which refers to the ideology and not a particular party.

Thanck you Snowguy 716

I would have still a few more questions to ask to peoples living in USA about the evangelicals:

Have evangelicals a, or several, TV channel(s) that cover all the USA? If yes, has it, or have they, a good audience? Same question for national radio(s) or press.

Are there some debates in the country on a Christian-based state for USA? If yes, are these debates in mass medias (TVs, radios, press)? If they are, have they a large place? a small one? a lager? a smaller?

Have evangelicals big websites? which ones?

As this forum is before destined to speack on 2008 presidency elections and as i don't want to be out of subject, if someone knows a forum more destinited to speack about evangelicals, the adress will be welcome.

Finally, questions that are more on the 2008 elections:

What's the position of Hillary Clinton about evangelicals?

Have most of the democrats her position?

Is there a common position of the democrats about evangelicals?

I know, there is a lot of questions but i have a lot of interogations, so thancks a lot to all the ones that can give me some of these informations.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Thancks fezzyfestoon

All the information that permit me to better understand how USA work and how evangelicals work in USA are precious to me.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Thancks Goa Tse

I think i understood most of what you said but i think i need precisions:

First, when you put .5%, means 0.5%?

Then, when you put numbers like these: "78-21", "70-28", "52-44", "48-51" and else, is it the percent of repartition of evangelical vote between GOP and dems? So that making 78% of evangelicals voting for GOP and 21% voting for dems in 2004? and so that making 40% of evangelical vote for GOP and 59% for dems if Giuliani gets the nomination???

Other question, from what i can see from France, i think that Giuliani is the best positioned to get the nomination and i think it's the only one to be able to win versus a Hillary Clinton. What do you think about it?

Last point, you tell me evangelical are went and even if they are bigger they are more diluted, we allready spoke about that, but as i think that in the years to come they will reorganize them, finding new ways of efficient progression, i think we must keep an eye on them. Actually i heard about the fact that the megachurches become more and more numerous in USA (meagachurches present in USA were about 650 in 2000 and 1210 in 2005, according to a specialist) and that each of them takes more and more importance in each community regrouping different activities and creating paid-jobs, is that something you can see? The question is for you or anyone else living in USA.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

If that's Clinton vs. Giulliani, won't the evangelicals creat, as third party, the party of the... abstention?

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

If a large majority of evangelicals go for abstention, will it cost the GOP 2008?

If they lose cause of that, it seems to me that there are two possibilities for the future:

-GOP reorganizes itself to be more... Democrat

-GOP reorganizes itself to be more... evangelical

So, one of the key question for the future seems to be: what will become evangelicals in the years to come?

Anyway, actually something seems to be sure, it is that, if there is not a big event that shakes a lot of things, for the 2008 elections USA want to go far from G.W. Bush, am I wrong?

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Clearly, it has gone beyond the point where these people are simply protecting their way of life, they would enfore their will upon everyone, this much is certain, and those kind of people are driving millions away from the Republican Party.

I totally agree with that. They (evangelicals) are neither Republican nor Democrat nor others, they are "born again", they don't search to convice only by ideas but also by a sort of charismatic power. They try to do it in USA but also in any country of the world, and it works in a lot of. I think we should keep an eye on them, cause when peoples begin to lose the reason, to stop to think in the way to only obey to God and especially to the men that pretend representing Him on earth, we should begin to be worried about it.

Isn't there more or less 50% of americans who believe in creationism?

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

The % who say they believe in creationism depends greatly on how the question is phrased, because a very large % of americans will say they are in favor of anything with "christian" "biblical" or "jesus" in the title. In general, Americans (outside the deep south at least) like the idea of fundamentalist christianity a lot more than they like it in practice. For example, large numbers of Americans tell pollsters that they think creationism or intelligent design should be taught in schools, but whenever a school board tries to implement creationism, they usually get booted out of office.

Thancks strangeland

If I don't put doubts in your word when you tell me that americans in general like the idea of fundamentalist christianity more than they like it in practice, we maybe could agree to say that it is at least a positive ground for these proselytist movements that are evangelicals. Like I said in my last message, the most worrying thing to me is that peoples in general go more and more in the irrational, all over the world, and from what I can see USA seem to be far to be an exception, even France, "country of the reason", of "les Lumières", with an history deeply anti-religion since our 1789 revolution and deeply rationalist. Evangelicals profit a lot of it and use more and more of it and it works. Like I said, when peoples begin to lose reason and stop thinking, I find it worrying, especially in a democracy.

Now to me the question is: will the evangelicals continue in this way gaining more and more peoples, and one day majorities of peoples? I think it could be a possibility in more or less long-term for lot of places in the world and also for USA which are important cause the most powerfull country.

Actually the most probable to me is that evangelicals will be far diseverd in 2008, and it could make 3 or 4 years to reorganize them and come back stronger.

More of that, it could be 3 or 4 years during the ones lot of things could change in the world and international troubles could happen. I think that if USA choose a president in retreat on the international scene in 2008, and if important international troubles happen, USA could want to choose a very interventionist president on the international scene in 2012.

G.W. Bush wanted to impose freedom in the world, will an american president one day try to impose Jesus in the way to make the comunion of all peoples of the world with God? Anyway that's the big project of evangelicals.