3 undersea cables cut in 3 days

[dead0man]

2 near Egypt on Wednesday and now 1 near Dubai
link

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An interesting side note, there is NO internet traffic to and from Iran because of these cuts.  link  This all just a big coincidence?

[GMantis]

What would the Iranians gain from shutting down Internet for a few days?

[dead0man]

Maybe it's not the Iranians that shut it down?

[Silent Hunter]

What would the Americans gain either bar massive inconvenience? It's not like the F-14 has a modem on board...

[J. J.]

I think this might be important.

The questions would be:

1.  Who has the ability to cut these these cables?

2.  What would be the advantages in stopping Internet traffic to and from that region?

[CultureKing]

I think this might be important.

The questions would be:

1.  Who has the ability to cut these these cables?

2.  What would be the advantages in stopping Internet traffic to and from that region?

Coup?   

[J. J.]

I think this might be important.

The questions would be:

1.  Who has the ability to cut these these cables?

2.  What would be the advantages in stopping Internet traffic to and from that region?

Coup?   

No, but it might be to block messages coming out of the region, or to make them use an alternative, and less opaque, method of sending them.  Since the region we are referring to is  a harbor for terrorists, that could be the reason.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

For sure, the fact that Iran is concerned interests me and must us to wonder.

But here, I don't see where could be the gain for the US to have done such a thing unless they prepare an attack soon, what I don't imagine, but we never know.

If that's not the case, the cable will be repaired, this could have retarded some Iranian operations but nothing more, or I don't see it.

More of that, if that are the USA which intentionally did it, and if that's not for a very important strategic reason, it would have been a stupid operation because it may have shown to Iranians one of their weakness. Now aware of it, they could decide to do in consequence, why not by making a cable under Caspian Sea, by their Russian "friend"...

[J. J.]

For sure, the fact that Iran is concerned interests me and must us to wonder.

But here, I don't see where could be the gain for the US to have done such a thing unless they prepare an attack soon, what I don't imagine, but we never know.

If that's not the case, the cable will be repaired, this could have retarded some Iranian operations but nothing more, or I don't see it.

More of that, if that are the USA which intentionally did it, and if that's not for a very important strategic reason, it would have been a stupid operation because it may have shown to Iranians one of their weakness. Now aware of it, they could decide to do in consequence, why not by making a cable under Caspian Sea, by its Russian "friend"...

If they stop Internet transmission, it might make a terrorist have to find a more traceable method of communicating.

[J. J.]

Apparently, there have been more.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_submarine_cable_disruption

[MasterJedi]

Well I doubt it's happening all by itself so I really wonder who's doing it. If it's Iran they could get themselves in a crapload of trouble.

[J. J.]

Well I doubt it's happening all by itself so I really wonder who's doing it. If it's Iran they could get themselves in a crapload of trouble.

Some of those are nowhere near Iran.

[dead0man]

Does Iran have equipment and experience capable of doing this?  I doubt it.  It's either accident or a 1st World nation.  The list of nations with this kind of capability is pretty short.

[J. J.]

Does Iran have equipment and experience capable of doing this?  I doubt it.  It's either accident or a 1st World nation.  The list of nations with this kind of capability is pretty short.

A number of "accidents" at the same time, several thousand miles appart. 

1st world nation seems likely.  The question is why, and I think I've answered it.

[dead0man]

I think I agree with you.  It might not be a prelude to an attack, but it could very well be a "lets see what they do when we do THIS!" so they'll (we'll?) know how they (Iran) will communicate internationally if we cut their internet off.

(on the other hand, I'm sure ALL traffic that leaves Iran via these channels is monitored by the US.  I'd be shocked (and a little dissapointed) if that wasn't the case.)

[J. J.]

I think I agree with you.  It might not be a prelude to an attack, but it could very well be a "lets see what they do when we do THIS!" so they'll (we'll?) know how they (Iran) will communicate internationally if we cut their internet off.

(on the other hand, I'm sure ALL traffic that leaves Iran via these channels is monitored by the US.  I'd be shocked (and a little dissapointed) if that wasn't the case.)

As I'm sure you are aware, some data can be hidden.  Now, if the method for transmitting that data is disrupted, the sender has to use another, perhaps more traceable, method.

I doubt if it's the prelude for an attack or just to see what someone will do.

[dead0man]

Anything that can be hidden can be found.  I doubt very much that the Iranians could consistently sneak data past the US govt sniffers over traditional data lines such as the ones cut.

[J. J.]

Anything that can be hidden can be found.  I doubt very much that the Iranians could consistently sneak data past the US govt sniffers over traditional data lines such as the ones cut.

Probably not the Iranians.  Al Qaeda, and they've done it before.

[dead0man]

And they've been caught doing it before too, but I'm not sure what this has to do with Iran.

[Platypus]

I think I agree with you.  It might not be a prelude to an attack, but it could very well be a "lets see what they do when we do THIS!" so they'll (we'll?) know how they (Iran) will communicate internationally if we cut their internet off.

(on the other hand, I'm sure ALL traffic that leaves Iran via these channels is monitored by the US.  I'd be shocked (and a little dissapointed) if that wasn't the case.)

Whilst I tend to agree, that's not a very libertaran viewpoint. Are you libertarian in the 'my liberties' mould only?

[Gabu]

From the article:

Stephan Beckert, an analyst with TeleGeography, a research company that consults on global Internet issues, said the cables off Egypt were likely damaged by ships' anchors.

Unless there is obvious reason to suspect intentional foul play, I think the most obvious explanation is, as usual, the simplest and most mundane.

[Platypus]

But the egyptian gov't has said it was impossible, Gabu.

Link: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/02/04/2153455.htm

Ships did not cut internet cables: Egypt
Posted Mon Feb 4, 2008 10:05am AEDT

Ships are not responsible for damaging undersea internet cables in the Mediterranean, Egypt's Government says.

Two cables were damaged earlier this week in the Mediterranean sea and another off the coast of Dubai, causing widespread disruption to internet and international telephone services in Egypt, Gulf Arab states and South Asia.

A fourth cable linking Qatar to the United Arab Emirates was damaged on Sunday causing yet more disruptions, telecommunication provider Qtel said.

Egypt's transport ministry said footage recorded by onshore video cameras of the location of the cables showed no maritime traffic in the area when the cables were damaged.

"The ministry's maritime transport committee reviewed footage covering the period of 12 hours before and 12 hours after the cables were cut and no ships sailed the area," a statement said.

"The area is also marked on maps as a no-go zone and it is therefore ruled out that the damage to the cables was caused by ships."

Earlier reports said that the damage had been caused by ships that had been diverted off their usual route because of bad weather.

A repair ship is expected to begin work to fix the two Mediterranean cables on Tuesday.

- AFP

[dead0man]

I think I agree with you.  It might not be a prelude to an attack, but it could very well be a "lets see what they do when we do THIS!" so they'll (we'll?) know how they (Iran) will communicate internationally if we cut their internet off.

(on the other hand, I'm sure ALL traffic that leaves Iran via these channels is monitored by the US.  I'd be shocked (and a little disappointed) if that wasn't the case.)

Whilst I tend to agree, that's not a very libertaran viewpoint. Are you libertarian in the 'my liberties' mould only?

What am I agreeing to or not?  That we should be cutting cables?  That we should be listening in on Iran?  We probably shouldn't be cutting the cables even if it does gain us intelligence just because it's wrong.  We probably should be actively spying on Iran as they do occasionally take hundreds of our people hostage.  They have made verbal threats towards us and our friends multiple times.  They are most likely aiding the murder of our men in Iraq (which if proven true, would be an act of war in my opinion.  And for the record, I don't think we should have ever invaded Iraq and I don't think we should be there now......with the caveat that if our goal was to rid the world of evil govts then yes Saddam's govt should have toppled, but that isn't our goal and that's not all we've done.  We've kept our dick in that pie for a long time now and look to keep it their until we can't afford to do it anymore or they blow us all up.).  There are many good reasons for us to be actively spying on internal and external communications from Iran. 

I'm pretty sure I can think that way and still be a Libertarian.  Some Republicans are Pro-Choice.  Some Democrats hate Affirmative Action.  Why do all Libertarians have to fit some preconceived mold?  And how is thinking that way unLibertarian?  Many Libertarians are very pro-Military even if they are against the Iraq War.  Count me as one.  I love the Military.  I am part of the Military.  I do have some major issues with some of the waste I see and I haven't always liked the direction the Feds have pointed us in (my enlistment started during Clinton's first term) but I have no problems with the overall mission of the US Military (or NATO at large, which in some ways trumps the US Military as far as global power shifts go).

Unless there is obvious reason to suspect intentional foul play, I think the most obvious explanation is, as usual, the simplest and most mundane.

Normally I'd agree with you.  Rarely should you blame malice when incompetency is afoot. There's been so many odd breaks here though.  But yeah...probably accident of some kind.  I guess we'll find out when they get it repaired.

<conspiracy hat>UNLESS THEY GET REPAIRED BY THE SAME PEOPLE THAT CUT THEM!
<cue Micheal Moore documentary background music>

[Bono]

I think I agree with you.  It might not be a prelude to an attack, but it could very well be a "lets see what they do when we do THIS!" so they'll (we'll?) know how they (Iran) will communicate internationally if we cut their internet off.

(on the other hand, I'm sure ALL traffic that leaves Iran via these channels is monitored by the US.  I'd be shocked (and a little disappointed) if that wasn't the case.)

Whilst I tend to agree, that's not a very libertaran viewpoint. Are you libertarian in the 'my liberties' mould only?

What am I agreeing to or not?  That we should be cutting cables?  That we should be listening in on Iran?  We probably shouldn't be cutting the cables even if it does gain us intelligence just because it's wrong.  We probably should be actively spying on Iran as they do occasionally take hundreds of our people hostage.  They have made verbal threats towards us and our friends multiple times.  They are most likely aiding the murder of our men in Iraq (which if proven true, would be an act of war in my opinion.  And for the record, I don't think we should have ever invaded Iraq and I don't think we should be there now......with the caveat that if our goal was to rid the world of evil govts then yes Saddam's govt should have toppled, but that isn't our goal and that's not all we've done.  We've kept our dick in that pie for a long time now and look to keep it their until we can't afford to do it anymore or they blow us all up.).  There are many good reasons for us to be actively spying on internal and external communications from Iran. 

I'm pretty sure I can think that way and still be a Libertarian.  Some Republicans are Pro-Choice.  Some Democrats hate Affirmative Action.  Why do all Libertarians have to fit some preconceived mold?  And how is thinking that way unLibertarian?  Many Libertarians are very pro-Military even if they are against the Iraq War.  Count me as one.  I love the Military.  I am part of the Military.  I do have some major issues with some of the waste I see and I haven't always liked the direction the Feds have pointed us in (my enlistment started during Clinton's first term) but I have no problems with the overall mission of the US Military (or NATO at large, which in some ways trumps the US Military as far as global power shifts go).

Unless there is obvious reason to suspect intentional foul play, I think the most obvious explanation is, as usual, the simplest and most mundane.

Normally I'd agree with you.  Rarely should you blame malice when incompetency is afoot. There's been so many odd breaks here though.  But yeah...probably accident of some kind.  I guess we'll find out when they get it repaired.

<conspiracy hat>UNLESS THEY GET REPAIRED BY THE SAME PEOPLE THAT CUT THEM!
<cue Micheal Moore documentary background music>

I agree it's completely unlibertarian. You're basically saying it's ok to invade the privacy of brown people, but not of those in the US.

[J. J.]

The question isn't about reading them or disruption, but about tracing where there are coming from.  At least that's my guess.