Glossolalia/Speaking in Tongues

[JSojourner]

Just curious...

And I wanted to move us away from the some of the other threads

[Хahar 🤔]

Neither.

[Хahar 🤔]

Neither.

A non-believer view, I assume?

Muslim.

[Хahar 🤔]

Muslim.

Well it seems I failed miserably on my assumption.    Sorry, so Muslims don't believe in anything like speaking in tongues?

Not as far as I know, though my knowledge of such things is not great.

[J. J.]

I think it is possible and probably does happen today.

[afleitch]

Doesn't happen today and those who believe they do so should be psychologically assessed.

[JSojourner]

I've traveled in both Pentecostal and decidedly non-Pentecostal circles. At Bible College, I was taught that there was one gift of tongues -- a divinely-given ability to speak other human languages, without prior knowledge of that tongue on the part of the speaker. The purpose of this gift was simply to communicate the Gospel message to those who needed to hear it in their language.  The use of this gift is recounted in Acts. My professors taught me that this gift ceased, along with other "sign" gifts like divine healing and word of knowledge, when the Early Church Age came to an end.

In Pentecostal circles, theologians believe there are two gifts of tongues.  One is the aforementioned ability to communicate in known languages, when the speaker has no training. But they also insist there is a second kind of "gift of tongues"....one St. Paul made reference to when he referred to the "tongues of humans and the tongues of angels".  In short, this second "gift" is supposed to be a heavenly language spoken for two purposes --  personal edification and communication of direct, Divine messages from God (similar to word of knowledge). 

There is some Scriptural support for the Pentecostal position --  Paul says "he who speaks in a tongue edifies himself".  Evidently, the speaker he is referring to in this case is not speaking to an audience.  Could this be the "tongues of angels" the apostle referred to in First Corinthians?  I think so.

As to whether these gifts ended with the early church, there is no Scriptural evidence for this whatsoever.  St. Paul does say, "Where there are tongues, they shall be silenced."  But he goes on to clarify that the only reason the gift would end would be as a result of a lack of love.  "Where there is no love, tongues shall cease..." (and so will the other gifts).

Unfortunately, though I find myself agreeing with Pentecostals on something (which is mind-boggling, if you know me) -- I can't embrace or support tongues speaking.  For many reasons.  I have seen in practiced in dozens of churches in my lifetime and each time, it has sounded bizarrely constructed and "made up" on the spot.  It has functioned more like a kind of spiritual masturbation than anything resembling a prophetic attempt to encourage the church.  And when there has been a prophetic word spoken, it has always been generic in the extreme.  "Oh my people, I will do great things among you if you will but yield to me." If that's the message, it's already in the Bible.  Do we really need sister Lurleen to repeat it in a tongue?

But worse, I have had Pentecostal pastors tell me that if I do not speak in tongues, it means I was never a Christian in the first place or -- I might be a Christian, but I am not a very good one.  They refer to churches that do not engage in the practice as "dead" or not "spirit-filled". What utter hooey.  One pastor, a man I really loved, tried to teach me how to speak in tongues.  His advice?  "Just start speaking nonsense like -- 'shallaballa bannasoya' and then let the Holy Ghost take over.  I was so disappointed in him, because he really did so many wonderful things in the community.

In my church, The Episcopal Church, there is a tongues-speaking branch called The Charismatic Episcopal Church.  I attend a non-Charismatic EC but my encounters with the CEC have been good.  They haven't come across as hardcore as folks in The Assemblies of God, Vineyard Christian Fellowship, Calvary Chapel and United Pentecostal Churches.  But still -- I worry about any faith tradition when a person's salvation or quality of Christian life is judged on the basis of what spiritual gifts they possess or exercise.  Didn't the Apostle Paul refer to tongues as "the least of the gifts" after all?

My bottom line?  The gift may be extant today.  It may be extinct today.  I don't know.  I know only that when it is used to beat up on others spiritually, it's definitely not of God. 

What, if any, experiences have you had in Charismatic or Pentecostal circles?

[The Hack Hater]

Crap. There's no point to it, and there's no reason that anybody, regardless of how religious he or she is, should have to do it. The whole thing just sounds outdated.

[afleitch]

Doesn't happen today and those who believe they do so should be psychologically assessed.

I'll clarify that as I can see the wording is a bit vague- those who believe they can speak in tongues should be psychologically assessed.

[tik 🪀✨]

One of the more entertaining fields of christian bullsh**ttery.

It's actually been a dream of mine to stand up in the middle of a "spiritual" moment during a church service and begin screaming gibberish and have a friend stand up to translate it into something blatantly heretical.

"Snarg ackulency pigfib ray-ooglesh! Pbbbbb!"
"God has spoken through this man and said that all true followers must shave their asses blindfolded and use pages of the Bible to wipe away their ass-sins!"

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

still today

[memphis]

I've seen these people on tv, and they're ridiculous beyond words. Screaming and running all over the place. I realize most religion leads people toward absurd manifestations, and that this one is relatively harmless, but if one wants respect for his faith, he needs to act like it's merited.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

I've seen these people on tv, and they're ridiculous beyond words. Screaming and running all over the place. I realize most religion leads people toward absurd manifestations, and that this one is relatively harmless, but if one wants respect for his faith, he needs to act like it's merited.

not all speaking in tongues is done in the midst of chaos

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

The church I attended as a child was invaded by pentacostals in the early 1990s - they would "pray in tongues" and it terrified me. My grandfather got into it, and he had a church group around they started praying in tongues and the lights went out - my mother shouted at them to stop, and the lights came back on.

I consider it on par to the ouija board - it's attempting to know and harness spiritual energy, and sometimes it's not good.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

The church I attended as a child was invaded by pentacostals in the early 1990s - they would "pray in tongues" and it terrified me. My grandfather got into it, and he had a church group around they started praying in tongues and the lights went out - my mother shouted at them to stop, and the lights came back on.

I consider it on par to the ouija board - it's attempting to know and harness spiritual energy, and sometimes it's not good.

not all speaking in tongues is done in the midst of chaos

[JSojourner]

The church I attended as a child was invaded by pentacostals in the early 1990s - they would "pray in tongues" and it terrified me. My grandfather got into it, and he had a church group around they started praying in tongues and the lights went out - my mother shouted at them to stop, and the lights came back on.

I consider it on par to the ouija board - it's attempting to know and harness spiritual energy, and sometimes it's not good.

not all speaking in tongues is done in the midst of chaos

To be fair, Jmcfst is correct.  There are a small number of churches that believe the gift is extant today but practice rigid and strict controls on how it is exercised.  I attended one here in Fort Wayne for a couple years that would not permit anyone to speak in tongues or speak a word of knowledge in English before the congregation.  They were required to bring that word to the pastor and the board of elders.  They church leadership would then, through prayer and study of the Bible, determine if the tongue or word was Biblical.  If so, the pastor or an elder would deliver the translation of that word to the congregation.  I greatly admired this and thought it had much more integrity that what I had experienced in Assembly of God, Pentecostal and other such churches.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

not all speaking in tongues is done in the midst of chaos

To be fair, Jmcfst is correct.  There are a small number of churches that believe the gift is extant today but practice rigid and strict controls on how it is exercised.  I attended one here in Fort Wayne for a couple years that would not permit anyone to speak in tongues or speak a word of knowledge in English before the congregation.  They were required to bring that word to the pastor and the board of elders.  They church leadership would then, through prayer and study of the Bible, determine if the tongue or word was Biblical.  If so, the pastor or an elder would deliver the translation of that word to the congregation.  I greatly admired this and thought it had much more integrity that what I had experienced in Assembly of God, Pentecostal and other such churches.

well, let's not cut off our nose to spite our face, basically it sounds like that church was forbidding the speaking of tongues during assembly, but that is not the instruction of the scripture:

1Cor 14:23 So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind?...26 When you come together, everyone has a hymn, or a word of instruction, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church. 27If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. 28If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God....32The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets. 33For God is not a God of disorder but of peace.

That's a pretty simple instruction that maintains order, yet still allows for the speaking of tongues during church.  There ain't anything in that instruction that involves going before a board.

[ilikeverin]

I voted 1, but believe neither; I fail to see how it is remotely relevant to my religious faith.  It is utterly baseless from a linguistic perspective.

[dead0man]

I think it's probably BS, but as long as they aren't doing it at the grocery store, what do I care?