Obama on Small-Town Pennsylvania...

[J. J.]

MSNBC is running Hillary's ad without commentary with no charge to her. It's official, the media wants President John McCain and will do anything to get that.

I'm not sure of the relevance to this thread.

It's her ad beating the dead horse that this 38 page thread is all about.

You have absolutely no idea how bad this is.

[J. J.]

Certainly what Obama said was interpreted as demeaning to the working class and "average Joe". We can debate all year about whether or not it should've been interpreted this way, but it has been....so in a political context that's all that matters, since perception is reality.

Hopefully he'll learn from his missteps and atone for it. This type of thing reminds us that he is indeed a bit wet behind the ears and prone to verbal missteps. It happens to every candidate, but handling the fallout is the real test.

I really want to see him wearing a miner's helmet in West Virginia. Oh yeah, and throwing back a few shots at the bar.

The problem is, he hasn't learned yet.  He's dug in on the remark.  Had he said, "I misspoke," I might be very willing to say, "Yeh, he misspoke and he's only human."

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

This is a big scandal. I am surprised (well not really) at how lightly people are taking it on this forum.

We also have Rev. Wright going on a tirade against Foxnews and Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly during a eulogy of all things! And people believed Obama that he had never heard Wright say such things before? The more I hear from him, the more I am in disbelief.

[Sam Spade]

This is amazing!  Thirty-eight pages!  I didn't even catch the sound-bite on the news till after Sam posted the topic, and even then I didn't think it was worth a thread.  Am I out of touch or what?

Sam, you ought to be giving stock-market advice.  By the way, you got any?  I'm tanking over here.  Not bad enough to take up hunting or attending mass, but it's been a rough quarter. 

Unless you're playing the long term, I would have been out of the market six months ago, or in the General Mills/Proctor & Gamble area of the world.  I live too close to Wall St. to not ignore the attitude that I see from those types (who actually control the market in their own way).

I mean, if you want to play the foreign markets or commodities especially, go ahead.  I still think there's some money to be made there for the time being (don't know how much longer).  One of these days people will wake up to the absolute stupidity of the biofuel concept and one of these days, demand will fall to such a level (because of economic downturn) that the commodities will turn downhill a bit.  Same basic type scenario will happen to the dollar, but not yet.  My gut says to wait until fall 2008, at the earliest.

If you have some investment money or are an investment type, I think we're close to reaching the point where the foreclosure deals are starting to look good enough that I would start buying real estate.  Especially in places like Florida, where they're selling condos (from what an old investor told me) they're selling these things at 20 cents on the dollar.  But this requires money, and well, the ability to survey the area.  But much like in Houston during the mid-to-late 1980s, the aftermath of the crash leaves some really great opportunities if you've got the money.

Glad to see the thread at reply #579 and counting.  This story is far from over.

[Stranger in a strange land]

honestly I'm waiting for Hillary to put on camo and go duck hunting.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/04/14/politics/fromtheroad/entry4014458.shtml

Apparently, no one wants to hear much of what Hillary is saying about all this except the press?

[Gustaf]

There would be no rejection of such simple ideas in a society that promotes rationality and logic.  We do not seem to do that yet as a majority.

In this thread you have demonstrated no rationality and no logic. Just thought you ought to know.

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Your mind appears to be as closed as Anglesey on a Sunday.

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lol; this is exactly the sort of nonsense the spoiled "radical" brats used to trot out in the '60's and early '70's. But at least they could write a bit better than you.

Yes, we know Al.. your penis is unimaginably bigger than any of ours could ever dream to be...

But maybe you could actually speak to the debate at hand rather than just picking apart the other posters.

I thought we've been over this before. Go learn some decency before lecturing people.

It's funny but not surprising that Obama supporters are defending his statement.

[J. J.]

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/04/14/politics/fromtheroad/entry4014458.shtml

Apparently, no one wants to hear much of what Hillary is saying about all this except the press?

No, the speeches of both were suppose to be short.  It was a very set piece affair.

[Alcon]

SurveyUSA has given us a bit of a surprise:

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In other words, Obama has mostly offended Republicans and people who already did not like him.  On the other hand, the "negative impact" numbers aren't great for him.  This may convince a few fit-sitting establishment security voters to shy back to Clinton, but mostly, this squib looks to be damp (whatever that means).  It looks increasingly unlikely like the remark itself hurt him more than a percentage point or two.

Also worth noting:  SurveyUSA pretty routinely has Clinton's best sample in their polls.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

A squib is a sort of firework. If it's damp, it doesn't go off.

Btw, was that a poll just of the Harrisburg area [question mark].

[J. J.]

SurveyUSA has given us a bit of a surprise:

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In other words, Obama has mostly offended Republicans and people who already did not like him.  On the other hand, the "negative impact" numbers aren't great for him.  This may convince a few fit-sitting establishment security voters to shy back to Clinton, but mostly, this squib looks to be damp (whatever that means).  It looks increasingly unlikely like the remark itself hurt him more than a percentage point or two.

The key is going to be those fence sitters.  40% is high.

[Gustaf]

Did they ask whether people were personally offended? Because I imagine that would lower the number...

[Alcon]

A squib is a sort of firework. If it's damp, it doesn't go off.

Btw, was that a poll just of the Harrisburg area [question mark].

Oh, well, then that's accidentally apt.  Sweet.

No, it's not.  That's press release format.  SUSA is based in Harrisburg.

The key is going to be those fence sitters.  40% is high.

And pretty much irrelevant, since that includes Republicans.  It's the Democratic number we should be looking at.  I'm skeptical that 57% of independents agree with his statement, but I think the quote itself will be a fairly distant memory by November.  The "Obama is arrogant" meme is not going away.

[Alcon]

Did they ask whether people were personally offended? Because I imagine that would lower the number...

The question was "do you personally find the comments offensive?"  I guess that is slightly different from "were you personally offended?", though, but I'm not sure you can get a perfect question to get at what I think you're getting at.

Still, only 1/3 of Democrats in a Clinton-leaning state being "personally offended" (a number not all that much higher than the national poll of Democrats who think Obama should withdraw) suggests to me that this is mostly Clinton partisans reporting offense.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The question was "do you personally find the comments offensive?"  I guess that is slightly different from "were you personally offended?", though, but I'm not sure you can get a perfect question to get at what I think you're getting at.

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

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Of course. But then, they were the people he was "insulting", weren't they.

[Alcon]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

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Of course. But then, they were the people he was "insulting", weren't they.

Bingo!

[angus]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

You meant minutiae, not trivialities.  Minutiae are fine details.  Trivialities are little-known facts.

[Alcon]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

You meant minutiae, not trivialities.  Minutiae are fine details.  Trivialities are little-known facts.

Yeah, that would be one instance of this word I can't remember.

[angus]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

You meant minutiae, not trivialities.  Minutiae are fine details.  Trivialities are little-known facts.

Yeah, that would be one instance of this word I can't remember.

actually, that would be one facet of the word you can't remember, or perhaps one aspect of the word you can't remember.  An instance is one situation in a series of events, or one stage in a process.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

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Of course. But then, they were the people he was "insulting", weren't they.

Bingo!

Yeah, that's what I've been saying. The places he made this comment about weren't going to vote for him anyway. Did anyone really think Center City progressives would abandon him over this? LOL.

[Saxwsylvania]

Has Obama apologized yet, or is he still blaming the furor over his comments on the misinterpretations of dumb country folk?

[Alcon]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

You meant minutiae, not trivialities.  Minutiae are fine details.  Trivialities are little-known facts.

Yeah, that would be one instance of this word I can't remember.

actually, that would be one facet of the word you can't remember, or perhaps one aspect of the word you can't remember.  An instance is one situation in a series of events, or one stage in a process.

No, your pointing out a trivial grammatical distinction would be one instance of the concept represented by the word.

("Bitch.")

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Can we agree to just disagree?

No

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No, I don't think so.

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You were the one who implied membership in an educated elite...

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Can't take what you dish out to others, eh?

[angus]

Most people wouldn't really see a difference between "do you personally find the comments offensive" and "were you personally offended".

True -- I was going to add that but I can't remember the word for "the skill of differentiating between trivialities" this morning. 

You meant minutiae, not trivialities.  Minutiae are fine details.  Trivialities are little-known facts.

Yeah, that would be one instance of this word I can't remember.

actually, that would be one facet of the word you can't remember, or perhaps one aspect of the word you can't remember.  An instance is one situation in a series of events, or one stage in a process.

No, your pointing out a trivial grammatical distinction would be one instance of the concept represented by the word.

Touché! 

I'm just looking to extend the life of this magnificent forty-page thread.  Or "bump" as the kids say nowadays.  Have you thought of your word yet?

[J. J.]

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Of course. But then, they were the people he was "insulting", weren't they.

Bingo!

Yeah, that's what I've been saying. The places he made this comment about weren't going to vote for him anyway. Did anyone really think Center City progressives would abandon him over this? LOL.

Do you really think this will draw the undecided and "leaners" to him.