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  Hillary booed at WV speech (search mode)
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Author Topic: Hillary booed at WV speech  (Read 13312 times)
Sbane
sbane
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« on: May 08, 2008, 08:56:44 am »

brtd, you wont be so giddy on tuesday.

go ahead and pull out the 'west virginians are racist' line.  because we all know the only reason a white would dare vote against someone as great as obama is racism.

So can you explain to me why you hate Obama so much? I can understand that you prefer Hillary but you do realize they have the exact same policy positions. Isnt that what should count? Also I cannot stand when Hillary supporters say they will vote for Mccain. I understand not voting or writing in Hillary's name but why would you support an unending war in Iraq and a very possible one in Iran. Mccain has already made it clear he doesnt give a sh*t about the economy. Maybe you think Hillary would be better than Obama, but would Mccain be better than Obama at handling the economy?
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sbane
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« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2008, 09:27:01 am »


Most Obama supporters don't say this but there are a disturbing few on this board and among his general supporters in his his campaign who scream racism whenever someone is critical of Senator Obama.  That's not going to go down well in the fall and if that kind of talk gets too loud expect a white backlash.  Not something he needs with a huge demographic he is already weak with.

A Hillary supporter voting for Mccain in the fall seems like racism to me because their ideologies do not mix at all. I am not saying they are but it seems like that way to me because their is no logical reason to vote for Mccain if you believe in Hillary and what she stands for. Now a lot of that right now is bitterness and I understand that but hopefully that will wear off after 6 months of general election fun. I think a small segment of the population(concentrated in appalachia and the south) that voted for Hillary will vote for Mccain in the fall and a lot of them will be doing it to vote against the black guy. Some of these appalachian and blue collar areas where Obama will do bad I would not characterize as racist, rather than BITTER at black people. They feel Black people get coddled while they get screwed. I guess I understand where they come from but hopefully they can get over it by november.
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sbane
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« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2008, 11:41:51 am »

I'd say the bigger hacks are the ones calling Hillary supporters racist if they dare support McCain, then trumpet that Obama gets 95% margins of black voters.  The Voting Rights Act works both ways.

But I'm not reading that here....or did I miss it?


Are you serious?  There have literally been 4 people on this board, one in this thread who said that people who voted for Clinton and are now voting for McCain are "Racist" or "Bitter" towards black people.

Can you explain to me why a liberal who voted for Clinton and believes in everything she says would vote for Mccain? What policies do these two share any resemblance on, which is also not shared by Obama. Obama and Clinton have the same damn policies which is the reason why we had the most stupid primaries ever. No issues were discussed, just personalities. I for one would vote for Clinton in a heartbeat if she were the chosen nominee, so they why wont Clinton supporters vote for Obama?  All I was saying was that a minority of people will vote for Mccain just to vote against the black guy. If you disagree with me there you need to go back and reread your US history book.
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« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2008, 12:24:17 pm »

I'd say the bigger hacks are the ones calling Hillary supporters racist if they dare support McCain, then trumpet that Obama gets 95% margins of black voters.  The Voting Rights Act works both ways.

But I'm not reading that here....or did I miss it?


Are you serious?  There have literally been 4 people on this board, one in this thread who said that people who voted for Clinton and are now voting for McCain are "Racist" or "Bitter" towards black people.

Can you explain to me why a liberal who voted for Clinton and believes in everything she says would vote for Mccain? What policies do these two share any resemblance on, which is also not shared by Obama. Obama and Clinton have the same damn policies which is the reason why we had the most stupid primaries ever. No issues were discussed, just personalities. I for one would vote for Clinton in a heartbeat if she were the chosen nominee, so they why wont Clinton supporters vote for Obama?  All I was saying was that a minority of people will vote for Mccain just to vote against the black guy. If you disagree with me there you need to go back and reread your US history book.

Why explain, it's obvious that I'm racist because I'm supporting McCain?  BTW - who says everyone that voted for Clinton is a liberal?  I consider myself moderate.  I typically vote Democrat because they have tended to be the more moderate party over the last few years.  I'll give you one big issue where Clinton looks closer to McCain - Taxes.  Obama has said in the past he would raise taxes on people making over $150,000 a year.  Clinton puts the number higher, anywhere from $200,000 to $250,000 or so.  For those of us that live in a high cost of living city that is a very important distinction.  If you truly support Obama, why would you make these outrageous claims?  The character of supporters can really impact a candidate's campaign.    All of the Obama supporters crying racism are already causing a backlash, see here: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080416084947AAPtddu

Believe it or not, people don't like to be called racist and take such charges very seriously.  Maybe playing racial politics in the Democratic Primary will help you but this is going to be horrendous for your candidate in the Fall when you guys start calling people racist.

Ahh but I never called you racist, I am just trying to figure out where Clinton supporters are coming from. Now I am sorry if I offended you when I said blue collar workers were bitter towards blacks, but there certainly is a misunderstanding. Most of this occurs from the concept of white privilege. The poorer whites who support Clinton never had that privilege and rightfully get angry when they are told that. To them Obama is the symbol of that, a Black man taking away an opportunity from a white just because they are black. I understand that resentment as I am a Brahmin from India. Although the caste system was wrong, should Brahmin children not get the same opportunity today as lower caste kids? It is a similar situation here and a reason why I am against affirmative action. Now you said you disagree with Obama on taxes and it turns out we agree. My parents live in the bay area and to live comfortably here you have to have a family income in excess of 100k. Obama's taxes would affect my family and I hope he reconsiders it a bit. I think creating new higher tax categories out of people making millions makes more sense. Those making millions dont need all that money and they can sure as hell help their countrymen. I do feel bad for those who get caught in these tax margins though. I think creating more tax brackets is a possible solution to this problem. Now I do not know how you feel about foreign policy but that is the reason why I supported Obama from the start and the reason why I could not support Mccain. The Iraq war is one of the worst foreign policy decision ever made and it is not only hurting our image but also our economy. In the end it all comes down to that because a war is not worth fighting if we do not even have a country left to fight for.
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Sbane
sbane
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« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2008, 01:08:07 pm »

I'd say the bigger hacks are the ones calling Hillary supporters racist if they dare support McCain, then trumpet that Obama gets 95% margins of black voters.  The Voting Rights Act works both ways.

But I'm not reading that here....or did I miss it?


Are you serious?  There have literally been 4 people on this board, one in this thread who said that people who voted for Clinton and are now voting for McCain are "Racist" or "Bitter" towards black people.

Can you explain to me why a liberal who voted for Clinton and believes in everything she says would vote for Mccain? What policies do these two share any resemblance on, which is also not shared by Obama. Obama and Clinton have the same damn policies which is the reason why we had the most stupid primaries ever. No issues were discussed, just personalities. I for one would vote for Clinton in a heartbeat if she were the chosen nominee, so they why wont Clinton supporters vote for Obama?  All I was saying was that a minority of people will vote for Mccain just to vote against the black guy. If you disagree with me there you need to go back and reread your US history book.

Why explain, it's obvious that I'm racist because I'm supporting McCain?  BTW - who says everyone that voted for Clinton is a liberal?  I consider myself moderate.  I typically vote Democrat because they have tended to be the more moderate party over the last few years.  I'll give you one big issue where Clinton looks closer to McCain - Taxes.  Obama has said in the past he would raise taxes on people making over $150,000 a year.  Clinton puts the number higher, anywhere from $200,000 to $250,000 or so.  For those of us that live in a high cost of living city that is a very important distinction.  If you truly support Obama, why would you make these outrageous claims?  The character of supporters can really impact a candidate's campaign.    All of the Obama supporters crying racism are already causing a backlash, see here: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080416084947AAPtddu

Believe it or not, people don't like to be called racist and take such charges very seriously.  Maybe playing racial politics in the Democratic Primary will help you but this is going to be horrendous for your candidate in the Fall when you guys start calling people racist.

Ahh but I never called you racist, I am just trying to figure out where Clinton supporters are coming from. Now I am sorry if I offended you when I said blue collar workers were bitter towards blacks, but there certainly is a misunderstanding. Most of this occurs from the concept of white privilege. The poorer whites who support Clinton never had that privilege and rightfully get angry when they are told that. To them Obama is the symbol of that, a Black man taking away an opportunity from a white just because they are black. I understand that resentment as I am a Brahmin from India. Although the caste system was wrong, should Brahmin children not get the same opportunity today as lower caste kids? It is a similar situation here and a reason why I am against affirmative action. Now you said you disagree with Obama on taxes and it turns out we agree. My parents live in the bay area and to live comfortably here you have to have a family income in excess of 100k. Obama's taxes would affect my family and I hope he reconsiders it a bit. I think creating new higher tax categories out of people making millions makes more sense. Those making millions dont need all that money and they can sure as hell help their countrymen. I do feel bad for those who get caught in these tax margins though. I think creating more tax brackets is a possible solution to this problem. Now I do not know how you feel about foreign policy but that is the reason why I supported Obama from the start and the reason why I could not support Mccain. The Iraq war is one of the worst foreign policy decision ever made and it is not only hurting our image but also our economy. In the end it all comes down to that because a war is not worth fighting if we do not even have a country left to fight for.

Thanks for this thoughtful post.  To be honest, your comment wasn't particularly bad compared to many on some other threads.  I only cut and pasted it because it was more convenient than searching for the other ones.

The funny thing is that we probably agree nearly entirely on the issues.  For me I just look at it like this.  We're already in Iraq.  McCain won't have the political capital to do another war, his Iran comments notwithstanding.  He won't have the votes in Congress to push through uber-conservative Judges.   But Obama would have the votes in Congress to push through big tax hikes.  I am graduating from law school with $150,000 of debt.  Even though I have a job lined up that pays well over 6 figures, the thought of having such a huge debt is daunting, and I think about it every single day.  I can't afford to pay an extra $20,000 in taxes under the plan's Obama has floated out there.  So on a personal level, Hillary would have been perfect for me.  Good Judges, Good Tax Policy.  But when it comes down to choosing between Obama and McCain, even though I have a gut feeling to always vote Democrat, when I analyze what they'll do for me, McCain wins hands down.  Strategically it's the right move.  Besides, I sort of like it when Congress and the Executive Branch are split, neither party gets too extreme. That's a large part of why the Republicans screwed up so bad with their out of control spending in the first place.

I think what I want is immediate start of withdrawl from Iraq. Maybe changing the roles that our military plays will change the conditions? I dont think they should all come back of course but lets get the ball rolling the other direction and see what happens. We of course have the option of going in there full strength if that is what is required. Ulitimately this is a problem not to be solved by the US congress or US army. The Iraqi legislature is the only place where the situation could possibly be resolved. But that is pretty unlikely isnt it? I think we have to somehow get more countries involved in our efforts or else show them the consequences. Obama could possibly do this but Mccain sure as hell wont.
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sbane
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« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2008, 05:02:07 pm »

One side has been a lot more rampant with the racist vitriol.  Sorry, but I'm not dragging out this discussion, I've been asked repeatedly why I don't like Obama and I happened to cite his supporters as one reason why.  People have made me explain that so I did.  Yes, I think the racists on this board are offensive, sorry if that upsets you that I don't support racism.

So if I find racists who are supporting McCain, you'll abandon him? Cool. The Internet's a big place, it should take me about five minutes to find a Freeper chuckling over the Heineken looter photo who talks about voting for McCain. If you give up supporting McCain, I'll admire your principle.

Try Ben Domenech at Red State, who dismissed Coretta Scott King as a communist and said no one should have cared about her funeral. He's a Republican. Are you offended?

Fortunately, it's not PC for Anti-Black Racism to run rampant online and in person.  Unfortunately, it's totally PC for Obama supporters to spread racism wherever they see fit. 

You just dont seem to get the difference between Black people voting FOR Obama and white people voting against the black guy for racial reasons. Minorities vote in blocs not just in America but around the whole world and nobody calls it racism. It is them trying to gain some relevance in the political system. Whites always get to decide who is president. If Whites were to vote 90% for Hillary we would not be having this conversation as she would have won and there would have been nothing abnormal with White people not voting for a black candidate as it has happened before.( eg. Jesse Jackson and such) In truth White americans were just waiting for an acceptable black candidate and many seem to have found it in Obama. Do not try and dismiss Obama as the black candidate because he would not be where he is without strong white support.
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sbane
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« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2008, 08:25:51 pm »


You just dont seem to get the difference between Black people voting FOR Obama and white people voting against the black guy for racial reasons.

I said it elsewhere, I'll say it again.

Black people vote for black and white candidates, predominantly for white candidates. In the last, oh, ALL general elections where they were able to vote, they have voted for white candidates.

White people have voted for white candidates. They rarely get the opportunity to do otherwise, and unlike black voters, they have not established a record of crossing the racial barrier and voting for someone of another race.

For a black voter to have voted for white candidates all his or her life to be called a racist for voting for a black candidate is obscene.

To not understand that the dynamics of representation are different for majority and minority communities is something to be worked on.

How many majority black congressional districts have white congressmen?  How often do majority black cities like D.C. get a white mayor?  Yeah, when they don't have a choice they vote for the white guy, but often when there is a Black Democrat on the ballot they flock to that candidate in droves in both the primary and the general election.

The "raising the ceiling" argument only goes so far.  Washington, DC has had several black mayors.  Electing one after another is not raising any ceiling, so why do White Democrats never get elected Mayor there?  Is that racially motivated in a racist way?

Yes black people vote as a bloc all the time I think we already established that. Now maybe I am wrong but perhaps the democrats always put up a black candidate and the republicans a white one and perhaps blacks vote 90-10 democrat like usual. As for the primaries it is possible that the most prominent members of the black community in DC would run for mayor considering they are a majority there, and thus would win the primaries and the general after that. I could be wrong of course i do not know much about DC politics. Except for Marion Berry. I dunno maybe there is something special about DC? Anyways you cannot deny Blacks have consistently not only voted for white candidates but have made them their own( i.e Bill). I do not think that has occured in national American politics for a black person till Obama. The closest would be Jesse Jackson but he truly was the black candidate. You are trying to cariciture Obama as that and you are wrong.
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