Obama to hold mass rally for acceptance speech at Mile High Stadium

[Flying Dog]

Wow, it seems that the Republicans are this years Democrats. All they seem to be doing is b!tch and moan about everything.

[Flying Dog]

Honestly, this is ridiculous. Obama wants more people to see his speech and for it to be open to the public = megalomaniac. (btw, hardly a rational "discussion starter")

[Flying Dog]

Waaah!!! My candidate is dull and behind the polls so I'm going to compare yours to Hitler!

Well, the Obama zombie clones have made it obvious that having an open, honest, sincere discussion about their candidate is all but impossible.

Dude are you f***in serious here? Isn't it pretty obvious Obama/his campaign chose the location due to it being a bigger and better spectacle than the Pepsi center? What did he exactly do that was wrong? He did not follow tradition? You seriously do sound like a little cry baby.

20,000 people isn't enough... so we need 120,000... and fireworks, special effects... make it as dramatic as possible so that people are so wowed that they will forget the fact that the speech itself has almost no real content.

Are you trying to parody somebody, or are you just bitter?

[Flying Dog]

Honestly, this is ridiculous. Obama wants more people to see his speech and for it to be open to the public = megalomaniac. (btw, hardly a rational "discussion starter")

SEE WHAT?  Over 80% of the people in the stadium will barely be able to see him.  That's why they invented TV.  They want to hold such a mass rally as a demonstration of force to the people watching at home.  They are holding a huge rally, under the pretense that more people will be able to see it that way, but for the purpose of putting on a more impressive show to the people watching at home, and with the effect of generating mass hysteria for the candidate.

People know they'll barely be able to see him. They come so that they can say "I was at the convention which nominated the first minority as a major party candidate" People like to be part of history. Plus, it would be fun.

[Flying Dog]

I agree. While Obama's personality cult and huge ego annoy the hell out of me, saying he's like the Nazi's is a bit extreme. This latest change by Obama just reinforces that he'll do anything to get elected and he sees himself as wonderful as his supporters do. Speaking to a crowd on the same day as MLK and to a huge crowd, no less, make it look like he's setting himself up to be the heir apparent. Good political move, but grossly arrogant, as we already know Obama is.

The dates for the DNC were chosen before Obama was the nominee

Dipsh*t

You know, asshole, I was trying to keep this discussion respectful and defend Obama for once, but I forgot I was dealing with Democrats.

Will you be attending the Hitler-esque rally or will you be fainting/jacking off to Obama's speech in your bedroom?

Your a hypocrite, thanks.

[Flying Dog]

Whoever started this thread and whoever is continuing the meaning of this thread needs to talk about this with their therapist. Seriously. I am not trying to "censor" you, I just think that this is not what rational adults talk about.

Yeah, ration adults sit around and shout meaningless slogans at the top of their lungs to be just like everyone else around them, while they manage to forget that this is supposed to be an election for President of the United States, not the pep club.

Yup. Bitter.

[Flying Dog]

Whoever started this thread and whoever is continuing the meaning of this thread needs to talk about this with their therapist. Seriously. I am not trying to "censor" you, I just think that this is not what rational adults talk about.

Yeah, ration adults sit around and shout meaningless slogans at the top of their lungs to be just like everyone else around them

We're not talking about Christianity

Hahaha.....funny. Not.

[Flying Dog]

Whoever started this thread and whoever is continuing the meaning of this thread needs to talk about this with their therapist. Seriously. I am not trying to "censor" you, I just think that this is not what rational adults talk about.

Yeah, ration adults sit around and shout meaningless slogans at the top of their lungs to be just like everyone else around them, while they manage to forget that this is supposed to be an election for President of the United States, not the pep club.

Yup. Bitter.

Yeah... I am bitter, because I hate black people, and young people, and popular people.  That's what this is all about.  It has nothing to do with anything other than that... obviously. 

Geez o' man. I was just joking. What's the matter?

[Flying Dog]

Even his kids remind me of the Bush kids.  They act like they have never been told to do anything.

wtf is your problem? Your off your kilter

[Flying Dog]

Whoever started this thread and whoever is continuing the meaning of this thread needs to talk about this with their therapist. Seriously. I am not trying to "censor" you, I just think that this is not what rational adults talk about.

Yeah, ration adults sit around and shout meaningless slogans at the top of their lungs to be just like everyone else around them, while they manage to forget that this is supposed to be an election for President of the United States, not the pep club.

Yup. Bitter.

Yeah... I am bitter, because I hate black people, and young people, and popular people.  That's what this is all about.  It has nothing to do with anything other than that... obviously. 

There's nothing wrong with being upset that Obama is winning, or with opposing him.....now you know how we felt in 2004.

But comparing him to a Nazi is a tad over the top Chris; you must admit.

Please... go back the the begining of the thread and note that I attempted to start by having a serious conversation about Obama's mental state.  Then look at the reaction I received. Herein lies the problem. The topic is so ridiculous that you can't have a serious conversation about such a matter.

I am telling you this right now, I am not bitter.  I have noted many disturbing patterns in Obama's behavior over the last few months.  I don't know why some people are so willing to shrug them off, but I am not.  I'm not crazy.  I'm not bitter.  I'm not joking.  I am being serious.
Exactly the reason people are ridiculing you. Your acting a bit crazy

I don't think most people know why they actually support Obama, except that he is "cool".  Obama reminds me of Bush, as do his avid supporters, albeit younger and "wide eyed".  That disturbs me.  I made a huge mistake by supporting Bush, as did the country.  I don't want to see that repeated by putting in another person who is of the same mind-set as our ing insane current President.I don't think McCains supporters are any more "informed" about their candidate then Obama's are or Hillary's were.

[Flying Dog]

Even his kids remind me of the Bush kids.  They act like they have never been told to do anything.

wtf is your problem? Your off your kilter

They do.  They had a pact that, if their dad won the nomination, the kids get a dog... WTF?  Kids extracting things from their parents.  They also seem to say whatever they want, which might be cute to some people, but I personally find it a little odd that they seem to have no idea that some behavior is a little unacceptable, even for a 10 year old.  Even worse, Obama trouts them out in front of the cameras with impunity, which isn't good for little kids.

I thought it was when the election was over. If he won or not. Good, those kids deserve something after having to be without their dads for long stretches at a time. Seriously, your making something out of nothing. What have they said that is so offense to your ears. THEY'RE 6 AND 10 AND ACT PERFECTLY FINE FOR THEIR AGE. They've only been out infront of the camera a few times and that's on their own choosings.

I can't believe I have to refute this crap. You're losing your mind.

[Flying Dog]

Whoever started this thread and whoever is continuing the meaning of this thread needs to talk about this with their therapist. Seriously. I am not trying to "censor" you, I just think that this is not what rational adults talk about.

Yeah, ration adults sit around and shout meaningless slogans at the top of their lungs to be just like everyone else around them, while they manage to forget that this is supposed to be an election for President of the United States, not the pep club.

Yup. Bitter.

Yeah... I am bitter, because I hate black people, and young people, and popular people.  That's what this is all about.  It has nothing to do with anything other than that... obviously. 

There's nothing wrong with being upset that Obama is winning, or with opposing him.....now you know how we felt in 2004.

But comparing him to a Nazi is a tad over the top Chris; you must admit.

I think that to the extent that the Nazis regarded themselves as elite, it is an apt comparison.
  The   Obama hasn't managed that.  He comes off as elitist.

So Obama=elite + Nazi's=elite = Obama=nazi. This logic makes my head spin.

Plus, the American people seem to disagree with your perceptions of Obama.

Most Americans think Obama shares their values/beliefs.

[Flying Dog]

I thought it was when the election was over. If he won or not. Good, those kids deserve something after having to be without their dads for long stretches at a time.

Actually, that is not psychologically healthy for children at all.   And I'm not sure how it works, but either way it was in exchange for something.  Giving children something as a replacement for a father's absence is, in and of itself, damaging to a child, as it teaches them any number of lessons, none of which are positive.  And the very fact that they thought they could make this demand is telling in and of itself.  That is my point, and by God its a valid one.  I don't care how crazy people think I am for bringing it up.

My Dad was absent a lot on business - a lot. However, when around, we loved him, and admired his personal qualities and character and his three sons wished to emulate him, and largely did. He gave us everything, but it didn't spoil us, because we didn't want to disappoint him. That would have been totally beyond the pale.

In short, it is a bit more complex than you might suggest. The point is, if you really admire a parent for who they are as a person, and know that when the going gets tough, they are there for you, the numbers of hours around becomes less significant. Just my two cents. I suspect Obama over time might be in that category for his kids, although obviously I don't know the interplay with his kids up close and personal.

Yes, I know its complex, which is why I said "any number of things".  Long absences of a father aren't good for children anyway, but giving them something for it, even if its lovable, and cute, and seems like it loves you back, really isn't the way to handle the situation.

How do you know that is the only thing Barack and Michelle are doing/have done. The fact of the matter is that you are in no position to judge their family situation. Sorry...

[Flying Dog]

I was noting a disturbing trend among some of his supporters in this thread. Obama and Paul share one thing in common -- their internet supporters tend to be frothing at the mouse and form into mobs at the slightest provocation. Perhaps late 2008 will be the time flashmob terrorism is introduced to the western mileu as disappointed Obama supporters react to their messiah's loss by going on rampages.

Perhaps you will become relevant sometime in the future. I won't hold my breath, though.

[Flying Dog]

So you're going to deny that Obama is attracting the fanboy types who worship him?

No. Every candidate attracts fanatics. Just look at Hillaryis44.org for a prime example. Most of McCain's supporters aren't as vocal though because their heart monitors will go on the fritz if they get too excited.

[Flying Dog]

So Obama=elite + Nazi's=elite = Obama=nazi. This logic makes my head spin.

Obama = looks like he considers himself better than everyone else, i.e thinks he's elite.  Nazis = looks like they considered themselves better than everyone else, i.e thinks they were elite.  It is not a good image to project.
Most of U.S citizens think they're better then other people (i.e. Middle East habitants)
Doesn't mean you should compare them to Nazi's.
Using that logic: Nazi's are white, Oh my, we must be neo-nazi's!

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Frankly, looking at the primary results, he has had a growing problem connecting with the American people.

The image of being in a stadium, even if perfectly executed, in front of people seemingly mindlessly chanting his name, is not going to evoke a non elitist image.

I'll provide you with the data stating that more Americans think Obama shares their values than McCain if you want.

Plus Hillary and McCain both have crowds that chant their name. This is nothing new or isolated to Obama.

[Flying Dog]

I thought it was when the election was over. If he won or not. Good, those kids deserve something after having to be without their dads for long stretches at a time.

Actually, that is not psychologically healthy for children at all.   And I'm not sure how it works, but either way it was in exchange for something.  Giving children something as a replacement for a father's absence is, in and of itself, damaging to a child, as it teaches them any number of lessons, none of which are positive.  And the very fact that they thought they could make this demand is telling in and of itself.  That is my point, and by God its a valid one.  I don't care how crazy people think I am for bringing it up.

My Dad was absent a lot on business - a lot. However, when around, we loved him, and admired his personal qualities and character and his three sons wished to emulate him, and largely did. He gave us everything, but it didn't spoil us, because we didn't want to disappoint him. That would have been totally beyond the pale.

In short, it is a bit more complex than you might suggest. The point is, if you really admire a parent for who they are as a person, and know that when the going gets tough, they are there for you, the numbers of hours around becomes less significant. Just my two cents. I suspect Obama over time might be in that category for his kids, although obviously I don't know the interplay with his kids up close and personal.

Yes, I know its complex, which is why I said "any number of things".  Long absences of a father aren't good for children anyway, but giving them something for it, even if its lovable, and cute, and seems like it loves you back, really isn't the way to handle the situation.

How do you know that is the only thing Barack and Michelle are doing/have done. The fact of the matter is that you are in no position to judge their family situation. Sorry...

They are both the product of situations where the father was almost completely absent, though being a very successful individual, and where the mother was anything but nurturing.  Bush's mother was totally self-absorbed in her own grief following the death of Robin, while Obama's mother seems to have been quite the thrill-seeker... eitherway, neither of them provided the kind of attention a younger child should have.
How was Obama's mother a thrill-seeker? Examples?

Neither of them could escape being reminded of their father's success... even bearing the father's name.I don't believe that Obama's father was viewed as a "success." Heck, he died in poverty in Nairobi.

  And neither could escape being reminded of the absence of that father.  This has a tendency to foster confused feelings in a child.  Often times, many children will, on the surface, idolize their father to an extreme degree, but if that father is very successful, they could then in turn adopt a subconscious desire to destroy their father (and his "penis") by out-succeeding them.

Have you even read Obama's first book? He harbored public resentment towards his father for abandoning them and not being there for him. Hardly subconscious.
Once again, Obama's father was not "extremely sucessfull as you overly-state. He was a economist for the government who then became a drunk and poor man before he died. 
 

This leads to extreme egotism and megalomania... essentially the child fails to successfully navigate the phallic stage, in otherwords.  Often times, these people adopt an extreme fear of having their own "penis" destroyed, and as such they will resort to anything, lying, grandiose claims, taking on a external appearance of extreme personablity, to avoid being exposed as insecure.   

For his part, Obama seems to acknowledge that he was insecure and emotionally confused, and in that regard, he at least seems to be more introspective than Bush.  That's a good, thing, but Obama resorted to drugs to ignore the pain he felt... now he smokes like a chimney.
I agree. However, he's admitted to having a couple cigarettes during the campaign but he is hardly a regular smoker.
 

Now, it is in no way certain that a person will end up like this, if they have a similar background, and certainly, there are some big differences in those of Bush and Obama, but recently, Obama has shown many of the personality qualities that are most disturbing in Bush, such as his tendency towards making claims about his own abilities and experience that just don't match with the facts, and exaggerating their own potency.  Making implausible denials and trying to change the facts afterwards.  Obama also desperately wants people to view him as one of them and as someone who can be trusted by all and in everything, and this is particularly unseemly given recent events.  Both show a disturbing tendency to "throw people under the bus" when that person becomes in the slightest way inconvenient.
You seem to greatly exaggerate almost every single one of these thiing. Once again, example's please. 

Something that Obama does that Bush doesn't, that can be disturbing, is his tendency to refer to himself in the third person.  It's a sign that someone is trying to distance himself from himself.  Bob Dole started it during the 1996 campaign, because he knew he was adopting policies more conservative than his own beliefs in order to appeal to the base.  And now we get to hear "Obama will bring an end to the war..." coming from Obama.  "Obama won't do this"... "Obama will do that"....
I've only heard him do this once or twice. 

I do have real concerns here, I'm not being crazy or trying to bring down Obama.  And I certainly could be wrong, but I think its worthy of discussion, is all.  Obviously some people would rather mock me that discuss that matter.

All and all, you seem to pull conclusions out of thin air or use small instances as a means to base this "analysis" of Obama on. You also seem to be prone to over-exaggerating every single minute detail into a full on dissertation of Obama's mental state. This is not only irresponsible but completely refutable.

[Flying Dog]

Most of U.S citizens think they're better then other people (i.e. Middle East habitants)
Doesn't mean you should compare them to Nazi's.
Using that logic: Nazi's are white, Oh my, we must be neo-nazi's!

LOL!  You obviously don't have close interactions with Black people.  If there was a group, even liberal, and not in the least racist, that was all White, a Black person would be worried about being lynched (as a friend of mine reminded me that night).

If there was a party that was largely white (but not racist), and the majority population was not white, you'd here calls of them being Nazis.

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If you are referring to the most recent polls, he's still not a known quality.

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It's not a Nuremberg style stadium and Hillary and McCain come off as not being elitist; Obama does.  (Note that I did not say, "is.")

Look at Phila's Mayor Nutter.  A successful stock broker, Ivy League eduction, about 20 years in politics and 15 on city council.  Elite by most standards and arguably a policy wonk.  He was trailing badly in the polls.  What does he start doing? 

Running commercials showing his daughter, showing him taking her to school.  Suddenly he comes across as a regular guy, the boy next door type, a real normal guy.  White people start voting for him and get annoyed when someone calls him "not Black enough."  He wins the nomination and his wife introduces him as "My Boo, my road dawg," in a moment we all found charming and real.  He get's called, by dyed in the wool Republicans (even on this site), as "the real deal."

With Obama we get Nuremberg; with Nutter we got nice.

No, I only live 15 minutes away from a city that is 43% African American.

You state that Obama is a unknown quantity then you state that people view him as elitist. All I'm saying is that most Americans seem to disagree with you that Obama comes off as an elitist. That may be your perception of him, but It definitely isn't with a lot of Americans.

[Flying Dog]

The thing that bothers me the most about Obama is his tendency to disregard his friends and supporters so blatantly when they become inconvenient, specifically because that is so contrary to his public image which he himself so carefully crafts.

Yeah, I have to agree with this. Remember how Obama threw away his first wife away like a piece of garbage after she was in a car accident? She simply wasn't good enough anymore, so he married some rich heiress beauty queen. Typical Obama.

McCain's first wife was a model, jackass.

Ross Perot, who paid for Carol McCain's expensive medical bills while John was in Vietnam said this:
"‘After he came home, Carol walked with a limp. So he threw her over for a poster girl with big money from Arizona. And the rest is history.’"

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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1024927/The-wife-John-McCain-callously-left-behind.html

Carol's wikipedia page covers all this.

I don't bag McCain much because of this, but certainly the guy has some ambition (he told his college roommate he wanted to do something so that he would be remembered in the history books and Carol early on that he wanted to be president).

H. Ross Perot is not a valid source for anything... and I'm not saying that because I am trying to cover McCain's ass... I'm saying it because it is H. Ross Perot.

That being said, as I said, I don't think McCain is perfect.  I respect him, but he has made his share of mistakes.

So you can dismiss source's just like that but use small instances in Obama's life to put together a fully-fledged analysis of his mind-state?

[Flying Dog]

No, I only live 15 minutes away from a city that is 43% African American.

You state that Obama is a unknown quantity then you state that people view him as elitist. All I'm saying is that most Americans seem to disagree with you that Obama comes off as an elitist. That may be your perception of him, but It definitely isn't with a lot of Americans.

15 minutes is a light year, in your case (and frankly the bulk of white people that I know).

The impression that os being created is that of an elitist; it is not a good move in American politics.

Except the fact that I used to work in a 90% black neighborhood and my next door neighbor is black. I get plenty of interaction with the African American Community, thank you very much.

I still don't get how giving a big speech elitist but whatever.

[Flying Dog]

No, I only live 15 minutes away from a city that is 43% African American.

You state that Obama is a unknown quantity then you state that people view him as elitist. All I'm saying is that most Americans seem to disagree with you that Obama comes off as an elitist. That may be your perception of him, but It definitely isn't with a lot of Americans.

15 minutes is a light year, in your case (and frankly the bulk of white people that I know).

The impression that os being created is that of an elitist; it is not a good move in American politics.

Except the fact that I used to work in a 90% black neighborhood and my next door neighbor is black. I get plenty of interaction with the African American Community, thank you very much.

I still don't get how giving a big speech elitist but whatever.

Like I said, a light year.  I had a friend raise it just last night after a visit to Myersdale, PA.  She was expecting to be lynched at the local fast food place.
Whatever, you seem to know more about my life than I but it matters not.

Giving a big speech isn't.  Doing it in a stadium looks like it is elitist.  It plays to chanting crowd of which most people in the US are not part.  It's spectacle, Nurembergesque, but not reaching to the average voter.
That's total bull and you know it. The average voter isn't going to see his acceptance speech and think "Wow, there's a lot of people there. How elitist of Obama to hold his acceptance speech in a stadium!" Listen to how ridiculous your sounding right now.

Obama (and McCain) has to sit down at the kitchen table with the voter.

[Flying Dog]

Giving a big speech isn't.  Doing it in a stadium looks like it is elitist.  It plays to chanting crowd of which most people in the US are not part.  It's spectacle, Nurembergesque, but not reaching to the average voter.

Obama (and McCain) has to sit down at the kitchen table with the voter.

Did you see McCain's cozy speech in New Orleans with a crowd of a few hundred? It diminished him, and not in a good "jus folks" way.

That speech was a wreck... let us never mention it again.

"...and that's not change you can believe in. Hahaha..." (forced smile/confused applause)

[Flying Dog]

No, I only live 15 minutes away from a city that is 43% African American.

You state that Obama is a unknown quantity then you state that people view him as elitist. All I'm saying is that most Americans seem to disagree with you that Obama comes off as an elitist. That may be your perception of him, but It definitely isn't with a lot of Americans.

15 minutes is a light year, in your case (and frankly the bulk of white people that I know).

The impression that os being created is that of an elitist; it is not a good move in American politics.

Except the fact that I used to work in a 90% black neighborhood and my next door neighbor is black. I get plenty of interaction with the African American Community, thank you very much.

I still don't get how giving a big speech elitist but whatever.

Like I said, a light year.  I had a friend raise it just last night after a visit to Myersdale, PA.  She was expecting to be lynched at the local fast food place.
Whatever, you seem to know more about my life than I but it matters not.

No, but I obviously know more about the Black urban community than you do.  You may drive through it, with your doors locked, but I live in it, by choice and I'm part of it.  That might explain why I've been a bit more sympathetic to Obama's membership in Trinity and his support of Faith Based Initiatives.

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Again you missed it.  Obama has to connect with the voter, directly.  Putting in a setting that makes him surrounded by a chanting crowd, even if properly implemented, does not do that.  The problem for Obama is that he doesn't understand that.  One of the most famous (and re-used) lines from any presidential campaign was "A you better off than you were ... ."  It was a direct appeal to the individual.  Nuremberg doesn't do that.

Obama has to connect, but he's failed so far.

Do you follow me around, are you a creeper or somethin'?

I can't believe you don't know how arrogant you are sounding right now. I lived in Saginaw for half my life, moving out when I was 9. I went to a Catholic elementary school that was half AA. Heck, we practically lived almost in the ghetto. (We moved when it got bad.) I've been there when racist cops arrested my friends for wearing their pants to low. I've been there when my neighbor was shot for trying to make the community better. I was there when my former Bishop got robbed in the middle of a parking lot when he was trying to better the lives of the poor. So don't tell me that I don't know what a black urban community is like.

[Flying Dog]

Giving a big speech isn't.  Doing it in a stadium looks like it is elitist.  It plays to chanting crowd of which most people in the US are not part.  It's spectacle, Nurembergesque, but not reaching to the average voter.

Obama (and McCain) has to sit down at the kitchen table with the voter.

Did you see McCain's cozy speech in New Orleans with a crowd of a few hundred? It diminished him, and not in a good "jus folks" way.

That speech was a wreck... let us never mention it again.

"...and that's not change you can believe in. Hahaha..." (forced smile/confused applause)

That line was like an icepick through my temple.

Yeah, it was pretty bad, wasn't it? He's much better in the town-hall style rather than against his nemesis: The Teleprompter.

[Flying Dog]

Do you follow me around, are you a creeper or somethin'?

I can't believe you don't know how arrogant you are sounding right now. I lived in Saginaw for half my life, moving out when I was 9. I went to a Catholic elementary school that was half AA. Heck, we practically lived almost in the ghetto. (We moved when it got bad.) I've been there when racist cops arrested my friends for wearing their pants to low. I've been there when my neighbor was shot for trying to make the community better. I was there when my former Bishop got robbed in the middle of a parking lot when he was trying to better the lives of the poor. So don't tell me that I don't know what a black urban community is like.

I live in North Philadelphia, with a white population of three percent, and I know most of my neighbors, and attend their weddings and family funerals.  My priest is Black, as is 2/3 of my church.  My most recent girlfriend was Black and from the neighborhood (Sissy doesn't count).

Please don't think you understand understand the Black community anymore than Obama understands the those white small town people that he calls "bitter."

Fine. I just don't want you saying I'm a light year away from them and you know them better than I. I don't want to have to play the "I'm more black than you!" game.