Regional Office Holding Rights Amendment (Failed)

[minionofmidas]

Regional Office Holding Rights Amendment

The rights of regions to construct their regional government in the manner in which they choose, within the Republic of Atlasia, shall not be infringed by the Second Constitution of the Republican of Atlasia nor by legislation passed by the Senate of Atlasia.


Sponsor: Meeker

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[DownWithTheLeft]

Just to correct a typo I believe it should be Republic of Atlasia

Anyway, I absolutley love the idea, but I should have an amendment quite soon expanded the power of regions even further.

[minionofmidas]

Just to correct a typo I believe it should be Republic of Atlasia

Good catch. I've read Meeker's text several times and never noticed that.

Proposed as friendly amendment (we need Meeker's consent to change it - if he doesn't get around to it, or if he consents but somebody objects, we'll have to vote on it.)

[DownWithTheLeft]

Just to correct a typo I believe it should be Republic of Atlasia

Good catch. I've read Meeker's text several times and never noticed that.

DWTL cathces typo, now that's news.  Well, I guess I am the expert

Amendment:

Add a second section:
Regional governments shall also not be denied the right to conduct elections in any manner they choose.  Regional elections shall in no way be required to obey federal election laws.

[Torie]

Would this deny the citizens of the  regions the right to a republican form of government in their regions? The breadth of the language is somewhat disturbing.

[minionofmidas]

Aye.

Besides, the Midwest is of the opinion that its current rules are already constitutional, thank you very much.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Would this deny the citizens of the  regions the right to a republican form of government in their regions? The breadth of the language is somewhat disturbing.

Indeed, I must strongly oppose the amendment. I believe one of the key responsibilities of the federal government is to protect the people's rights from being taken away by regional (or any other) government.

And to that end, no right is more precious than that which guarantees a government chosen by, elected by, and responsible to the persons it serves.

[Verily]

I have to agree with Moderate and Torie. If we are to allow the Regions to exist, we must ensure always that they conform to simply standards of republic and rights, which means that, while Regions can have a great deal of flexibility (see the Mideast's assembly), they can't be any government at all.

I simply see no reason why the Constitution needs to be changed other than to make it easier for anti-democratic forces to gain power in a Region.

[DownWithTheLeft]

Aye.

What are we voting on?

[Meeker]

I accept the friendly to correct the typo, my bad.

[minionofmidas]

Aye.

What are we voting on?

Nothing, that was an "oh aye, I agree with you, Torie" sort of "aye".

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I'm not sure about this. On one level I'm instinctively sympathetic to the idea of letting the people of each region (or whatever) run themselves in anyway that they damn well please. And, yet, I can certainly see the argument that there needs to be safeguards to prevent genuinely undemocratic governments taking power at regional level (though perhaps the solution isn't central control; central government crushing a regional government that it has political differences with has certain deeply unfortunate historical associations to me. Maybe the solution here is to make it possible for citizens of the regions to overthrow a despotic government... although that might make coups easier. Maybe make it possible for the people of a given region to overturn the regional constitution or oust the governer (or whatever) on a majority vote or something. In this way, federal government could guarentee democracy (of one form or other) in the regions without the earlier problem. But that's far from perfect).

[minionofmidas]

I accept the friendly to correct the typo, my bad.

Senators have 24 hours to object. Counting from Meeker's post I think, though I would check if necessary.

Vote on Dwtl's amendment will be opened some time tomorrow.

[minionofmidas]

The friendly amendment has been accepted. The vote is on the

Amendment:

Add a second section:
Regional governments shall also not be denied the right to conduct elections in any manner they choose.  Regional elections shall in no way be required to obey federal election laws.

Please vote aye, nay or abstain.


Nay.

[DownWithTheLeft]

Aye

[Sensei]

aye

[Torie]

Nay

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Nay

[minionofmidas]

Current vote count:

Aye 2 (Dwtl, Sensei)
Nay 3 (Lewis, Torie, Al)
abstain (voted) 0
abstain (yet to vote) 5 (Jas, Meeker, Bacon, Culture, Verily)

[Јas]

Aye

[CultureKing]

aye

[Bacon King]

nay

[minionofmidas]

Aye 4 (Dwtl, Sensei, Jas, Culture)
Nay 4 (Lewis, Torie, Al, Bacon)
abstain (voted) 0
abstain (yet to vote) 2 (Meeker, Verily)

[minionofmidas]

The vote times out in under 24 hours.

Current vote count:

Aye 4 (Dwtl, Sensei, Jas, Culture)
Nay 4 (Lewis, Torie, Al, Bacon)
abstain (voted) 0
abstain (yet to vote) 2 (Meeker, Verily)

[minionofmidas]

Voting has timed out. Final vote count:

Aye 4 (Dwtl, Sensei, Jas, Culture)
Nay 4 (Lewis, Torie, Al, Bacon)
abstain (voted) 0
abstain (did not vote) 2 (Meeker, Verily)

The Senators are evenly divided. The Vice President gets to have his way.