CONSTITUTIONAL RATIFICATION (AMENDMENTS) THREAD

[Platypus]

This thread is for debating proposed amendments to the Constitution undergoing Ratification in this thread.

[Platypus]

OK, THE CONSTITUTIONAL RATIFICATION VOTING THREAD IS NOW CLOSED. Thanks to the other participants.

All unanimously supported sections are agreed as accepted at this stage. Those not unanimously accepted include:

NAYS:
1,VI
2,V
2,VI
2,XV
4,*
5,XVI
6,XIII
8,I
8,V

AMENDMENTS:
1,II
1,IV
1,VII
1,VIII
1,IX
2,IV
2,V
2,VI
2,VII
2,IX
2,XIV
2,XV
2,XVI
3,II
3,III
4,V
4,XIV
5,III
5,IV
5,XIV
5,XV
5,XVII
6,VIII
6,XV
6,VII
6,IX
6,XIX
7,II
8,IV

NO VOTE:
1,IV
2,XV

...and so we get to discuss the above, here, and flesh out a constitution!

[Platypus]

View of the Nays:

1,VI: The Parliament of the Republic shall have the authority to determine the qualifications of its members, and may censure or expel any member with due cause and a two-thirds majority.

I support this clause, because someone has to determine the qualifications of parliamentarians, and it's better that its parliament than any other possibility. I could accept needing 2/3 agreement on what the qualifications should be, though.

2,V The Prime Minister shall stay in office until a Measure of No Confidence passed by the Parliament of the Republic takes effect or until a new Prime Minister is appointed by the Parliament of the Republic.

This seems like a perfectly reasonable way of doing this. I'm still in favour of it.

2,VI A Measure of No Confidence passed by the Parliament of the Republic shall not take effect until the Parliament of the Republic elects a new Prime Minister.

This is too open. I'll comment more when I discuss amendments.

2,XV The Speaker may only refuse to execute a law if the Speaker resigns from the post or following a dissolution of the Parliament of the Republic.

This comes down to how powerful the role of speaker should be. I think it should be a parliamentary President, otherwise nobody would accept the role. As far as this actual clause goes, it gives a method for the Speaker to refuse to execute a law but one that has significant consequences in the first case personally, and in the second in a governmental way. Note that the Speaker cannot cause the dissolution, but can use the dissolution (ie, the period between the end of one government and the election of the next) as a 'cause for pause' whilst the public determines its stance on the government and its laws, including this one. The new speaker must then enact it, unless the new parliament withdraws it.

Article 4 in total

I voted Nay, because articles 5 and 6 are designed to replace article 4. To have 4, 5 and 6 is overkill and a waste of space; ergo, I choose to reject the relatively weak article 4 for the more robust articles 5 and 6.

5,XVI The Parliament of the Republic shall pass no law impairing contracts law

Waaay too broad. This should be a law enacted by parliament with lots of specific exceptions. Let's determine things like what 'lawfully entered into' means etc before this becomes part of Antillia's framework.

6,XIII Citizens of Antillia shall have the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for themselves and their families an existence worthy of human dignity, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and supplemented by other means of social protection in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, death of a spouse, old age, or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond their control.

Let's leave this to parliament. Social security is important and I look forward to the debates, but at this stage lets keep it out so that we can have that debate.

8,I To take effect, this document must be ratified by the Antillian Constitutional Convention.

I think this should take effect when the GM says it does. The GM will be presented with the final constitution, of course, and it will be ratified..........eventually.

8,V Amendments shall consist of direct revisions to the text, rather than sections added to the end.

Amendments should be able to take whatever form is appropriate.

[Platypus]

you can propose amendments to any section not yet accepted, mate