GERMAN CHANCELLORS SURVIVOR- winner: Willy BRANDT, over Adenauer !

[big bad fab]

Adenauer.

A weird one, that yin. An old-world 19th century catholic authoritarian whose old-world hatred of Prussian authoriarianism led him to dabble in high treason in the early 20s (Rhenanian Separatism, lol)... and who seized the chance of defeating Prussian authoritarianism that the division of Germany provided. And who therefore, despite all the lip service to "German Unity", set about perpetuating that division.
It was a great success. You have to grant him that. I'm glad it worked out that way. Though the work would of course have remained incomplete without the 68ers. (And though it set the CDU on its incredibly twisted course of condemning and all the same propping up the GDR regime, and collecting the votes of those who condemned it most unreasoningly. A course it still hasn't come off off, and that's not doing Germany any good.)
But that doesn't make the man at all likeable.

You're right in a sense: Brandt completed Adenauer's work, in foreign relations.

But, well, would there have been 68ers without, first, Adenauer ?...

In the East, Dubcek and Palach (take them as symbols of course) weren't able to "complete" the work, who wasn't even begun.

[Lincoln Republican]

Konrad Adenauer

[Associate Justice PiT]

     Scheidemann

[big bad fab]

Sorry for the delay...
The Man of the Republic is out.

ROUND THIRTY-ONE IS OPEN

I vote for Wilhelm Marx, who can be seen as the surprise of our top 3.

[Hash]

Ugh. We're down to good people... let me think this over.

[minionofmidas]

But, well, would there have been 68ers without, first, Adenauer ?...

Ah, who knows. It is quite likely the partition would have happened even without a leading West German politician who actively wanted it (without saying so out loud - that's the part that I'm holding against him). But perhaps not. It's impossible to say with any certainty.
A bloc-free (more or less) united Germany would have likely developped somewhat along the ways of Austria or Finland, one would reckon. Both of which had their major economic development jump, and their major social liberal paradigm shifts, somewhat later than the countries of (North)western Europe. The question is whether such a large and still potentially powerful country as Germany would have been allowed to develop that way.

Obviously, I had my reasons for not voting for Adenauer earlier, but it's time now.

Adenauer again.

[Nhoj]

Wilhelm Marx

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Adenauer

[big bad fab]

But, well, would there have been 68ers without, first, Adenauer ?...

Ah, who knows. It is quite likely the partition would have happened even without a leading West German politician who actively wanted it (without saying so out loud - that's the part that I'm holding against him). But perhaps not. It's impossible to say with any certainty.
A bloc-free (more or less) united Germany would have likely developped somewhat along the ways of Austria or Finland, one would reckon. Both of which had their major economic development jump, and their major social liberal paradigm shifts, somewhat later than the countries of (North)western Europe. The question is whether such a large and still potentially powerful country as Germany would have been allowed to develop that way.

Obviously, I had my reasons for not voting for Adenauer earlier, but it's time now.

Adenauer again.

Finland is one thing (economically dependent from Russia, abuting Russia, not a strategic situation), Austria is another (in case of conventional war, Wien would have been located far too much in the East to be effectively defended. Only some valleys betwen West Germany and Italy would have been taken by Western troops).

But they have one thing in common: they have been able to be neutral because of the US presence in Europe, especially at the heart of Europe: West Germany, Netherlands, Belgium, Italy (mountainous Switzerland is a no-go zone).
And because of Norway, Denmark, Italy inside NATO and Sweden only formally neutral and shadow member of NATO.
Even with Yugoslavia, secret plans existed of possible NATO intervention (with government's approval) in case of Soviet invasion.

Finland and Austria were small countries and acted a bit as de facto "free-riders".

So, a neutral Germany was a dream, as Stalin would have never withdrawn from the eastern part. Only the western half bloc-free and neutral wouldn't have worked.

To go back to my point, it was to say:
a Brandt wouldn't have been possible in Czechoslovakia (in my example).
But, I add that he wouldn't have been possible in Finland, which produced rather a Kekkonen.

A clear Western stance, with US (and French) nuclear umbrella and a strong economy, paved the way for a society that was, afterwards, able to demand evolutions and transformations and to manage itself in a sense.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     Wilhelm Marx.

[Hash]

Marx

[Хahar 🤔]

Adenauer

[minionofmidas]

Finland and Austria were small countries and acted a bit as de facto "free-riders".

Of course.

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Of course.

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This - both parts, actually - is much less clear. Propping up those goddam Germans' economy so they don't embarass you by all running away to the West was an absolute money loser. It was also quite unpopular the whole eastern bloc over - these were the very people who'd waged that murderous war, after all. And getting both sides out of both parts would have benefitted the East far more than the West. Especially as West Germany's impending NATO entry had the Russians running absolutely scared - ever heard of the March 10th, 52 offer? Anticommunists like to forget that the Russians were playing purely a holding game in Europe from as early as 1947, and knew it. They liked to ignore it at the time, too.

Another question is whether the Americans would have permitted it. And whether West Germans would have even wanted it if the choices would have been set squarely before them.
Quite possibly not.

[big bad fab]

Marx is out, but with a small majority.

ROUND THIRTY-TWO IS OPEN

Our big final between Konrad Adenauer and Willy Brandt.

Not really a surprise, but it's quite logical.
I'm a bit sad, as this Survivor is almost over and as I know who is going to win...
But, at least, no weird winner !

Oh, wait, nothing is done before it's done... So, it's up to you for 48 hours !

We keep voting in order to ELIMINATE.

[minionofmidas]

Alright, Adenauer again.

And yes, predictable final.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Adenauer!

[big bad fab]

Some statistics up to now:

Biggest total of votes in the round when eliminated:
Hitler, Scheel: 9

Lowest total of votes in the round when eliminated:
Bismarck, Bethmann-Hollweg: 2

Biggest vote in a round though not being eliminated:
Bauer, Schröder, Schmidt: 4

Biggest total of votes up to elimination:
Schmidt 15
Erhard: 14
Schröder: 13
Merkel: 12

Biggest rate of valid votes:
Hertling: 100% (88,9% with invalid vote included)
(Hitler, Scheel: 90%)

Eliminated with less votes than in his "best" round:
Bauer 3 (vs 4 previously)

Eliminated with only a plurality of votes:
Krosigk: 4 out of 9
Papen: 3 out of 7
Bismarck: 2 out of 5
Bethmann-Hollweg: 2 out of 5
Brüning: 5 out of 11
Kiesinger: 3 out of 7

Eliminated without having received votes in previous rounds:
(Hitler), Goebbels, Krosigk, Papen, Brüning, Kiesinger, Fehrenbach

Biggest delay between first vote and ousting:
Merkel: 2->28
Scheel: 2->21

Biggest delay without any vote:
Adenauer: 1->30

Lowest number of votes up to final:
Brandt: 1
Papen, Bethmann-Hollweg, Kiesinger, Fehrenbach: 3

Biggest turnout: 11
(rounds 2-Goebbels, 16-Brüning, 22-Erhard, 27-Wirth)

Lowest turnout: 5
(rounds 7-Bismarck, 8-Bethmann-Hollweg, 9-Bülow, 12-Luther, 17-Bauer)

[big bad fab]

Willy Brandt

[Middle-aged Europe]

Adenauer... mainly for hackish partisan reasons.

[Hatman 🍁]

eliminate Adenauer

[Nhoj]

Willy brandt

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Adenauer

[CO-OWL]

Adenauer... mainly for hackish partisan reasons.

Herbert Frahm

[Middle-aged Europe]

Adenauer... mainly for hackish partisan reasons.

Herbert Frahm

So what? Willy Brandt is the cooler name anyway.

[Hans-im-Glück]

Adenauer