PredictionsMock2012 Presidential Predictions - thornestorm (G-CA) ResultsPolls
Note: The Google advertisement links below may advocate political positions that this site does not endorse.
Date of Prediction: 2012-08-12 Version:9

Prediction Map
thornestorm MapPrediction Key

Confidence Map
thornestorm MapConfidence Key

Prediction States Won
270 |
538 |
pie
Dem348
 
Rep190
 
Ind0
 
 

Confidence States Won
270 |
538 |
pie
Dem347
 
Rep179
 
Ind0
 
Tos12
 

State Pick-ups

Gain Loss Hold Net Gain
ST CD EV ST CD EV ST CD EV
Dem000-10-11283348-11
Rep+10+11000222179+11
Ind0000000000


Analysis

So now we know it's Romney/Ryan - it's also important to know why this came about. It is mainly a result of the failure of Romney's team to make this a referendum on the state of the economy. They were hoping to emphasize the present situation, and if people were unhappy they should vote for Romney. But Romney's problems with Bain capital and their out-sourcing policies made Romney appear to be the wrong type of change, and this allowed Obama to open-up what appears to be about a 7% lead(excluding ras. and gallup). With his former strategy at a dead-end, he needed to dramatically change the election paradigm.

Romney has done this by choosing Ryan. He has given up any pretense about moderating policies to appeal to the center. He is hoping to maximize his base turnout and perhaps persuade some that entitlement cuts and changes, tax cuts for the wealthy, and increased military spending are the way to stimulate economic growth. Messaging strategy analysis by Democracy Corps indicates that a considerable majority of the American people don't believe or like these policies, and it seems likely that this strategy will cost him far more votes than he gains. As a result, I believe Obama's edge will balloon to about 10%, 54.5 - 44. Interestingly, this may not gain him any more electoral votes than an approximately 7% victory, but it would allow him to win battleground states by a larger margin.


Prediction History
Prediction Graph


Comments History - hide

Version: 10

Obama - 51%
Romney - 47%
Other - 2%

The momentum Romney had after the 1st debate has subsided, and Obama has whatever momentum created after the 3rd debate. Polls are probably not fully picking up the Latino vote, nor fully accounting for the growing cell-phone population. Battleground polling looks very bad for Romney, he is no longer clearly winning any of them. North Carolina is now very close, but Romney probably ekes out a victory. Florida is also very close, but Obama probably wins. Neither really matters because Obama is winning all the rest and thus comfortably wins.

I am now assuming less than 2% margin as toss-up, 2-7% leans, and above 7% as solid.


Version: 9

So now we know it's Romney/Ryan - it's also important to know why this came about. It is mainly a result of the failure of Romney's team to make this a referendum on the state of the economy. They were hoping to emphasize the present situation, and if people were unhappy they should vote for Romney. But Romney's problems with Bain capital and their out-sourcing policies made Romney appear to be the wrong type of change, and this allowed Obama to open-up what appears to be about a 7% lead(excluding ras. and gallup). With his former strategy at a dead-end, he needed to dramatically change the election paradigm.

Romney has done this by choosing Ryan. He has given up any pretense about moderating policies to appeal to the center. He is hoping to maximize his base turnout and perhaps persuade some that entitlement cuts and changes, tax cuts for the wealthy, and increased military spending are the way to stimulate economic growth. Messaging strategy analysis by Democracy Corps indicates that a considerable majority of the American people don't believe or like these policies, and it seems likely that this strategy will cost him far more votes than he gains. As a result, I believe Obama's edge will balloon to about 10%, 54.5 - 44. Interestingly, this may not gain him any more electoral votes than an approximately 7% victory, but it would allow him to win battleground states by a larger margin.


Version: 8

As to where the election stands today, it's over.

The latest Pennsylvania poll showed Obama up by 11. This seemed rather optimistic for Obama, until we found out neither side is advertising there. It's not fatal for Republicans to lose Pennsylvania, but to not even be competing there with more than 3 months to go means they must be down by about 10%. This is about the margin Obama won by in '08, and suggests we would see a similar result across the country. Colorado, Iowa, Ohio, and Virginia would all go Obama's way, and he would comfortably win reelection. North Carolina and Florida would be very close, but irrelevant.

So to win, Romney must substantially change the direction of the campaign. But how? He isn't the most charismatic or likable person in the world. He has no foreign policy experience and his recent world tour was much less than wildly successful, with numerous serious gaffes. He has been running a relentless negative campaign for months, to seemingly very little effect. It seems as if swing voters are saying they know the seriousness of the situation and they want solutions. The main solution he offers is the Ryan plan, but this appears to be very unpopular. Tax cuts for the wealthy, increased military spending, cuts in medicaid, turning medicare into a voucher system, cutting the discretionary part of the budget - these are not things the people want. And since he is running as a "severe conservative", his position on social issues is too extreme for many, including women and latinos. And he has numerous never-ending problems which keep gnawing at his credibility and support. So it's not at all clear where Romney can try to get more votes and close the gap with Obama. Perhaps it comes down to hoping Obama has some terrible missteps in the debates or that the economy dramatically deteriorates.


Version: 7

Obama 53.5% Romney 45%

The economy is and will remain the decisive issue. I am assuming monthly job creation will average in the 150-200k range. Varying much in either direction could dramatically change the election. Romney's strategy appears to be to run a massively negative campaign and talk about how he would be better for the economy. He talks of supporting the Ryan budget plan, which would cut taxes benefiting mainly the wealthy, change Medicare to a voucher program, and would dramatically cut domestic discretionary spending; small wonder Ryan's budget plan, according to Democracy Corps research, polls very poorly. With Romney boxed in by the right and unable to reach out to the center, with the economy continuing its modest recovery, with his huge problem with Latinos and women, and with the fact that Romney is hardly a charismatic campaigner, it is difficult to see how he can win. He needs the U.S. economy to seriously slow or even enter recession to have much of a chance.


Version: 6




Obama 50.5% Santorum 48%

Ladies and gentleman, after watching Santorum's huge win in Kansas, I believe Gingrich's candidacy is dead and the far right of the party has coalesced around the man who will be the eventual nominee. He is about as close to what they want as they are likely to get, and Romney is about as far from that as possible. Santorum has great strength in the midwest and soon to be in the south, and Romney is more or less limited to the northeast, parts of the west, and the west coast. Romney was never what the base wanted, his conversion to conservatism was never really believed, and the revelation that he supported the individual mandate at the federal level in '09 is probably the final straw. Santorum will soon have plenty of money, and after he starts amassing many victories and delegates, even a majority of the super delegates will support him.

This general election prediction is based on the idea that Santorum will greatly motivate his base and turn several per cent of the white vote to the republicans. But the democratic base will also be heavily motivated, and the Latino vote will go even more heavily than usual to Obama. I see this sort of map as a best case scenario for the "southern strategy", and after Santorum loses, the republican party may finally have to bow to changing demographic realities and start tailoring their messaging more to minorities.


Version: 5


Obama vs. Santorum 56-42.5%

Santorum is doing everything he can to win the religious extremist/tea party vote, and he is having some success. He also is popular in Pennsylvania and surrounding states. It is conceivable he could consolidate most of the non-Romney vote and become the nominee. However, the rhetoric that would help him so much in the primaries would be devastating to him in the general, and as his candidacy would excite the republican base it would also mobilize the democratic base. He would do terribly among independents and moderates, handing Obama a very easy win.

But at this point, unless anyone runs out of money, I believe no one can get enough delegates to win and this thing is headed to a contested convention. Romney, Santorum, and Gingrich each has strengths with different sections of the republican electorate, and Ron Paul will continue to get 10-15% of the vote and pile up delegates, so it's very difficult to say with any certainty who will be the eventual nominee.


Version: 4



The Republican scorched-earth primary campaign burns on, destroying both Romney's and Gingrich's chances of winning a
general election. This is an Obama vs Romney map reflecting Gingrich "going nuclear" on Romney and recent revelations about
Romney's tax records. The overseas bank accounts will certainly not help Romney's cause, nor will the behavior of Bain Capital. The fact that he has released only 2 years of tax returns begs the question why won't he release many previous years of returns. His idea of illegal aliens deporting themselves is ridiculous, and his extreme position on illegal immigration makes it unlikely he will even reach McCain's low level of Latino support. And Gingrich's superpac bringing up Romney's association with a company that committed medicare fraud is only beginning to get air time. The primary campaign will continue for months with Romney and Gingrich trying to do maximum damage to each other. The establishment and tea party wings of the Republican party are in open warfare against each other, leaving it questionable if they can ever fully heal. And all of this makes it ever more unlikely Romney can win independents and moderates in a general election campaign. For now, I see the general election as Obama 55% to Romney's 43.5%.


Version: 3



On the basis of Gingrich's huge win in South Carolina, it's time to do an Obama vs. Gingrich map. Gingrich is doing so well because of the red meat he is throwing the conservative base. His taking of extreme conservative stances on issues and his scathing attacks on the media are exactly what they want to hear.

However, this does nothing to address his many ethics flaws, which we can be sure will be told to us over and over by Romney attack ads. If Gingrich can survive and win, he will be a badly wounded general election nominee. And those extreme positions and
super-heated rhetoric he espoused will be poisonous to many moderates and independents. I see Obama winning 55% - 43.5%


Version: 2

More changes in the topsy-turvy Republican race. Cain, for a short time the front runner, is out. Romney, who about a month or 2 ago looked like he was going to run away with the race, is fading. His interview and debate performances have not been good, and neither has his attitude toward even moderately tough questions. His candidacy is wearing poorly with time. In Cain's place we now have Gingrich, but on numerous accounts he seems fatally flawed. His insult of poor people will help during the primary but probably cost him during the general election, if he makes it. So at the moment, given Romney's fading and Gingrich's past and issue positions, I see Obama winning pretty easily with the Republican getting 45-46% of the vote.


Version: 1

With a year to go, some things are becoming a little clearer.
The first is that the 2010 election cycle mentality is clearly over, as the discussion is now about jobs and the economy and not much on debt. Another is that there is at least some clarity about the Republican nomination. Romney is a potent force with about 25% of the electorate, and Cain may be his chief rival. But the Republican nominee may not matter that much. 3 months ago, perhaps Obama was a 50-50 shot at best. But with the focus on the economy and him pushing his jobs package as well as doing small things by executive order to help the people and Republicans not putting forth anything clear and positive, Obama seems to have opened up at least a small lead of 3-6% on Romney, who appears to be the Republicans strongest candidate. In the critical state of Ohio, without which no Republican has won the presidency, Obama leads by 9. In addition, Ohio's anti-union bill supported by Romney was defeated with 61% against. The people of Ohio will not forget this fight and there will be at least some carryover in 2012. Admittedly much can change in a year, but with the people generally wanting government to do more about jobs and the economy and with Republicans ideologically prevented from using the government to intervene much, I see the election playing out pretty much the same as it did in 2008.


Version History


Member Comments
 By: canuck777 (R-NV) 2012-08-12 @ 21:53:56 prediction Map
Indiana and Georgia should be tossups and Missouri should be red.

 By: thornestorm (G-CA) 2012-08-13 @ 22:26:07 prediction Map
Canuck777 - you may be right. Since there is no advertising going on in those states, I figured Romney's lead must be in the 7-10% range, and similarly in Arizona. So even if
several points were knocked off that margin Romney would still win by a small amount. But if Obama does win the popular vote by about 10%, any or all of Indiana, Georgia, Missouri, or Arizona could go Obama's way.

 By: WhyteRain (I-TX) 2012-08-14 @ 09:24:01 prediction Map
LOL -- still ANOTHER prediction of a Democratic wave election that returns Nancy to the Speakers chair!

LOLOLOLOL! If Tea Party views weren't banned at the forum, someone there would be asking if there was a single person here who saw the 2010 wave coming -- and, no, I don't mean after Labor Day; I mean the day DemocratTax was passed in March!

Unreality has a liberal bias!

 By: thornestorm (G-CA) 2012-08-23 @ 03:43:49 prediction Map
WhyteRain - Perhaps a relatively small Democratic wave before, but it is growing by the day. Akin's comments have not only made it likely that McCaskill will win in MO, but has opened up what could be a terrible discussion for Republicans. They were quietly advocating for no abortion even in the case of rape or incest, and Ryan and Romney had signed on to this. It is hard to believe this won't alienate a number of persuadable voters, something they can ill afford to do. It is apparent they think they can no longer win running a conventional campaign on the issues; therefore they have resorted to outright lying. They are lying about Obama cutting $716 billion from Medicare that would go to seniors, they are lying about Obama eliminating the work requirement in welfare, they are lying about "death panels" in Obamacare, etc. From a standpoint of "victory at all costs" they probably have no choice, as Romney has nothing positive in his background to run on, and Ryan's budget plans are polling poorly. Romney's lies backed by nearly unlimited money are unlikely to work as there is too much time before the election, and the scrutiny is so extreme in a presidential election that his lies will be exposed and his money will be of only limited help. But this will be a good test of whether lies + tons of money can win.

 By: WhyteRain (I-TX) 2012-08-23 @ 08:53:23 prediction Map
This will be a good test of whether the most liberal of the main GOP primary candidates can beat a president who presided over the worst economic performance since Hoover.

I'll bet even a Eastern Liberal Establishmenter like Romney can win this one.

What we have in 2012 is a rerun of 1980, except that instead of nominating Reagan, the GOP nominated GHW Bush.

Last Edit: 2012-08-23 @ 08:54:18

 By: dnul222 (D-MN) 2012-08-23 @ 14:57:47 prediction Map
I like the comparison with 1980 and GWBsuh vs Carter....what would that have been...well more southern states for Carter for sure but I feel that GWBush would have still won...however, Obama is no Carter as people generally like hum while Carter was milktoast in that category.

 By: thornestorm (G-CA) 2012-08-24 @ 00:26:51 prediction Map
Since the end of the Bush recession in the middle of '09, about 4.5 million private sector jobs have been created. Part of the reason these numbers aren't better is because Obama inherited the worst economic mess since the Great Depression. Europe, Japan, and India are also going through major problems, a somewhat similar global situation to the '30's.

Romney wasn't the most liberal of the GOP candidates - he ran as a "severe conservative". In a sense it didn't matter who won the GOP primary - all they were doing was auditioning for who would read the conservative script handed to them, just like McCain did. He had to disavow all his previous moderate positions, as has Romney. The GOP has moved so far to the right, Reagan could no longer win the nomination - he would be destroyed for anything remotely moderate in his platform. And even if Reagan was the nominee, he couldn't win with anything close to Romney's platform, in part because of changing racial demographics. The "southern strategy", used so effectively from Nixon thru BushII, may be about done.

Last Edit: 2012-08-24 @ 00:28:41

 By: WhyteRain (I-TX) 2012-08-24 @ 08:45:49 prediction Map
thornstorm, you sound like you've been drinking the Kool-Aid, but go ahead, tell us one major position that Reagan took in 1980 that would would make him unnominateable by the GOP in 2012.

Every four years, the MSM gets the Democrats and Republicans to nominate their most far-Left candidates. In 2004, the Dems nominated their most far-Left senator; in 2008, same thing. In 2008, the GOP nominated it's 5th-most liberal senator. I'd like to write a counterfactual about the 2008 election where the GOP nominates its most conservative senator while the Democrats nominate their 5th-most conservative senator: That would be a race between Jim DeMint (SC) and Evan Bayh (IN).

As far as the "Southern Strategy", you act like the Democrats never had one -- like they never ran simultaneously as segregationists in the South and integrationists in the North. The essence of the GOP's "Southern Strategy" was that they wouldn't call Southerners moral lepers for supporting Democratic Party policies for decades. I well recall the 1970 Texas senate race between Lloyd Bentsen and GHW Bush when the Democrats were BRAGGING to voters how all 20 of THEIR Texas Congressmen voted AGAINST the "Open Housing Act of 1968" while both Bush and the other Texas GOP Congressman voted FOR it.

Last Edit: 2012-08-24 @ 08:52:51

 By: thornestorm (G-CA) 2012-11-30 @ 01:28:12 prediction Map
Ok, I'll tell you one. Ronald Reagan was all in favor of raising taxes, and he did so many times. Also, if he had any intellectual honesty, when asked if he would take $10 in program cuts for every dollar in revenue increases, he would have raised his hand. Notice that during the primary debate when that question was asked, not a single candidate raised his hand, showing how extreme the Republican primary electorate is.
Romney won the nomination by moving to the right of Gingrich and Perry, and I was shocked there was any room there. He had reinvented himself as a "severe conservative" and it worked. But in the general election, it was the path to nowhere.
He was losing badly as the conservative message at the presidential level is now simply a loser. So in the 1st debate he reinvented himself as "moderate Mitt", and it allowed him to close the gap a few points.
But he still lost by about 4% in the popular vote meaning about 5 million votes, and lost huge in the electoral college. As for the Southern Strategy, Romney did terrific with the White vote, winning it 59-39. But minorities were 28% of the electorate and Romney lost them far too badly to win the election. The strategy the Democrats used pre-1968 is irrelevant; it is not what they use now. It is however what the Republicans use, and with the minority chunk of the electorate increasing with every election, the Southern Strategy appears at a dead end.
But given where the majority appears to be on economic/environmental/social policy and where the Republican party is, they simply can't appeal to a majority of the electorate. And if they change their positions on social policy much, they lose far too much of their base. Perhaps the Republican party has no place to go and has to hope for Democrats to screw up things so badly the electorate will turn to Republicans regardless of their issue positions.

 By: dnul222 (D-MN) 2012-12-01 @ 15:01:13 prediction Map
Neither party has been static in how it runs campaigns and what issues they stand for...embracing the civil rights by national democrats cost them the south for a generation but now with the increase in minority voters they have solidified large urban states and are making inroads in southern states like Virginia, FLorida where large numbers of northerners and minorities live, next to fall without changes in national GOP are Georgia and Texas....

But then again many very white states voted Democratic...Vermont, Maine, Iowa and MN all are 85-90 % plus white and based on their own historical ethnicities voted for the Democrats yet again...

change will come and it will be interesting to see how and where it develops...

 By: thornestorm (G-CA) 2012-12-02 @ 23:02:43 prediction Map
Agreed dnul. Beginning in 1968, the Southern Strategy, given the demographic make-up of the country, made the Republicans nearly unbeatable at the presidential level. But now with minorities making up 28% of the electorate and increasing, it may be unworkable. With the % of Whites voting for Democratic presidential candidates stable since 1992 at between 39 and 43%, Republicans seem unlikely to increase their vote total there. That means they must do much more to appeal to minorities, but how and not jeopardize their current coalition is the question. The Republicans have lost 4 of the last 6 presidential elections in electoral landslides and 5 of the last 6 in the popular vote. And since the demographic make-up of the country is changing in favor of the Democrats, it is up to the Republicans to make strategy changes.


User's Predictions

Prediction Score States Percent Total Accuracy Ver #D Rank#Pred
P 2016 President 48/56 29/56 77/112 68.8% pie 1 0 369T678
P 2014 Senate 31/36 20/36 51/72 70.8% pie 1 1 200T382
P 2014 Governor 28/36 14/36 42/72 58.3% pie 2 0 211T300
P 2012 President 56/56 46/56 102/112 91.1% pie 11 0 47T760
P 2010 Senate 35/37 24/37 59/74 79.7% pie 2 0 63T456
P 2008 President 53/56 36/56 89/112 79.5% pie 5 0 247T1,505
Aggregate Predictions 251/277 169/277 420/554 75.8% pie


Alabama Alaska Alaska Alaska Alaska Alaska Alaska Alaska Arizona Arkansas California California California California Colorado Connecticut Connecticut Delaware District of Columbia Florida Georgia Hawaii Hawaii Hawaii Hawaii Hawaii Hawaii Idaho Illinois Indiana Iowa Kansas Kentucky Louisiana Maine Maryland Maryland Maryland Massachusetts Michigan Michigan Minnesota Mississippi Missouri Montana Nebraska Nevada New Hampshire New Jersey New Mexico New York New York North Carolina North Dakota Ohio Oklahoma Oregon Pennsylvania Rhode Island South Carolina South Dakota Tennessee Texas Utah Vermont Virginia Virginia Washington Washington Washington West Virginia Wisconsin Wisconsin Wyoming

Back to 2012 Presidential Prediction Home - Predictions Home


Terms of Use - DCMA Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

© Dave Leip's Atlas of U.S. Elections, LLC 2019 All Rights Reserved