The Next DNC Chair: TOM PEREZ WINS, makes Ellison deputy chair

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Tom Perez finally accepted an interview from TYT Politics and he pretty much failed and showed his true colors. Especially at the end.

https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=g81xG3e0oYI

The witchhunt against Tom Perez is quite disgusting. "Who in the Bernie Sanders world is supporting you?" Who f**king cares? The party does not revolve around a guy who's not even in said party.

Isn't that an important question, though? You have millions of people who voted for Sanders in the primary that want to feel like their interests are being represented in the Democratic party, and it makes sense that the DNC chair, as the spokesman of the party, should be able to represent not only the establishment in a way, but to this now-powerful voting block within the party.

This is why it's so maddening why Perez is running: he's not some Third Way sycophant. He's actually got a decently progressive record. But it's so obviously clear that he's been pushed into this race by the Obama administration to have some influence on the party agenda going forward. Perez is only in because of Clintonites not wanting a "Berniecrat" in charge of the show, which is literally the only actual reason people have to oppose him, and support Perez. There's no good reason for him to be in this race at all, except for him acting as an agent of fundamentally rejecting change.

(Actually, it's mind-boggling why Perez isn't running for Maryland Governor in 2018 instead of this race. That's way more important on a practical strategic level than running for a bureaucratic position like DNC chair.)

By that logic, why doesn't Ellison run for Minnesota Governor rather than DNC Chair?

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

By that logic, why doesn't Ellison run for Minnesota Governor rather than DNC Chair?

Because Perez could actually make a Likely R race with Larry Hogan actually competitive. Not to mention Ellison has maximized turnout in his majority-white district since being elected, which is something that fits the qualities of an effective DNC chair, whereas Perez is a policy-wonk that could do better in a public office.

Plus, there's already several strong options for Democrats in Minnesota, whereas the field's much more open for someone like Perez to jump in and defeat Hogan. Strategically, it makes much more sense for Ellison to lead the DNC (his seat is safe D regardless) and for Perez to run for Maryland Governor than the opposite.

There are much stronger gubernatorial candidates than Perez if Democrats choose not to give Hogan a pass.  And of course, there's the fact that there is still no reason to think Ellison would make a good DNC Chair or even that Perez would be a bad one.  All I see is people trying to get a symbolic "victory" by re-ligating stuff from the 2016 primaries that is really pretty irrelevant at this point (and I say that as someone who both voted for and donated to Sanders during the primaries).

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

x-posting: Turning a contest between two fairly mainstream liberal progressives into some kind of proxy war still seems like one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.

This

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Lol no one had to "come up with" the idiotic Bernie Bro stereotype. Just go read twitter or Reddit for a few minutes.

I see you still support Trump and are working hard for his re-election.

Uh, no, I voted for Clinton to stop Trump. You threw a tantrum and voted for Kremlin-puppet Jill Stein.

You only voted for her to stop Trump? So she wasn't good enough for you otherwise?

Did I write that I only voted for her to stop Trump? No. Learn to read properly if you're going to respond to my posts.

No but that's exactly the kind of comments that a lot of sexist leftists make so I was just making sure.

Well, I voted for her in the primary, gave her money and volunteered for her campaign. I was very proud to vote her for twice. Sorry for being snippy.

Nah I'm sorry because I was honestly just messing around from the beginning. I'm trying to reign in my trolling habits online but sometimes it's too tempting.

If you were really trolling, you wouldn't have stopped in the first place

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Just came to post this.

At first I thought Ellison would win hands down; but looks like Perez has it sealed. (feel free to quote this next week) As always internal elections are actually more interesting to see who's backing who- Dean/Rendell backing Buttigieg for example

If Perez wins this, I'll be genuinely infuriated. I will never register as a Democrat if their administration continues with these stupid games.

If you guys (stuanch Ellison supporters) want to be treated like grown ups, you're gonna have to start acting the part.  You're so emotionally invested in a largely meaningless race between very similar candidates that you're threatening to throw a pointless temper-tantrum if your generic progressive Democrat loses to another generic progressive Democrat.  Parties don't change overnight and change comes from the bottom up (we're already seeing some early signs).  I don't mean to single you out, Arch.  You're generally a decent enough poster, but posts like the one you just made give Berniecrats a bad name.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Just came to post this.

At first I thought Ellison would win hands down; but looks like Perez has it sealed. (feel free to quote this next week) As always internal elections are actually more interesting to see who's backing who- Dean/Rendell backing Buttigieg for example

If Perez wins this, I'll be genuinely infuriated. I will never register as a Democrat if their administration continues with these stupid games.

If you guys (stuanch Ellison supporters) want to be treated like grown ups, you're gonna have to start acting the part.  You're so emotionally invested in a largely meaningless race between very similar candidates that you're threatening to throw a pointless temper-tantrum if your generic progressive Democrat loses to another generic progressive Democrat.  Parties don't change overnight and change comes from the bottom up (we're already seeing some early signs).  I don't mean to single you out, Arch.  You're generally a decent enough poster, but posts like the one you just made give Berniecrats a bad name.

Parties don't change overnight, but they also don't change by playing nice.

I view Ellison v Perez as how willing the Establishment is to play ball. This isn't about policies (with the exception of shilling for TPP out of loyalty to Pres. Obama, Perez is Okay) it's purely factional.

If Ellison loses, it means that we're going to have to end the Democratic careers of the other side if we ever want the Democratic Party to succeed.

I want to see the Sanders-wing prevail too; I consider myself part of it  However, the path to victory is taking over state parties and running strong progressive candidates in local/city races in places like Boston, Cleveland, Chicago, NYC, etc, etc.  The city machines need to be taken away from the third way hacks and corporate shills first.  Until we do that, we're getting waaaaay ahead of ourselves.  Sometimes it is okay to compromise too and Perez really is a lot better than a McAulliffe-type or a DWS-level idiot.  Would Dean or Buttigieg be better?  Sure.  Alas, you can't always get what you want

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Just came to post this.

At first I thought Ellison would win hands down; but looks like Perez has it sealed. (feel free to quote this next week) As always internal elections are actually more interesting to see who's backing who- Dean/Rendell backing Buttigieg for example

If Perez wins this, I'll be genuinely infuriated. I will never register as a Democrat if their administration continues with these stupid games.

If you guys (stuanch Ellison supporters) want to be treated like grown ups, you're gonna have to start acting the part.  You're so emotionally invested in a largely meaningless race between very similar candidates that you're threatening to throw a pointless temper-tantrum if your generic progressive Democrat loses to another generic progressive Democrat.  Parties don't change overnight and change comes from the bottom up (we're already seeing some early signs).  I don't mean to single you out, Arch.  You're generally a decent enough poster, but posts like the one you just made give Berniecrats a bad name.

Parties don't change overnight, but they also don't change by playing nice.

I view Ellison v Perez as how willing the Establishment is to play ball. This isn't about policies (with the exception of shilling for TPP out of loyalty to Pres. Obama, Perez is Okay) it's purely factional.

If Ellison loses, it means that we're going to have to end the Democratic careers of the other side if we ever want the Democratic Party to succeed.

I want to see the Sanders-wing prevail too; I consider myself part of it  However, the path to victory is taking over state parties and running strong progressive candidates in local/city races in places like Boston, Cleveland, Chicago, NYC, etc, etc.  The city machines need to be taken away from the third way hacks and corporate shills first.  Until we do that, we're getting waaaaay ahead of ourselves.  Sometimes it is okay to compromise too and Perez really is a lot better than a McAulliffe-type or a DWS-level idiot.  Would Dean or Buttigieg be better?  Sure.  Alas, you can't always get what you want

The thing is that Perez ran specifically because the consulting firms that are the main recipients of donations to the DNC, don't want to lose their access to all that money.  As someone else said earlier, Perez will make sure all the money will remain in the Washington bubble and the Nebraska or the Utah Democratic party will remain broke and unable to compete with Republicans (because who cares about winning elections, right?).  Electing Perez, a guy who pretty much is responsible for slandering a beloved figure on the left like Bernie Sanders during the primaries, and has shown no intention of making the party more inclusive, is like shooting yourself in the head.  But the DNC members who will vote for him don't give a sh*t as long as they have access to power.
If there's something that's bothering Berniecrats is the corruption in the Democratic Party, and I don't understand why some people who are not on our side don't see this.  Maybe they're getting paid by Brock?  Who knows...

Actually.... Perez was in Utah a couple of days ago and specifically said he'd send more money and would fund campaign training for Utah Democrats. And he specifically covered gerrymandering in an interview as well.

I hope you're not so naive to believe that.  Unless of course you haven't been paying attention to how the party has operated under the leadership of Obama and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz.

Umm...Obama and DWS hated each other.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

I really love all the damn bern bros bitching in the thread that they aren't going to vote Dem if they don't get what they want.  You want to know who is out of touch and who is being a brat, look in the mirror.

Yeah, this thread is getting stupid.

Dismiss "Bernie bros" at your own peril Democrats. It appears that you've learned nothing from 2016.

Man you really are acting like a child. Go out like we are and fight the real enemy instead of being some bitter petty asshole all the time. It does nothing for you but bring you pain and dissatisfaction. 

Way to make stupid assumptions about my character.

After Bernie lost, I went out volunteered a ton of my time to help campaign for Hillary Clinton during the general. I'm active within my local Democratic Party, and campaign for local Democrats in my area. I'm doing my part.

It's you and the rest of the DNC who needs to wake up and take a look in the mirror, because what you've been doing clearly hasn't been working. Democratic U.S. Senate seats have fallen from 55 to 46. Our share of the House has plummeted from 256 seats to 194. Republicans still control both chambers. We've lost 958 state legislative seats. Democratic governerships have slipped from 28 to 16. We're losing, and it's not because of "Bernie bros."

JFC.

Yet instead of trying to fix these things you want to take your ball and go sit in the damn corner.

Don't know how you got that from my post.

I'm about as involved in the Democratic Party as someone my age can get, and yet you think I'm taking my ball and sitting in the damn corner. LOL

Honestly there's no way you can reason with spoiled children like JerryArkansas or Lief.

We're not the ones threatening to leave the party because we don't get our way. That's you guys. Love the projection though. Haven't seen it in a while.

You want to dismiss the Sanders wing as "children who don't know what's good for them", then you pay the price. Considering the leaks that occurred on day 1 of the DNC, I'd say they've given way too many chances.

VP pick: Hillary could've picked Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren, Mark Dayton, Pete Shumlin, Keith Ellison or someone else. No, she picked Tim Kaine

Campaign: Bernie supporters in Wisconsin cry out "Come to Wisconsin or you'll lose it!". She ignores them, assuming it's on lock. She loses Wisconsin.

DNC chair: Bernie supporters rally around Ellison. You say it's ceremonial, so let him have it. Instead, you push Perez in a last ditch effort to maintain the influence of the Third Way centrists.

They would be perfectly within their right to say "get lost", but now their Justice Democrats movement is gaining traction. Some still believe they can change things from within . . . don't piss away that last ounce of goodwill they have.

This is why no one takes you guys seriously

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

I really love all the damn bern bros bitching in the thread that they aren't going to vote Dem if they don't get what they want.  You want to know who is out of touch and who is being a brat, look in the mirror.

Yeah, this thread is getting stupid.

Dismiss "Bernie bros" at your own peril Democrats. It appears that you've learned nothing from 2016.

Man you really are acting like a child. Go out like we are and fight the real enemy instead of being some bitter petty asshole all the time. It does nothing for you but bring you pain and dissatisfaction. 

Way to make stupid assumptions about my character.

After Bernie lost, I went out volunteered a ton of my time to help campaign for Hillary Clinton during the general. I'm active within my local Democratic Party, and campaign for local Democrats in my area. I'm doing my part.

It's you and the rest of the DNC who needs to wake up and take a look in the mirror, because what you've been doing clearly hasn't been working. Democratic U.S. Senate seats have fallen from 55 to 46. Our share of the House has plummeted from 256 seats to 194. Republicans still control both chambers. We've lost 958 state legislative seats. Democratic governerships have slipped from 28 to 16. We're losing, and it's not because of "Bernie bros."

JFC.

Yet instead of trying to fix these things you want to take your ball and go sit in the damn corner.

Don't know how you got that from my post.

I'm about as involved in the Democratic Party as someone my age can get, and yet you think I'm taking my ball and sitting in the damn corner. LOL

Honestly there's no way you can reason with spoiled children like JerryArkansas or Lief.

We're not the ones threatening to leave the party because we don't get our way. That's you guys. Love the projection though. Haven't seen it in a while.

You want to dismiss the Sanders wing as "children who don't know what's good for them", then you pay the price. Considering the leaks that occurred on day 1 of the DNC, I'd say they've given way too many chances.

VP pick: Hillary could've picked Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren, Mark Dayton, Pete Shumlin, Keith Ellison or someone else. No, she picked Tim Kaine

Campaign: Bernie supporters in Wisconsin cry out "Come to Wisconsin or you'll lose it!". She ignores them, assuming it's on lock. She loses Wisconsin.

DNC chair: Bernie supporters rally around Ellison. You say it's ceremonial, so let him have it. Instead, you push Perez in a last ditch effort to maintain the influence of the Third Way centrists.

They would be perfectly within their right to say "get lost", but now their Justice Democrats movement is gaining traction. Some still believe they can change things from within . . . don't piss away that last ounce of goodwill they have.

This is why no one takes you guys seriously

I pointed out legitimate arguments, yet you dismiss them.

This is why no-one takes the Third Way seriously anymore. As soon as someone suggests something slightly left-wing, they get shouted down for being too idealistic.

Err...I voted for, canvassed for, and donated to Sanders in the primary...

Anyway, I was referring to your childish threat to throw a temper-tantrum like some spoiled brat if your guy loses.  You don't see Perez supporters threatening to leave the party if Ellison wins.  And Jerry's absolutely right about why the Democrats shouldn't just let Ellison have the Chairmanship without a fight, adults don't submit to the demands of whining children.  And another thing, if you think Perez is a third way corporate shill, you pretty clearly have no idea what you're talking about.  I'm not saying Perez is perfect, but he's not from the Clinton-wing (neither is Obama, btw).

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This is like the primary all over again.

This is gonna last until the Bernie wing eventually takes over the Party. It's gonna be a long 4-12 years.

They will eventually. But this kind of "dialogue" is toxic.

How bad is this compared to the Tea Party vs the establishment pubs back in 2009?

Good point

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

Can we all just start fresh and try to make this a civil, substantive, and respectful debate about who would do the best job as DNC Chair?  I think everyone (myself included) got a little too riled up.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/835610917568200705

i like perez more each second.

Please don't tell me you guys are actually stupid enough to be successfully trolled by Donald Trump.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Please don't tell me you guys are actually stupid enough to be successfully trolled by Donald Trump.

trump has no clue who ellison or perez are and would have written the same anyway.

Obviously, I mean I'm sure someone is going to take that tweet as proof Perez is a closet Republican or something.  *sigh*

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Still can't believe how outraged our True Leftist (is that better?) friends are hyperventilating over this.

You really think you can have us behave like sheep and vote for a party that is our enemy? Good luck without us.

Honestly, the Democratic Party is better off without you.  Not without Berniecrats, they are and will remain a major part of the coalition. But they're certainly better off without you specifically.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Still can't believe how outraged our True Leftist (is that better?) friends are hyperventilating over this.

You really think you can have us behave like sheep and vote for a party that is our enemy? Good luck without us.

Honestly, the Democratic Party is better off without you.  Not without Berniecrats, they are and will remain a major part of the coalition. But they're certainly better off without you specifically.

Classy.

Honest.  Anyway, why do you care?  I thought you're not a Democrat anymore.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Still can't believe how outraged our True Leftist (is that better?) friends are hyperventilating over this.

You really think you can have us behave like sheep and vote for a party that is our enemy? Good luck without us.

Honestly, the Democratic Party is better off without you.  Not without Berniecrats, they are and will remain a major part of the coalition. But they're certainly better off without you specifically.

I've actually been thinking that about him for months, but you probably think that about me as well.

I don't think that about you, even if I find you to be a bit annoying at times.  Jfern didn't bother me much until this thread, but he's just snapped and now I find myself wondering if he was always like this or what.