Impeachment Megathread Part 3

[AtorBoltox]

SO has Gardner just given up all intention of being re-elected?

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Sigh, finally, its over😎😎😎

[Calthrina950]

The most saddening thing in all this, for me, is the continued erosion of congressional power, to the point where the presidency now guarantees a blank check on all illegal actions, exactly what impeachment was designed to protect against. I'm not going to watch the Senators fumbling to save face on Monday, they've said all they need to.

It's the inevitable end result of a system that didn't hold:

1) Nixon accountable for Watergate
2) Ford for pardoning Nixon
3) Reagan for Iran Contra
4) HW Bush for his role in Iran Contra and pardoning those who perpetrated it
5) Dubya for lying about Iraq

It's no coincidence we are where were at now

Most historians long ago concluded that Ford's decision to pardon Nixon was the correct one, even though it was deeply unpopular at the time and contributed to his defeat in 1976.  It spared the country even more agony from Watergate. Even Ted Kennedy later praised Ford for his move, as can be read here: https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2009/08/sen_ted_kennedy_crossed_politi.html.

Well yeah, they have no say that. American history is one long BS story in which everything always has to work out for the better even when it doesnt.

Also, keep in mind....most history is wrong and made up. Just because a big brain historian with a bunch of degrees writes a historical narrative doesnt make it true.

I understand that, but I certainly believe that Ford made the right call, and avoided the agonies which would have come with such a trial. But I will agree that Reagan and the elder Bush got off scotch-free from Iran-Contra, which was certainly a scandal worthy of impeachment.

[Pericles]

The most saddening thing in all this, for me, is the continued erosion of congressional power, to the point where the presidency now guarantees a blank check on all illegal actions, exactly what impeachment was designed to protect against. I'm not going to watch the Senators fumbling to save face on Monday, they've said all they need to.

It's the inevitable end result of a system that didn't hold:

1) Nixon accountable for Watergate
2) Ford for pardoning Nixon
3) Reagan for Iran Contra
4) HW Bush for his role in Iran Contra and pardoning those who perpetrated it
5) Dubya for lying about Iraq

It's no coincidence we are where were at now

Most historians long ago concluded that Ford's decision to pardon Nixon was the correct one, even though it was deeply unpopular at the time and contributed to his defeat in 1976.  It spared the country even more agony from Watergate. Even Ted Kennedy later praised Ford for his move, as can be read here: https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2009/08/sen_ted_kennedy_crossed_politi.html.

The Washington establishment circlejerk got that wrong and this is yet another mistake they are now paying the price for.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Now, Pelosi has to run on a record, absent impeachment, what little she has done the remaining 6 mnths.

Trump did commit crimes, but she risked it all and she isnt gonna be fundraising off impeachment anymore

[junior chįmp]

The most saddening thing in all this, for me, is the continued erosion of congressional power, to the point where the presidency now guarantees a blank check on all illegal actions, exactly what impeachment was designed to protect against. I'm not going to watch the Senators fumbling to save face on Monday, they've said all they need to.

It's the inevitable end result of a system that didn't hold:

1) Nixon accountable for Watergate
2) Ford for pardoning Nixon
3) Reagan for Iran Contra
4) HW Bush for his role in Iran Contra and pardoning those who perpetrated it
5) Dubya for lying about Iraq

It's no coincidence we are where were at now

Most historians long ago concluded that Ford's decision to pardon Nixon was the correct one, even though it was deeply unpopular at the time and contributed to his defeat in 1976.  It spared the country even more agony from Watergate. Even Ted Kennedy later praised Ford for his move, as can be read here: https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2009/08/sen_ted_kennedy_crossed_politi.html.

Well yeah, they have no say that. American history is one long BS story in which everything always has to work out for the better even when it doesnt.

Also, keep in mind....most history is wrong and made up. Just because a big brain historian with a bunch of degrees writes a historical narrative doesnt make it true.

I understand that, but I certainly believe that Ford made the right call, and avoided the agonies which would have come with such a trial. But I will agree that Reagan and the elder Bush got off scotch-free from Iran-Contra, which was certainly a scandal worthy of impeachment.

Like I said.....in this country....we have to rationalize powerful people getting away with massive criminal behavior on a regular basis because of the cognitive basis caused by being told all the time we live in a country of laws and justice for all. Yeah....the laws only apply to the poor and middle class and nobody else. Ford pardoned Nixon to try and stem GOP losses down ballot and that's it.

[Calthrina950]

America is weeping at this vote.

Most of America doesn't care and doesn't even know what impeachment is.

It's actually a pretty popular topic.

Impeachment is such a popular topic that the soap operas usually get 2x higher TV ratings than the trial when shown on the broadcast networks in the afternoon. It's such a popular topic that a Democratic focus group took 80 minutes to even mention the topic, and when they did they dismissed it as partisan nonsense.

Only hyper-partisans care about impeachment.

Are you referring to the focus group on CBS, that was moderated by Frank Luntz? It was an all-female focus group, and every woman at that table, from what I've heard, both Democrats and Republicans, predicted that Trump would win reelection.

No. I'm refering to a Democratic focus group in Chicago run by David Axelrod:

"Because impeachment didn’t come up, no one volunteered it, for 80 minutes into the focus group, and we’re right in the middle of the trial."


"When it came up, they said, you know, it's terrible what he did, the case has been proven, but we know how it's going to turn out," Axelrod continued. "So we're not really that interested, we're ready to move on."

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/479876-cnns-axelrod-says-impeachment-didnt-come-up-until-80-minutes-into-focus-group

My mistake. This is another focus group that I didn't hear about. But nevertheless, both focus groups seem to provide the basis for the same narrative: that impeachment will not have as significant an impact an election as many on here believe. I'm personally of the belief that both bases will be energized by it. Trump's supporters have considered it to be a "witch hunt", and will be motivated to come out to support him on that basis. And the Democratic base, like those on here, will be motivated to come out, so as to defeat him for reelection. And of course, it's true that many Americans do not care about impeachment, or believe that it was a waste of time, due to the foregone conclusion of it which could be anticipated by all.

[Virginiá]

Last I checked, there is a Presidential election this year. That's how any President should be held accountable.

Oh, right. Just let politicians run hog wild in office for 4 years, accountable only to arguably the most polarized electorate in many generations. Republican voters will surely think long and hard and deliberate amongst themselves about voting to reelect a president mired in scandal one week after another.

The only bipartisan consensus here will be to acquit President Trump of these trumped up impeachment charges that should have never been brought in the first place.

Of course. Trump can do no wrong in the eyes of Republicans. He's simply a real American saying what he thinks. If we all followed the lead of Republicans from day one, there would be no investigations into anything. You wouldn't even know if he was guilty of criminal acts or not, because the only answer is everything negative about Trump is fake news, and there is no need to investigate or conduct any oversight whatsoever.

[GeneralMacArthur]

So now that we as a country have decided that this is perfectly legal and OK, is Trump free to continue cheating?  Can he now resume withholding the aid until Zelensky goes on CNN and announces an investigation?

I guess it's looking likely that Sanders could be the nominee so Trump will have to come up with some foreign interference scheme against him as well.  Maybe he offers to recognize Crimea as Russian territory in exchange for Fancy Bear hacking his wife's personal e-mail?  All in the national interest of course.

[Dr Oz Lost Party!]

Now, Pelosi has to run on a record, absent impeachment, what little she has done the remaining 6 mnths.

Trump did commit crimes, but she risked it all and she isnt gonna be fundraising off impeachment anymore

She passed 400 bills the Senate wouldn't even bring to a vote. For the love of god, shut up.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Now, Pelosi has to run on a record, absent impeachment, what little she has done the remaining 6 mnths.

Trump did commit crimes, but she risked it all and she isnt gonna be fundraising off impeachment anymore

She passed 400 bills the Senate wouldn't even bring to a vote. For the love of god, shut up.

Honestly it's better for Pelosi now.  The base has been screaming at her to impeach Trump ever since she took the gavel, and it was drowning all the media coverage of her.  Maybe now that the impeachment is over they'll shut up and we can focus on what's really important, passing legislation and presenting a cohesive agenda to America.

Ah, who am I kidding.  Starting Thursday we're gonna have shadily-funded activists camped out in Pelosi's office day and night demanding she put the Green New Deal up for a vote, or whatever new embarrassing piece of wedge-islation the far-left comes up with.

[Meclazine for Israel]

So now that we as a country have decided that this is perfectly legal and OK, is Trump free to continue cheating? 

You better believe it.

[American2020]

https://twitter.com/HamillHimself/status/1223395758893723648

[ugabug]

This could have been the perfect opportunity for the Republican Party to quickly and constitutionally remove the albatross around their party's neck, and replace it with a new president who arguably better represents everything they (used to) stand for and stands a better chance of winning in November.  Oops!

I don't necessarily agree with the bold part. Pence is an ideal old-school fusionist Republican on paper but I doubt he could harness the atavistic Yeatsian energies that (barely) propelled Trump into office.

And i doubt Pence would get the foreign help that Trump will likely get.

[politicallefty]

I've thought for awhile that the House needed to and needs to keep holding hearings on this. The Senate is useless right now. The Bolton subpoena vote is all we needed to see to prove that. It functions as nothing other than an arm of the White House. If the Senate failed to act as it has done, the House can still act through its investigative powers. I think the House should have acted after the Senate turned down every rules amendment at the beginning of the so-called trial. That said, once again, the House has full power to investigate as it sees fit.

[Vaccinated Russian Bear]

Sigh, finally, its over😎😎😎

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Pelosi needs to pass legislation right now and talk about helping people, what little she has done since the Dems took over the House..

That's why Trump is improving in the polls against Dens over a do nothing House . Dems arent assured anything, if they nominate a Ukrainianan Biden and a do nothing Pelosi, they can lose

[Inmate Trump]

No witnesses = the end of checks and balances. The presidency is now an office with no restrictions.

Republicans have also now and forever forfeited any claim to morality and integrity they have ever had. Not just elected Republicans either.

This disgrace must never be forgotten. Republicans must be made to own this.

[Joe Republic]

No witnesses = the end of checks and balances. The presidency is now an office with no restrictions.

Republicans have also now and forever forfeited any claim to morality and integrity they have ever had. Not just elected Republicans either.

This disgrace must never be forgotten. Republicans must be made to own this.

Meh, six years after Watergate it was like nothing ever happened.  This country really doesn’t mind its authoritarian corruption.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Let's all remember what happened during Lewinsky,  Schumer, Wellstone, Torricelli, Kennedy, Harkin told Daschle to not call live witnesses in the Lewinsky trial

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

No witnesses = the end of checks and balances. The presidency is now an office with no restrictions.

Republicans have also now and forever forfeited any claim to morality and integrity they have ever had. Not just elected Republicans either.

This disgrace must never be forgotten. Republicans must be made to own this.

They're wallowing in it.

https://twitter.com/katierogers/status/1223366576566566912

[Hindsight was 2020]

No witnesses = the end of checks and balances. The presidency is now an office with no restrictions.

Republicans have also now and forever forfeited any claim to morality and integrity they have ever had. Not just elected Republicans either.

This disgrace must never be forgotten. Republicans must be made to own this.

They're wallowing in it.

https://twitter.com/katierogers/status/1223366576566566912

What a morally deprived party. Though when your base is nothing but internet trolls and morons who couldn’t get a college degree I guess that’s the end result

[Vaccinated Russian Bear]

https://twitter.com/RiegerReport/status/1223439236461924361

Revealing!

[pppolitics]

https://twitter.com/RiegerReport/status/1223439236461924361

Revealing!

Do you mean this Lindsey Graham?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlh8Coth8to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvz4qgCdcUc

[OSR stands with Israel]

I was talking to my dad about this and he said you never were gonna get a fair impeachment trial when so much of the country still supports Trump . He said Nixon only went cause his approvals were in the 20s and dropping by the day .

Then he said it might not be the brave decision to do , or honorable but then he said it’s true in real life too when he said most people in general will not choose to uphold their principles over their careers and he said so of course the vast majority of politicians will be like that cause that’s how people are in general .

He said that’s unfortunate but that’s the way how the world works and he said the only way to get more honorable politicians is for polarization to reduce back to where it was till the early 90s. He said as long as you have almost 90% of voters who vote the same way in every federal election no matter what then nothing will change .


He basically said we the people deserve most of the blame for our politics today not the politicians and he said until we recognize that , things will only get worse



I pretty much agree 100%